RiceGuy

I would normally offer links but I find myself disinclined to continue this discussion.  You should find the research trivially easy to find in PubMed if you spend your time looking for it rather than trolling me.  

Plonk.

Pardon me, as I was not aware that simply asking for clarification of your statements would be considered "trolling" you. However, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and since it appeared that you possessed a certain level of knowledge on this topic, I'd hoped that you'd at least follow up rather than abruptly exiting. Especially if the research you speak of is so easily obtained.

Be that as it may, I did search PubMed, and found the following:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19302264
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18403944
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17303598

According to the above articles, there have been a very small number of people who, after following a gluten-free diet for some time, were able to ingest gluten without symptoms of intolerance. However, whether the absence of symptoms is only temporary is not known. The basic conclusion is that such individuals would have to continue eating gluten, and be monitored long-term, in order to know if symptoms will return. In one of the studies, only one such individual was HLA-DQ2/DQ8 positive.

There are even case studies in the biomedical literature of celiacs who have desensitized to wheat, though scientists are careful to call it a "return to latency".  Someone with gluten intolerance regaining tolerance isn't even interesting enough to publish.

I'd like to see some of those "case studies in the biomedical literature".

Right.  Food allergies and reactions come and go all the time, and I doubt most doctors and clinical researchers would find it remarkable if a gluten intolerance in someone who was not diagnosed with celiac disease resolved.  Gluten intolerance may be a horse of a different color so to speak, but I don't think it's been characterized to the point where recovering from gluten intolerance would be seen as novel.

Wait. Are you now differentiating between gluten intolerance and Celiac, saying that someone without Celiac who recovers from gluten intolerance wouldn't be seen as novel enough to publish, and does that mean you're suggesting that if someone who was diagnosed with Celiac Disease recovered, then it would be deemed worthy of publication? I'm not sure how this jives with your previous statement about "biomedical literature", quoted above. Again, I want to see those case studies you speak of, if they do in fact exist.

Riceguy, remember that we will not hear of people who regain their tolerance to wheat on this message board. They will leave the message board and go merrily on their way.  This is a self-selected group of people who are mostly having a lot of GI trouble.

My reading on the subject is by no means limited to this board. If you can post some links to valid sources of information showing that gluten intolerance can positively and completely resolve itself, please do.

There are even case studies in the biomedical literature of celiacs who have desensitized to wheat, though scientists are careful to call it a "return to latency".  Someone with gluten intolerance regaining tolerance isn't even interesting enough to publish.

It sounds as if you're saying that when gluten intolerance does resolve, nobody who knows of it thinks it's worth publishing, and therefore we're not going to hear about it. Is that what you're suggesting, or have I misunderstood? I'd think it would be pretty big news, at least to researchers, as they'd want to understand the mechanism by which it occurred, in the hopes of finding a treatment or cure.

There is something known as the "honeymoon phase", in which symptoms seem to cease, and ingesting gluten doesn't cause a reaction. But it does not last, and inevitably the person begins experiencing symptoms again. Last I've read, the reasons for this is not known.

Thanks. How do you know for sure what are your needs? Is there a specific test for lack of enzymes?
I already take apple cider vinegar, fresh and supplement ginger and liquorice root. Liquorice isn't meant for my digestion but it can help. How about Cumin can it help?

Not sure about tests, but what you need may be indicated by what type of food substances get your digestion messed up. For instance, if different types of carbs bother you, then you may need enzymes for carbs (there are different kinds of enzymes for carbs, too). If proteins mess up your digestion, then that may indicate a lack of protein enzymes.

Basically, I chose a product with a very wide assortment of enzymes, and it has helped. I cannot say it solves all the issues I'd hoped it might, but it does help. It's called Digest Platinum, made by NOW Foods. Another decent one is made by Doctor's Best.

Balancing your intestinal flora can also help, and it is very important to maintain this aspect of your digestive system. Things like antibiotics often cause the balance of flora to get out of whack, and it can be very difficult to realign things. Avoiding refined sugars is an important step, which many people seem to find troublesome. I recommend pure Stevia extract powder. It is my only sweetener, and it is all natural, zero calories, zero carbs, zero sugars, and zero on the glycemic index. It is high-heat stable, so it's safe for all your cooking and baking. Though you will need to reformulate those recipes which rely on the bulkiness of sugar. Probiotics can also assist in the process of re-balancing intestinal flora. Other things such as coconut oil can be great too, as it contains caprylic acid, which inhibits unfriendly bacteria in the gut. You can also get caprylic acid in supplement form. There are also products which can kill off unfriendly bacteria, which some folks need when the situation is particularly poor. Oregano oil, Pau D'Arco, and Black walnut are some of the more popular ingredients in such supplements, often suggested to fight a candida overgrowth. Most doctors have no clue about this aspect of intestinal health, and often misguide patients by telling them that it's nonsense.

