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I can point you to hundreds of posts where they have "gotten off topic" from gluten. This happens to just one of them. I can't count the amount of times the last post in a 3 page thread has had NOTHING to do with the main topic, or even venture off course a bit. Nothing in this thread is any different. It just happens to be about God. I found it to be a very intriguing thread, and in no way a nuisance on here.
After two years as an advanced community member on this board, I will be canceling my account. I can no longer be a part of a group that only enforces moderation of religion.I will be posting my goodbye to all in one last thread, then I will delete my account in several days, after all have had a chance to read it.
Purple ,,,,,I STAND CORRECTED!!!!!!!! The term communion IS in the bible, I did not select all versions on my search! But I did find some very interesting things. Out of the 19 versions of the bible that I found...4 use the term communion, 15 use blessing or thanks, in the scripture you referenced.
Here they are
I Corinthians 10:16
message version-the cup of blessing
NASB-cup of blessing
contemporary english version-blessing
New century version-blessing
young's literal translation-blessing
holman christian standard-blessing
The greek puts it like this
I cointhians 10:16
to pothrion thV eulogiaV o eulogoumen, ouci koinwnia estin tou aimatoV tou cristou; ton arton on klwmen, ouci koinwnia tou swmatoV tou cristou estin;
The word here is koinwnia or koinonia, pronounced (koy-nohn-ee'-ah). 1 Corinthians 10:16 (KJV) use the English word
purple, I always reference back to the original language, Greek and Hebrew. This is where we can find the original word of God. I agree with you and your reference that the Bible can be lost in translation. This is why I referenced the original Greek for you. I agree with you on the idea that things can be lost in translation. I believe this is what has happened in the lords supper.
As far as the word "communion". There is no Greek word in the original text for this. This is what the English language has "learned" to call it. Go to biblegateway.com ; here u can search every version of the Bible known to man in all languages in one search. Type the word communion and search ALL versions of the Bible for this word. It's simply not there. I assure u that I am not changing the word of God. Purple, that was a cheap shot. I always good evidence from the Bible. I though we were having a civilized, mature conversation here. I would never accuse u of being a heretic for having a different opinion.
James tells us the same thing here in Chapter 2. Faith and Deeds
14What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? 15Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? 17In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
18But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds."
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do.
19You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that
Debmidge. I understand that you are concerned that "the laws of nature" will make me ill. If we were talking about "sneaking a little pizza and beer" now and then, I would absolutely agree with you. You also stated that you understand my faith. I am not totally sure that you do. If God asks us to do something. We should do it with faith that he will protect us. For this is what faith is. Just like my earlier example about Peter stepping out of the boat. Look at David vs Goliath, Daniel in the Lions den, and 100s more. The laws of nature were not a factor. When it comes to natural law vs Gods law. Gods law wins. I don't expect this to make sense to people "in the flesh". (I am not necessarily saying you debmidge, as I do not know your faith, nor is it my buisness. I am just making a general statement. ) hope this explains my position better.
My Grandmother has been smoking since she was 12 years old. She is 80 and still mows her own yard with a push mower. No medical problems
I know a man who was 42. Never smoke, never drank, ate right, and worked out daily. He died of cancer.
I am going to smoke, drink rum, eat high fat red meats, lots of fruits and veggies, and take no medicines for anything. Unless they are "happy pills"!! I could care less about the fountain of youth. When I die, I'll be dead. Whoever outlives me by eating twigs and berries, or by pouring baking soda up their cock, good for them. They too will join me in death.
Love all, live for others, fear not.. just my 2 cents.
Purple, I have asked myself these questions before... I once believed as you did, I am not a cradle lutheran. I also would like you to know that I agree with you about not trying to convert each others beliefs or attack. I think that it is great that we can have discussions civilly about the Bible. I actually enjoy it! =)
Here is what took me many years to learn. As I am not easilly "sold" into theology.
"how can the bread and wine be Jesus' actual body and blood when he wasn't dead yet?"
The same way he said "let there be light", and "I am in the father and the father is in me", his word is inerrant. he says it----it is , period
John tells us this.... Chapter 1
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.
3Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4In him was life, and that life was the light of men.
