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How Come Gluten Didnt Bother Me In Italy


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#16 kareng

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Posted 18 May 2013 - 05:07 AM

Actually:

"Grains are not the same as they used to be. For 100 of years they would cut the sheaths of grains and stack them in the fields and leave them to gather the next day. The dew would make the grains sprout and unlock the nutrients and deactivate the phytic acid, and enzyme inhibitors. Than the workers would gather the grains and take the seeds off the stalks to be used. Today we have combine machine that take the seeds off instantly never allowing the grains to sprout. Then for years and still today in European countries we always used sourdough starters to rise our breads, which transforms the bread in the same way that sprouting does. It puts lactobacillus into the bread."

You can read her story at http://www.culturedf...-coconut-kefir/

Doctors don't always have the right or complete answer...

 

 

Actually, I doubt grains actually sprouted overnight during harvest.  That's not really how seeds work.  Nor would you be able to grind them into flour or store them for long if they did.

 

But anyway....sprouted wheat is still wheat and not for people with Celiac disease.


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#17 Sara-Chicago

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 06:24 PM

Genetically modifed wheat is outlawed in Europe, but it is allowed in the U.S.

 

The established medical instututions in the U.S. quickly say that "no, there is no link," but this cannot be proven whatsoever. In fact, empirical and logical evidence seems to point otherwise.

 

In the U.S., all wheat (unless specifically labeled organic / non-GMO) is genetically modified and has a completely different gene sequence.  It contains not only gluten, but also a brand-new thing, never before seen in the world, and created as a result of the gene-splicing: "Gliadin."

 

A basic sumamry of gliadin is that humans cannot break it down.  The European parliament and doctor's groups throughout Europe are currently conducting massive studies to prove that the body's difficulty in breaking down "Gliadin" - which the human body cannot break down - is the key factor in the body starting to intelligently react ALSO against Gluten. 

 

Why go through so much effort to prove the link? becuase they want to make sure that they don't lift the ban on importing any of the "Franken-wheat" with gliadin.  Which, sadly, right now, is legal in the U.S.

 

Note: if the human body cannot break it down, and all doctors know and accept the fact that it therefore "gums up" the intestines, leading to weight gain etc - could it also be a factor in the obesity in this country which is really not seen anywhere else in the world? Not to mention the severe debilitating diseases that are side effects of the resulting poor health.  And how much does this cost America in the form of medical care?  It is a terrible cycle, and it doesn't take a genius to figure it out.  When will we start protecting people, with food safety laws in this country?

 

(nd, since 10,000x more chemicals, on average, are outlawed in Europe for safety reasons - could it be that being in Europe, one is not exposed to all the chemicals that cause the immune system to go haywire in the first place, causing the reaction to Gluten? Of course that is possible.


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#18 GottaSki

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 06:52 PM

Genetically modifed wheat is outlawed in Europe, but it is allowed in the U.S.

 

The established medical instututions in the U.S. quickly say that "no, there is no link," but this cannot be proven whatsoever. In fact, empirical and logical evidence seems to point otherwise.

 

In the U.S., all wheat (unless specifically labeled organic / non-GMO) is genetically modified and has a completely different gene sequence.  It contains not only gluten, but also a brand-new thing, never before seen in the world, and created as a result of the gene-splicing: "Gliadin."

 

A basic sumamry of gliadin is that humans cannot break it down.  The European parliament and doctor's groups throughout Europe are currently conducting massive studies to prove that the body's difficulty in breaking down "Gliadin" - which the human body cannot break down - is the key factor in the body starting to intelligently react ALSO against Gluten. 

 

Why go through so much effort to prove the link? becuase they want to make sure that they don't lift the ban on importing any of the "Franken-wheat" with gliadin.  Which, sadly, right now, is legal in the U.S.

 

Note: if the human body cannot break it down, and all doctors know and accept the fact that it therefore "gums up" the intestines, leading to weight gain etc - could it also be a factor in the obesity in this country which is really not seen anywhere else in the world? Not to mention the severe debilitating diseases that are side effects of the resulting poor health.  And how much does this cost America in the form of medical care?  It is a terrible cycle, and it doesn't take a genius to figure it out.  When will we start protecting people, with food safety laws in this country?