Cumin may help to some degree. I use it regularly, and I think I've noticed a small benefit. Depending on your situation, fennel, fenugreek, and peppermint can also help. Celery seeds are known to help certain digestive disturbances too.

Well, gluten intolerance does not go away, but if your sensitivity is not due to an immune response, I suppose there is a possibility that you might recover with time. However, I remain very skeptical of this, as I've never heard of it happening. In fact, many members of this board have stated that their gluten intolerance began with a stressful period or physical trauma. Others report that it began after an infection or other illness.

Perhaps a moderator can split off these posts which have strayed somewhat off-topic, to a new thread?

For newbies, it's this simple....if you stick with certified gluten-free products and stay away from shared facilities, unless they have a good track record for keeping things separate and clean, you should be fine. If you do react to a new food, it probably is not going to be from gluten but from one of many other reasons mentioned already. You may have to heal a long while before you get to the point where you can eat without getting sick a couple of times a week. This is normal. Continuing problems should be addressed with a doctor you trust. There may be an underlying problem, common to Celiacs. Above all, relax and don't live in fear of minute amounts of gluten out there, otherwise, you'll end up like some of the posters to this forum....overly obsessive about food and life.

I do have to respond to this, because I DO REACT to certified gluten-free products which have been tested to contain less than 20ppm of gluten. Products from different companies, with a big gluten-free claim on the front, and company statements about how they test and so forth. Even products from dedicated gluten-free facilities. How do I know it wasn't another ingredient? Because the products I'm referring to only have ONE INGREDIENT! I do not buy "processed food". As I've stated in other threads, I've yet to find safe gluten-free buckwheat groats. And only one company I know of makes buckwheat flour I can safely consume. They accomplish this by growing, harvesting, milling and packaging their own buckwheat, in a dedicated facility. For all the other buckwheat products, some packages will be OK, while others cause a severe reaction, of the sort only gluten does to me.

So, just because it's certified gluten-free doesn't mean it's safe for every Celiac. I'm not "overly obsessive", as I'd be in constant agony if I didn't take the precautions I now take. For those who don't have to be super careful, I'd say consider yourself fortunate. Wish I was there.

Is it not common knowledge--supported by medical evidence, follow -up testing and symptom -resolution--that celiacs recover from villous damage?

I am not talking about refractory sprue here.

Do you really want all those medical abstracts cited?


Do you think those celiacs who are in remission are using some of those certified gluten-free products in their diets?

Of course they are!

There's at least one article on Celiac.com about how the intestines of most people with Celiac Disease do not fully recover, even after five years of strict adherence to a gluten-free diet. And, that these same individuals ordinarily do not experience any symptoms. Being symptom-free doesn't mean a full recovery has been achieved.

I think this is the first thread on the board I've seen in which Celiac is referred to as being "in remission". Not so sure I like such use of the phrase. I mean, celiac disease never really goes away. Nothing has changed beyond the healing, and even that I doubt is ever complete. It is however, just as fragile (if not more so), and the inevitable periodic exposure to gluten brings on symptoms as well as damage to the body, be it intestinal or otherwise.

A bunch of searches did not turn up the specific article I referred to, though admin did post a link to it on the board. Here's one which I think many will find interesting though:  http://www.celiac.co...uten/Page1.html

There are a few posts in this thread (and perhaps countless ones on the board) stating that fat can have a laxative effect. Perhaps it does to those who get D from gluten. My typical reaction to gluten never included D, and no amount of fat I've consumed in one meal has ever done that to me whatsoever.

However, like many of the members here, when a food doesn't agree with me, the reaction can be similar to my reaction to gluten. But over time I've learned to discern the differences, thus I'm usually (though not always) pretty sure when it's gluten and when it's something else. For the times when I'm not sure, testing a few different brands of the same product, different products with a common suspect ingredient, and so forth, has always been quite useful in narrowing it down. It can take time, patience, and a few days (or weeks) of not feeling so well, but it can be very enlightening. IMHO, better to know an offender and avoid it, rather than get surprised now and then by some darn ingredient/food, and not truly get to the bottom of it.

Just looking to see if it goes along the same line as the not so gluten free gluten free rice dream. Thanks to those who answered.

