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Member Since 14 Dec 2003
Offline Last Active Yesterday, 10:28 AM

Posts I've Made

In Topic: The Fight Against Omission Beer

14 July 2015 - 10:49 AM

PS - In this chart you can see that some "gluten-free" beers made with sorghum test as high as some "gluten" beers made using barley, but many commercial beers that are made using barley do test below 20ppm:

One other downside to the position that we can't properly test beers for gluten content, is that "gluten-free" beers like Bard's could not then reliably claim that they are gluten-free...right? As mentioned, cross contamination can happen at multiple points, including in box cars used to transport grains, in the field, etc.


If we can't test them for gluten content, how can these beers make the claim that they are gluten-free? 

In Topic: The Fight Against Omission Beer

14 July 2015 - 10:31 AM

What you linked to was not a scientific article...it was a dietitian's web site. Actually Omission also used Mass Spectrometry, which does detect the glutenin fraction that they were concerned about in the article discussed in the link you sent (http://www.ncbi.nlm....les/PMC2582232/). From Omission's site:



In 2013, Mass Spec research was conducted by an independent lab which validated that Omission Lager and Pale Ale are devoid of known barley toxic epitopes, the specific peptide sequences and reactive sites in gluten molecules that cause reactions in the human small intestine.  These same beers were tested using the R5 Competitive ELISA and were found to lack any measureable gluten content.   A growing body of peer reviewed scientific literature supports that our process is effective in breaking up and detoxifying gluten peptides.


They also used the competitive R5-ELISA  rather than the sandwich R5-ELISA, which according to the original research article in your link is more accurate (why has the dietitian overlooked this in the article she sites?): 




Indeed, a subsequent study [25] suggests that the R5-ELISA fails to detect some forms of gluten, at least when employed in the sandwich format. The sandwich R5-ELISA yielded lower gluten values on beer samples than the competitive R5-ELISA. This difference was attributed to an inability of the sandwich R5-ELISA to detect hydrolysed gluten, however the experiments were insufficiently controlled to show that the competitive R5-ELISA reliably detected all gluten in the commercial samples tested.



Here are some research articles that support using Mass Spectrometry to accurately detect gluten (glutenin, gliadin, etc.):

In Topic: The Fight Against Omission Beer

13 July 2015 - 04:40 PM

You are mistaking legal disclaimers from reality. Just because labeling laws have certain requirements, for example foods made in facilities that also use wheat, that doesn't mean that those products contain wheat. In fact, products made in facilities that produce wheat might test negative while some made in gluten-free facilities might test positive. Many products, even ones with gluten-free certifications, have tested positive for gluten. How does this happen? Just because you have a gluten-free facility doesn't mean that the facilities where you get the ingredients are also gluten-free.


Once again, the beer tests gluten-free using what is considered to be the industry gold standard for such testing--the R5 Competitive ELISA. I have no problem with them making the claim it is gluten-free, and do understand that they must juggle a ton of contradictory state and federal labeling laws and essentially walk a tight rope to be able to manufacture and sell this product to their target market. 


We are only in round one of the USA labeling laws, and I suspect that round two will include such products as gluten-free. 


Also, not to totally discount anecdotal evidence, but there are lots of people who are super sensitive who claim lots of interesting things that can't be backed up by science--for example that distilled spirits made from gluten grains contain gluten--no scientist who understands the distillation process supports this, yet we have similar claims. 


One thing I do know is that those who believe this beer is harmful should not drink it, but for the rest of us products like Omission are exactly what we've been hoping for since being diagnosed.

In Topic: The Fight Against Omission Beer

13 July 2015 - 08:34 AM

To me it seems like they are making it very clear to everyone that they use barley to brew their beer and are not trying to hide anything from anyone. Like oats, it is up to the gluten-free consumer to decide whether or not to include this in their diets...there are alternative options out there like Bard's for those who want to exclude barley. 


There are several other beers that are successfully using the same approach to remove gluten from their beers, and these beers, in my opinion, are superior. In Germany beers that don't use barley and follow the "Reinheitsgebot" can't legally be called "beer," and are instead malt beverages. Some of these "beers" I've tasted definitely don't taste like beers, and, in my opinion, use a form of false advertising by marketing them as such...but I won't start a thread about this.  :rolleyes:

In Topic: The Fight Against Omission Beer

10 July 2015 - 03:33 PM

Ok, so again, I just read the FAQ and it does not claim that the beer is gluten-free. It says the R5 Competitive ELISA (which is now considered the gold standard for detecting hydrolyzed gluten) does not detect anything. This is not the same as them marketing it as gluten-free. 


Can someone please show me where Omission, in their marketing materials, or in their Tweets, claim that it is gluten-free? 


The beer is gluten-free, but that is apparently beside the point.


Do you realize that you can make sourdough bread from wheat flour that tests gluten-free? I would not start doing this and eating it, but it is a fact.


I think the real debate here is whether or not people will believe that wheat can be treated with enzymes or probiotics or both and rendered gluten-free and safe. There are those out there that will never believe this, no matter what the science says about it, and those folks should avoid such things. 


There are lots of scientists around the world now working on probiotic and other treatments that will do exactly this, but in your gut should you ingest some gluten. It should be no surprise to anyone that a brewery could throw such enzymes into their vat and produce the same effects--and better yet, filter it so fine that it could not contain the prolamines.

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