 

(nd, since 10,000x more chemicals, on average, are outlawed in Europe for safety reasons - could it be that being in Europe, one is not exposed to all the chemicals that cause the immune system to go haywire in the first place, causing the reaction to Gluten? Of course that is possible.

 

Welcome!

 

I don't necessarily disagree with much of what you have introduced to this thread, but would like to comment on one point that I think is incorrect.

 

From my understanding Gliadin has always been in wheat -- it is one of two proteins that make up wheat.  If you are speaking of genetically modified peptide chains to create variations to Gliadin content...I think that is one aspect of wheat that has been genetically altered.

 

Again, welcome....take a look around :)


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#19 kareng

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 07:19 PM

Genetically modifed wheat is outlawed in Europe, but it is allowed in the U.S.
 
The established medical instututions in the U.S. quickly say that "no, there is no link," but this cannot be proven whatsoever. In fact, empirical and logical evidence seems to point otherwise.
 
In the U.S., all wheat (unless specifically labeled organic / non-GMO) is genetically modified and has a completely different gene sequence.  It contains not only gluten, but also a brand-new thing, never before seen in the world, and created as a result of the gene-splicing: "Gliadin."
 
A basic sumamry of gliadin is that humans cannot break it down.  The European parliament and doctor's groups throughout Europe are currently conducting massive studies to prove that the body's difficulty in breaking down "Gliadin" - which the human body cannot break down - is the key factor in the body starting to intelligently react ALSO against Gluten. 
 
Why go through so much effort to prove the link? becuase they want to make sure that they don't lift the ban on importing any of the "Franken-wheat" with gliadin.  Which, sadly, right now, is legal in the U.S.
 
Note: if the human body cannot break it down, and all doctors know and accept the fact that it therefore "gums up" the intestines, leading to weight gain etc - could it also be a factor in the obesity in this country which is really not seen anywhere else in the world? Not to mention the severe debilitating diseases that are side effects of the resulting poor health.  And how much does this cost America in the form of medical care?  It is a terrible cycle, and it doesn't take a genius to figure it out.  When will we start protecting people, with food safety laws in this country?
 
(nd, since 10,000x more chemicals, on average, are outlawed in Europe for safety reasons - could it be that being in Europe, one is not exposed to all the chemicals that cause the immune system to go haywire in the first place, causing the reaction to Gluten? Of course that is possible.


You do realize they have Celiac Disease in Europe, right? And there is evidence of Celiac before anyone thought about genetically engineering plants?

Could you please link to some evidence that gliadin is a new additive to wheat? I thought it was the name for a protein that is in all wheat - GMO or " original".
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#20 Gemini

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 11:48 AM

I'm glad you two caught that mistake in Sara's post!  Gliadin is one of the proteins found in wheat and has always been there.  Saying it is a brand new thing, never before seen in the world is about as dramatic of a presentation of an error as I have ever heard.  :rolleyes:   No one knows if GMO'd food is a health risk because, quite frankly, Europeans are just as sick as Americans these days and they are becoming as overweight as Americans are too and it isn't from the wheat...at least not the vast majority of it.

 

If you look at movies or photo's of people from just 60 years ago, there was nary an overweight person in the crowd.  Even football players were not the massive people they are today.  The difference is that there was no fast food, everyone ate home cooked meals and people exercised a lot more than they do today. We have people do everything for us and Americans, in particular, rarely cut their own lawn or clean their own houses. People were always in motion and they are not doing these things today so aren't burning as many calories, yet eat way more than they should.  That's another problem....people have a huge disconnect with what a normal size portion is because of all the super sizing of meals in restaurants.  I better stop now before I get into the ridiculous notion that obesity is a disease....... <_<


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#21 cyclinglady

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 10:26 AM

I'm glad you two caught that mistake in Sara's post!  Gliadin is one of the proteins found in wheat and has always been there.  Saying it is a brand new thing, never before seen in the world is about as dramatic of a presentation of an error as I have ever heard.  :rolleyes:   No one knows if GMO'd food is a health risk because, quite frankly, Europeans are just as sick as Americans these days and they are becoming as overweight as Americans are too and it isn't from the wheat...at least not the vast majority of it.