I think the answer to this question would be different than to your first. I mean, Rice Dream is known to contain gluten, as barley is used at some point during its production. IMO, the company skirts current laws, and perhaps is taking advantage of the current lack of definition of gluten-free products in general. The allergens which must be listed on a product in the U.S.A. do not include barley, so that's perhaps another loophole.

So far as I know, the So Delicious coconut milk doesn't contain any ingredients which would normally contain gluten, nor are any gluten-containing ingredients used in processing. That's quite a different scenario than with Rice Dream.

I do happen to know someone who reacts to the product in question, but I believe it is due to the carrageenan, which many people cannot tolerate, for one reason or another.

I know from experience that nutrient deficiencies can cause what you're describing, and many other problems with fingernails, and the surrounding area. Some nutrients to consider include vitamin C, B vitamins, vitamin K, vitamin D, biotin, zinc, magnesium, vitamin A, and vitamin E. Fatty acids including Omega-3s may also help. Sometimes too much citric acid can cause such symptoms as well, and citric acid is added to many processed foods. So while citrus fruits do typically contain a good amount of vitamin C, the citric acid in them may cause trouble.

There are articles on various websites about nail health, with descriptions and pictures to help identify what you're dealing with, as well as what nutrients often (but not always) cause those symptoms.

I think what others have stated gives a fairly clear picture of what we'd want. Not just stuff we can't conveniently/quickly/easily make at home, and not just "fast food", but plenty of ordinary menu items so that it doesn't feel like a "special" restaurant. So just like anybody, we can sit down and order what we want, not what we must. So the atmosphere is relaxed, and we're relaxed, and there isn't the ever-present fear of impending doom from getting glutened in spite of our best efforts. A place where we don't have to speak to the waiters and the chef, turning the entire affair into a laborious chore instead of an enjoyable experience. Simply not having to knit-pick and inquire about every ingredient would make a world of difference. So I think the menu should spell out a few things, such as when dairy or soy is an ingredient.

All the research I've done on B12 indicates that there is no known upper limit. No ill effects have ever been found. There have been studies showing that even as much as 60mg (60,000 mcg) per day can be beneficial for certain conditions such as MS. However, the method of testing may be in question, as there are at least two different tests which I'm aware of. And from what I've read, the different tests can give different readings. Just having a high serum B12 level doesn't mean the body stores are also high.

The form of B12 you take is also important, though I think that's for absorption and assimilation. I don't recall seeing anything about different forms at different levels within the body.

I saw many doctors as a child, for the numerous health problems I had, including very delayed growth and development. Never did any of them know anything about Celiac, nor did they offer any insight or help worth mentioning. Even with all that, and the fact that gluten was still a major part of my diet, I did finally have a growth spurt. I think the body eventually did what it knew it had to do.

In contrast, I know someone who I have always suspected is Celiac, and they were given those growth hormones. Result? Their growth window closed very rapidly, which I understand is what happens from growth hormones. They are still very short, stunted, and have no chance of any further growth whatsoever. The hormones didn't seem to do much of anything except hasten the closure of the growth window.

So, my recommendation would be to allow nature to do what it knows how to do, when it is able to do it. But, proper nutrition is vitally important. I'd double and triple check everything for possible contamination, give him a good quality multivitamin/mineral formula (not the typical drug store garbage - go to your local health food store), and take the entire family gluten-free if necessary to prevent cross-contamination. Give your son a wonderfully nutritious diet, full of fresh vegetables, fruits, legumes, nuts, seeds, grains, and as much diversity and variety as possible. Plenty of protein, essential fatty acids, vitamins, minerals, etc, etc.

Does he have his own dedicated gluten-free toaster? Do you use only stainless steel or other smooth-surfaced pots, pans and so forth? Throw away and scratched "non-stick" type cookware, wooden spoons, cast iron, wooden cutting boards and rolling pins, and any other cookware and utensils with porous or scratched surfaces.

However, this doesn't mean your son will have a good growth spurt. It depends on many factors, and I do not believe modern medicine knows what all those factors are. Just giving the hormones won't do it. As I understand it, the hormones are the body's way of signaling when growth should take place, not the substance which is actually responsible for the growth. In other words, bones, muscles, and so forth are not made of growth hormones, but of countless nutrients. The hormones (from my understanding) just tell the body when it's time to use those nutrients for growth. So I think adequate nutrients have to come first, before the body will decide that it's time to grow. If the additional resources required for proper growth are not present, then it makes sense to me that the body will try to wait until they're available. Otherwise there may be growth deformities.

