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plumbago

Member Since 13 Nov 2010
Offline Last Active Today, 09:52 AM
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Posts I've Made

In Topic: Feeling Pretty Sad About The Whole Gluten-Free Thing Right Now

Today, 07:56 AM

Hi,

 

It would be helpful to know what your B12 level was, and what is the normal B12 range for the lab your blood was processed at. Same with the normal range for iron/ferritin. I used to give myself B12 shots. Easy to do. Also, you can do supplements for iron. I agree that animals have more heme available to us than veggies, but the veggies are so good for us!

 

Plumbago


In Topic: Should Enriched gluten-free Flour Be The Next Battle?

03 August 2014 - 07:33 AM

While a law protecting the health of 1% of the population from others is good, one protecting us from our own willful ignorance and laziness is kind of stupid.

 

I wonder where the moderator is on that one.

 

Actually I don't mind my ideas being called stupid that much. I'm pretty much all for free expression. What I do object to is having the conversation interrupted by a moderator, demanding scientific proof here and ther of select commenters only, while not demanding it of others, and also permitting ideas to be called stupid. Either enforce the rules for everyone or no one, is kind of how I see it.

 

BTW, can I see a copy of these rules? Thank you very much.

 

Plumbago


In Topic: Should Enriched gluten-free Flour Be The Next Battle?

01 August 2014 - 01:17 PM

Yellow rice and its GMO nonstop promises are hype, whereas the victories from fortification are provable and real.


In Topic: Should Enriched gluten-free Flour Be The Next Battle?

01 August 2014 - 01:06 PM

I tried to find something saying that fortified foods are better than vitamins, but I found the opposite from the Harvard school of public health.: http://www.hsph.harv...rce/folic-acid/

They are talking about folic acid.

 

This is something I cited in an earlier post, by the way. I referred to a Harvard study.

 

From the article:

"Take a standard multivitamin every day, but stay away from heavily fortified foods that deliver a full day’s dose—or sometimes more—of folic acid"

 

What I'm about to say may not be a scientific statement as it is subjective, but that, to me, is hardly a pronouncement that all fortified foods are not as 'good' as supplements. It is rather, a warning to keep away from overly fortified foods. You would have to look on the back of individual fortified foods to see if it delivers a full day's dosage. Does a loaf of gluten bread deliver that much? I bet not. Generally, enriched grains and breads that were enriched as part of the 1942 Act are done so in pretty small amounts.

 

From the article you cite (and that I referred to earlier):

"Since 1998, folic acid has been added to most enriched bread flours, cornmeal, pasta, rice, and other grain products in the U.S. and Canada. This was done to help prevent spina bifida and anencephaly, two birth defects that are caused in part by too little folate in a mother’s body around the time her baby is conceived.This program has increased average folic acid intakes by about 100 micrograms a day (3) and has decreased the number of American children born with a neural tube defect by 25% to 50%. (4) The overall evidence from controlled trials shows that extra folic acid also helps protect against stroke (5), and many studies suggest it probably reduces the risk of heart disease, too."

 

What they are warning against are some foods.

 

"Some breakfast cereals, nutrition bars, and other fortified foods deliver up to 800 micrograms of folic acid, and that’s about double the recommended daily dose. The Institute of Medicine’s upper limit is 1,000 micrograms of folic acid from fortified foods a day."

 

From The Ups and Downs of Folic Acid Fortification:

http://www.health.ha...rtification.htm

 

"The bottom line? Unless you’re pregnant or lactating or have a recognized folate deficiency, the recommended daily intake of folic acid is 400 mcg per day — the amount found in a typical multivitamin. According to Dr. Walter Willett, Chairman of the Department of Nutrition at the Harvard School of Public Health, “the added folic acid from food fortification is on average 100 to 200 mcg per day, but this varies widely, depending on food choice.” The tolerable upper intake level (UL) — the maximum safe amount — of folic acid from fortified foods and supplements is 1,000 mcg per day. With all the fortified foods on the market, you may exceed that limit, especially if you’re already taking a daily multivitamin containing 400 mcg of folic acid. So it’s a good idea to check the nutrition labels of cereal and grain products to find out how much you’re getting from fortified foods. (For some examples of fortified foods and their folic acid content, see "Food servings with 100 micrograms of naturally occurring folate.")"

 

They add at the end of the original article you cited:

 

"We will continue to monitor the evidence as it emerges, particularly from long term studies, to fine tune guidance about the optimal intakes of folic acid, vitaminB12, and other nutrients."

 

(Again, Vitamin B12 is not really part of our conversation, although it works in conjunction with folate.)

 

The article you cite worries about cancer and folic acid fortification/supplementation. It was written in 2008. In class, we are learning, also, that folate can help prevent pancreatic cancer. To me, I do not know enough to make a cancer judgment either way, and neither I suspect does Harvard. You could make a counter argument (non Celiacs could): given the amount of fortification, you do not need to supplement - with the obvious exceptions, such as women who are thinking of becoming pregnant.


In Topic: Should Enriched gluten-free Flour Be The Next Battle?

01 August 2014 - 11:12 AM

At the risk of wandering further afield from a main point that someone else pointed out ("I bet if they fortified gluten-free bread more people would buy it"), I will wade back in.

Pointing to amaranth was a good tip. Thanks, it's always good to be reminded.

I didn't misunderstand. I realize that the crux of the matter is whether or not fortified food is 'better' than taking vitamins.

However, this question, as far as I can tell, cannot be discussed on this board as there is no way I can scientifically prove that the preferred way most medical personnel say to get our vit and minerals is through whole foods and then fortified foods. All I can say is that they (most) do. I can quote extensively from nursing and medical textbooks that question even the benefit and safety of using supplemental vitamins. Should I? Is that what people are looking for? Very long quotations? I will provide them if so.

No, what I think some here are looking for is some kind of ironclad scientifically provable backward and forward guarantee that enriching is better than supplementing. And they want to see those words. As far as I can tell, those specific words in that order do not exist. For purposes of free speech and being able to have a debate, I am very sorry they don't. Are people hedging when they say that? Maybe. I do not know. I can speculate as to why it is that fortified foods are not looked on as questionably as supplements (it has to do with balance and knowledge) but my speculation is not scientific. I could speculate further that maybe drs and nurses don't think fortified products are the real way to go, either, but that they are less prone to be abused, and they are stop gaps. Again, the truth or falseness of what they say is not scientifically provable at the present time.

So in closing, given this directive,

"people come here looking for credible information.  i am not 'perhaps wishing' - it is a board rule and you need to consider others."

I look forward to some very scientific future comments!

Plumbago