You referenced the word communion's definition..... Do a search on biblegateway.com for the word communion in the Bible. You won't find it. This is a human descriptor for a spiritual and Biblical thing. It's man-made definition, 2,000 years later, is meaningless to Christ's words.
You give many scriptural examples of "spiritual implication" in the Bible. While I agree that many of your examples are correct. The references to the last supper in the gospels, are not meant to be interpreted this way in the original Greek text. I have studied this Greek. And not to get too collegiate, here it is in a nut-shell. Matthew (Mt 26:26), Mark (14:22) and Luke (22:19) use exactly the same Greek words for
Msau22, read my "signature" at the bottom this page.....specifically the part about the "new test".
That's all you need........
As far as feeling "alone" in this ...you aren't....how many members are on this board?????... u see my point.
If you feel that people just "don't understand"...pardon my french .....**** em'!
It's like this........I can eat 100 lbs of chocolate in one sitting, and not gain a pound. Some people look at one drop of chocolate and gain 100lbs! It's just the way their chemistry is. If people hate me for this, then piss on them! LOL!!
Same with the celiac issue. U Be U!!!!! It's who your best at.
purple, I respect your opinion, but differ in mine. Yes, I believe that we are saved by grace through faith alone, in christ alone. But even though the Bible seems to put ALOT of weight on Baptism and confession/repentance also. This is how God "works" our salvation. Not by our "works" . But following the commandment of Christ.
"... baptism now SAVES you not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience..." 1 Peter 3:21
..but this can be a whole new discussion for another topic
I also believe that God has given us certain gifts in this life that help work our faith and help us grow spiritually. (marriage, baptism, communion, etc...) This is not saving ourselves by"works", but following the commandment of our Lord out of love, and desire to please him as a result of that love, and not to save ourselves. But I believe God works his grace and grows our faith through these things. I am Lutheran, and I believe that Christ's body and blood are in the bread and wine. You seem to be of differing belief. So we may just have to agree to disagree on this one. When it comes to communion, here is an example of why I don't agree with "remembrance" theology
I Corinthians 10:16
The cup of blessing that we bless, is it not a participation in the blood of Christ?(AA) The bread that we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ?<-------well, is it? We can't change the word of God to please our needs.
Matthew 26:26-29; Mark 14:22-25; Luke 22:14-23
Take, eat; THIS IS my body.<------ No mistake here, ...THIS IS his body....pretty clear there.
The apostle Paul believes this body and blood to be so "real" that he states in I Corinthians 11:27
Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord(AC) in an unworthy manner will be guilty concerning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a person examine himself, then, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment on himself. <---Wonder bread and Welches grape juice bring judgement on us........no, but the TRUE BODY AND BLOOD of Christ.....absolutely
Do I think communion saves us, ...simply, no
Do I think it is more than just a wonder bread and grape juice toast to our good buddy Jesus?.... ABSOLUTELY !
...I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day
my church has 300 members, and yes my pastor knows about my "wheat allergy" , but I told him that I didn't want to be segregated apart from the rest of the church during communion.
As far as not getting disease when I get older, etc... just a couple of FYI's
1. I am a paramedic, I know what smoking does to a person..... yet I smoke. So, I guess my "give a pooper" might be broke....... as far as doing what's best for my body.
2. I have seen so many people live right, eat right, etc. Yet I have met plenty that have been stricken with cancer, stroke, etc.... at 40 years old. (once again, the paramedic occupation gives me a front row seat to this.) I know plenty of good ol' rednecks that have smoked their whole life and are still farming at 80 years old. I gave up searching for the fountain of youth long ago. And if heaven is as good as the Bible claims, why would I want to stay here forever. In retrospect, a true christian should be praying to hurry up and get done with this life, and get to eternity!
Finally , some of the GOOD BOOK........
I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day
I had a negative blood test. I suspect it was because I was gluten free for 3 months prior to the test. Therefore, no antibodies to gluten. Keep eating that gluten at least until you test, in order to get accurate results. My dr wanted me to go back on Gluten for 30 days to test again. NO WAY!!!! I am not going through a month of torture!!!! Just to conclude what I already know, and that is..... I eat gluten=I break out, I stop eating gluten=rash goes away. Good enough for me!