Oh, and it may be necessary for your son to avoid dairy, soy, corn, and/or other things. Many on this board have found other foods of which they are intolerant or allergic. The top allergens are often top suspects, though not always. If your son has any other health issues, it may be helpful to post about them. There may be something further in his diet which needs to be corrected besides going gluten-free.

Incidentally, that short (and now stunted) person I mentioned never had a nutritious diet. I'm sure that was a factor.

Hi everyone. Although this might sorta fit the "coping with" forum, I think this is a more appropriate place for it.

Anyway, I put together a little WordFind, using Celiac related words. Perhaps it'll help someone who's feeling a bit stressed out. If you have suggestions for additional words to include, go ahead and post them. I can make another puzzle if there's enough interest. The list of words includes spaces so they're easier to read, but the spaces aren't included in the puzzle itself. The words may be diagonal as well as backwards. Hope you enjoy it!

C H R I Q Z C B E E W H I T E R I C E F L O U R V F F M I O 
K A D W R L D H J E L L Q J Q S J R U O L F H T N A R A M A 
T A P I O C A F L O U R G U Y H P O R T A S U O L L I V R Y 
L O N F C V C G M D G I I N H C R A T S T O O R W O R R A Z 
N Y A O Q I E W K G C N V C S O R G H U M F L O U R I L P E 
J F D X H C R A T S O T A T O P H O Y G V W J Z J M L F B Q 
V M B I S M P E Q A B U C K W H E A T F L O U R T Q T F S G 
K D H F R E I Q F X J R R U O L F O T A T O P T E E W S X V 
Y M I Z Z U T L Y C O E X R U O L F A V A F R A G R H S B D 
R F P P F C O Q L F F A C P A J N L A L I E J V J V H X R T 
P R I T P U W L G E N P L N V S O G C V V P I O U I O E U W 
J U N U R I M E F T T B D M A L W V X C B J K F E F K S O G 
T O T T V Q S I H N F F T I O R U O L F T U N O C O C O L K 
O L E V P X S A K N A S L Q Q N E B K V Y N W G Q T L Y F B 
P F S O I J N O K B Y E W O X N D L R P H Z Z Q E U H F N R 
O E T L V G A D P A Y R B S U B H M O D G W D F J L T L A O 
T C I O U D C M B I U X C A D R I B E T R L S H G O I O E W 
A I N M H H D C Y O M O G T V U M A O A N M Y O P X X U B N 
T R A E H S Y O L D R B K P U A R D G N L I Y M H C W R O R 
O T L K U Q L F N N Q Y F C T T F U W N C D N E S W N R Z I 
F E M K L F F X M F E C E L I A C D I S E A S E K M H C N C 
L E U R U F T E O B R C O R N S T A R C H N H K T K R R A E 
O W C T E G A K F N C F U Q M Q O R X B O P I W P U N D B F 
U S O T N L P X I C R N S U N Y L A E M D E E S X A L F R L 
R H S V P W I D R Q D O G G H X D U I R K T K W S K I G A O 
K T A R C G Y A V P M R S Y E L L O W P E A F L O U R M G U 
R O B E P J Z J Q H A Y R X U J L K W B J O G L Q J P S Y R 
W M B L U N K B G U S Z U V F T U Q Y T O E S P W M U M F F 
N J G H R I Y M G B M E M P M G F Q C O R N F L O U R L N U 
N S L Z B X S I M R O F I T E P R E H S I T I T A M R E D S

Word List:
ALMOND MEAL
AMARANTH FLOUR
ARROWROOT STARCH
BROWN RICE FLOUR
BUCKWHEAT FLOUR
CELIAC DISEASE
COCONUT FLOUR
CORN FLOUR
CORN MEAL
CORN STARCH
DERMATITIS HERPETIFORMIS
FAVA BEAN FLOUR
FLAXSEED MEAL
GARBANZO BEAN FLOUR
GARFAVA FLOUR
GLUTEN INTOLERANCE
GUAR GUM
INTESTINAL MUCOSA
MILLET FLOUR
POTATO FLOUR
POTATO STARCH
QUINOA FLOUR
SORGHUM FLOUR
SOY FLOUR
SWEET POTATO FLOUR
SWEET RICE FLOUR
TAPIOCA FLOUR
TEFF FLOUR
VILLOUS ATROPHY
WHITE RICE FLOUR
XANTHAN GUM
YELLOW PEA FLOUR

I think guacamole contains too many things to know if iodine and/or xanthan was the problem.

I think I'd try a pinch of xanthan mixed into a glass of water as a test for it. That way there'd be no question as long as you're careful everywhere else, to be certain that no other culprits might have gotten in under your radar.