 

If you look at movies or photo's of people from just 60 years ago, there was nary an overweight person in the crowd.  Even football players were not the massive people they are today.  The difference is that there was no fast food, everyone ate home cooked meals and people exercised a lot more than they do today. We have people do everything for us and Americans, in particular, rarely cut their own lawn or clean their own houses. People were always in motion and they are not doing these things today so aren't burning as many calories, yet eat way more than they should.  That's another problem....people have a huge disconnect with what a normal size portion is because of all the super sizing of meals in restaurants.  I better stop now before I get into the ridiculous notion that obesity is a disease....... <_<

Too late...the AMA has decided that obesity is a disease!  Can you believe it? 


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#22 Gemini

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 12:26 PM

Too late...the AMA has decided that obesity is a disease!  Can you believe it? 

Yeah...I saw that the other week and yes, sadly, I can believe they have.  It's all about money and once something is classified as a disease, they can start collecting insurance money treating it. So all these people who are desperate to lose weight, will jump on the AMA band wagon of drugs and surgeries to re-plumb their innards so they can lose weight.  It's insane.

Real medical problems account for a miniscule number of overweight issues in this country.  Most people just eat too much and don't move enough.  Then there are the emotional eaters.

 

Mu husband works with a friend who had the bypass surgery to lose weight.  He did lose a lot of weight but now that it has been 7-8 years, the weight is coming back because he is reverting back to his old eating habits of high calorie food.  He is an emotional eater and when he gets upset or bored, he puts something in his mouth.  Everone knows this and sees it but you cannot force people to thin down. I just think people are being scammed because there is only one way to control your weight as you age and that is to eat healthy, in real amounts, and keep active.  You don't simulate Celiac Disease and re-plumb someone so they can only eat miniscule amounts of food at a time and call that a success.  It never addresses the real reason why they eat too much. 

 

I go to the gym to keep fit and I am so proud of all the women I work out with who bust their butts trying to lose large amounts of weight.  It is not easy but they do it willingly and I can assure you that even obese people can thin down without drugs or surgery....you just need a good gym and a personal trainer who will kick your butt.  Most gyms use them now and they are great motivators. It's like boot camp...... :)


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#23 lostoldhippie

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Posted 01 July 2014 - 06:23 PM

I recently traveled to Italy, and although I've read they have many many gluten free options, I decided that I was going to eat whatever I wanted, even if it had gluten. When I mentioned this to my doctor, he said it actually may not bother me since the wheat outside of the US is typically less genetically modified and more "natural".

So after 2 weeks in Italy eating pasta daily, pizza, and all kinds of baked goods, I felt great. No headaches, upset stomach or any symptoms of gluten digestion.

Has anyone else had a similar experience outside of the US? If thats the case, could I buy imported flours and pasta made in Italy that arent "gluten free" and be okay eating them at home?

I am so happy to find someone who did exactly as I did.   I went to Italy with a gluten intolerance problem but; just like you I said to myself …. how can you go to Italy and not eat bread, pasta, pizza, biscottie … etc.  So I ate them all and did not suffer from any side effects of gluten for almost 3 weeks.   I too came to the same conclusion that it must be the  GMOs.   As you see from your post most people think we are full of ……….. go figure; I know my body and I know when I have been poisoned. After 3 days back in the States and 3 lunches with organic wheat bread I am suffering all the side affects.  


Edited by lostoldhippie, 02 July 2014 - 08:25 AM.

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#24 Gemini

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Posted 02 July 2014 - 12:06 PM

I am so happy to find someone who did exactly as I did.   I went to Italy with a gluten intolerance problem but; just like you I said to myself …. how can you go to Italy and not eat bread, pasta, pizza, biscottie … etc.  So I ate them all and did not suffer from any side effects of gluten for almost 3 weeks.   I too came to the same conclusion that it must be the  GMOs.   As you see from your post most people think we are full of ……….. go figure; I know my body and I know when I have been poisoned. After 3 days back in the States and 3 lunches with organic wheat bread I am suffering all the side affects.  

GMO's have nothing to do with Celiac Disease or how we react to wheat. If that were true, then no one in Europe with Celiac Disease would be reacting to wheat that they eat. That is about as silly a reasoning as it gets.

 

I would find it pretty easy to travel abroad and not touch anything that was off limits to me as a full blown Celiac. I have done it on many trips.  I take this disease very seriously and would be in the hospital on my vacation if I were as careless and.....well......stupid as someone who apparently cheats all the time on their diet.  You come onto a Celiac forum and tell us you routinely eat wheat foods?  If you are actually a diagnosed Celiac, good luck with that. I mean, you certainly have free will and the right to eat whatever you want in life but to those who are new to this lifestyle and really need to be strict with your diet, don't make this mistake and think you can eat the wheat in Italy because you can't.

You will still be ruining your gut and it might ruin your vacation.


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#25 LauraTX

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Posted 02 July 2014 - 02:22 PM

Gemini, you could not have said that better. 


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#26 dttcb89

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 08:14 AM

I am so happy to find someone who did exactly as I did.   I went to Italy with a gluten intolerance problem but; just like you I said to myself …. how can you go to Italy and not eat bread, pasta, pizza, biscottie … etc.  So I ate them all and did not suffer from any side effects of gluten for almost 3 weeks.   I too came to the same conclusion that it must be the  GMOs.   As you see from your post most people think we are full of ……….. go figure; I know my body and I know when I have been poisoned. After 3 days back in the States and 3 lunches with organic wheat bread I am suffering all the side affects.  

I just returned from Italy on June 27th...  First I need to clarify that I have not been diagnosed with Celiac, or wheat allergies.  I have had crazy symptoms of gas, mouth sores, hair falling out, muscle "ping" pains, and tonsil stones- when gluten-free started hitting main-stream media, I thought maybe I should stop the pasta and bread and see what happens, and low-and-behold, my symptoms stopped!  (I always paid the price after big pasta dinners!)  :-0

 

I went to Italy with my Beano and GasX, hoping I wouldn't run my hotel mates out of the room- and after the first pasta dinner, crossed my fingers and waited.... and waited....  but the symptoms never came!  Long story short, I ate pasta, pizza and bread for 10 glorious days!  I cannot tell you how wonderful it was not to worry about symptoms for 10 days!  Italy was amazing, and being able to eat without worry, made the trip that much better!

 

Now that I am home, I wonder if I order pasta, flour, etc., online, or go to Jungle Jims in Cinci to get product direct from Italy, I will be able to enjoy those foods again, here at home.

 

I never thought I'd see the huge difference I did in my symptoms- but I SWEAR it was amazing!  There is something very different in the food here-  I don't know what else could have caused my 10 days of worry-free eating!!!


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#27 kareng

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 08:16 AM

I just returned from Italy on June 27th...  First I need to clarify that I have not been diagnosed with Celiac, or wheat allergies.  I have had crazy symptoms of gas, mouth sores, hair falling out, muscle "ping" pains, and tonsil stones- when gluten-free started hitting main-stream media, I thought maybe I should stop the pasta and bread and see what happens, and low-and-behold, my symptoms stopped!  (I always paid the price after big pasta dinners!)  :-0

 

I went to Italy with my Beano and GasX, hoping I wouldn't run my hotel mates out of the room- and after the first pasta dinner, crossed my fingers and waited.... and waited....  but the symptoms never came!  Long story short, I ate pasta, pizza and bread for 10 glorious days!  I cannot tell you how wonderful it was not to worry about symptoms for 10 days!  Italy was amazing, and being able to eat without worry, made the trip that much better!

 

Now that I am home, I wonder if I order pasta, flour, etc., online, or go to Jungle Jims in Cinci to get product direct from Italy, I will be able to enjoy those foods again, here at home.

 

I never thought I'd see the huge difference I did in my symptoms- but I SWEAR it was amazing!  There is something very different in the food here-  I don't know what else could have caused my 10 days of worry-free eating!!!

 

 

Aren't Barilla made in Italy?  I thought they were.  But you don't seem to have Celiac, so the "rules will be different for you.  :)


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#28 cap6

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 06:25 PM

I will still say wheat is wheat is wheat.  If you are celiac then you are playing with fire to eat it.  Period.  You may not get sick but the damage is being done anyway.  Three days, three weeks, whatever, of carefree eating wheat simply does not seem worth the risk of what I may be doing internally.  But we all are free to make our own choices.  If I ever am lucky enough to make it to Italy I will be enjoyuing whatever foods are available minus the wheat.  My choice. 


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#29 beth01

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 08:21 PM

I first want to say that I am a firm believer of " wheat is wheat" no matter what country or zip code you live in.  Which means, if you have Celiac you shouldn't eat wheat.  It isn't like guy rules where " it isn't cheating if you are in another zip code" , "it's not cheating if no one finds out" and all the other idiotic things people say to justify any sort of cheating.

 

 

 

Let's say for science's sake that all the people who have gone abroad and eaten the wonderful unmodified wheat and not gotten sick might have something going.  How do we prove this.... Let's do an experiment.

 

Who wants to live abroad for five years and eat wonderful unmodified wheat?  Who wants to tell me all about the brain fog, muscle aches, nerve pain, poop you can finger paint with (if you can poop more that once a week or less than 10 times a day), bloated bellies that make you look pregnant, headaches, urinary problems, or the list of over 293 more symptoms I haven't stated?  That is just asinine.

 

To all the new people that read this thread either now or in the future ( unless they actually come up with a cure for Celiac) don't eat wheat modified or not, it's not safe.


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Diagnosed at age 37 after a lifetime of symptoms and other diseases: migraines, joint pain, muscle aches, nerve pain, IBS, chronic constipation, chronic ear infections/strep throat, weight fluctuations ( most weight lost >150 pounds), acid reflux, stomach pain, nausea/vomiting, inactive gallbladder, stool impacted appendix, multiple miscarriages, premature births, depression, anxiety, OCD, arthritis of the spine, Grave's disease(treated with radioactive iodine)- hypothyroid, multiple drug and environmental allergies, numbness in the hands and feet, possible multiple TIA's, brain fog, dyslexia, extreme thirst, bouts of insomnia rotated by extreme fatigue, multiple vitamin deficiencies, chronic UTI's and vaginal infections, Fibromyalgia, and I'm sure there are more I am forgetting.

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11 year old daughter diagnosed a month later by a tTg IgA of >100 and a positive EMA.  Nine year old son has since tested negative, only had tTg IgA drawn,  Will have a full panel drawn in two years unless symptoms present. 


#30 nvsmom

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Posted 05 July 2014 - 07:48 AM

I am so happy to find someone who did exactly as I did.   I went to Italy with a gluten intolerance problem but; just like you I said to myself …. how can you go to Italy and not eat bread, pasta, pizza, biscottie … etc.  So I ate them all and did not suffer from any side effects of gluten for almost 3 weeks.   I too came to the same conclusion that it must be the  GMOs.   As you see from your post most people think we are full of ……….. go figure; I know my body and I know when I have been poisoned. After 3 days back in the States and 3 lunches with organic wheat bread I am suffering all the side affects.  

 

Just remember that some celiacs are symptom free. No GI symptoms at all. My cousin was diagnosed based on cognitive problems and ADD.

 

Also, some celiacs do not always get immediate symptoms. My symptoms tend to worsen over time, although I usually do feel a bit off when I eat gluten. It is possible that the excitement and adrenalin from travel helped mask your symptoms too.


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