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ravenwoodglass

Using Old Drugs For Art, Does Anyone Know...

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I know this is somewhat of an odd question but I am in the midst of doing some paintings that are kind of dealing with my celiac history, suffering and anger. We'll get to the healing ones later. :D

In one of these I plan to use old MRI films, Xrays and pills. I still have my pharmacopia from my prediagnosis days, it fills a tackle box :o . I have used an acrylic preservative on the pills, applying several coats and plan to suspend and embed them within the art work. Some of the meds are 'controlled' substances, all are way out of date and were prescribed to me. Can anyone think of any reason I couldn't use them? I would hate to have an issue with the work after it is finished and probably could sub OTC meds but don't think the impact for me will be the same.

Thanks in advance.


Courage does not always roar, sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying

"I will try again tommorrow" (Mary Anne Radmacher)

Diagnosed by Allergist with elimination diet and diagnosis confirmed by GI in 2002

Misdiagnoses for 15 years were IBS-D, ataxia, migraines, anxiety, depression, fibromyalgia, parathesias, arthritis, livedo reticularis, hairloss, premature menopause, osteoporosis, kidney damage, diverticulosis, prediabetes and ulcers, dermatitis herpeformis

All bold resoved or went into remission in time with proper diagnosis of Celiac November 2002

 Gene Test Aug 2007

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 1 0303

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 2 0303

Serologic equivalent: HLA-DQ 3,3 (Subtype 9,9)

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I guess it matters what u plan on doing with the artwork once you are done, if it will stay in your house, i see no problem with it, if you plan on showing it at an art exhibit i would use tic tacs or something of that nature or you could do that are exactly alike just one with real pills and one without.

Im really intrigued on your paintings. please share some photos when u are done. It sounds like it will be very theraputeic for you.

paula


gluten, casein and soy free

on low carb/low sugar diet

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Quite honestly I would use subsitutes ....

Reason.. someone will be offended, someone will complain if its seen in public.

At least you cover yourself this way...

As it happens the British Museum has a huge expo of pills as art!!

Will try and get you a photo ...


Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt. (JC, De Bello Gallico Liber III/XVIII)

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I don't know about any legal issues, but I would use the real pills. Even a "to-do" about them would draw attention to the excesses of prescription drugs. And I expect that for you, gluing the real thing onto a canvas will be a huge emotional release.

Do the art for the sake of the art, not for the response it might cause.


"But then, in all honesty, if scientists don't play god, who will?"

- James Watson

My sources are unreliable, but their information is fascinating.

- Ashleigh Brilliant

Leap, and the net will appear.

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I know this is somewhat of an odd question but I am in the midst of doing some paintings that are kind of dealing with my celiac history, suffering and anger. We'll get to the healing ones later. :D

In one of these I plan to use old MRI films, Xrays and pills. I still have my pharmacopia from my prediagnosis days, it fills a tackle box :o . I have used an acrylic preservative on the pills, applying several coats and plan to suspend and embed them within the art work. Some of the meds are 'controlled' substances, all are way out of date and were prescribed to me. Can anyone think of any reason I couldn't use them? I would hate to have an issue with the work after it is finished and probably could sub OTC meds but don't think the impact for me will be the same.

Thanks in advance.

I think that is a very unique idea almost like your own medical biography only in the way you see it not the whole medical jumbo.

Someone will always be offended too....what ever happened to open minds? eh?


~~~~Gluten Free since 9/2004~~~~~~

Friends may come and go but Sillies are Forever!!!!!!!

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I don't know about any legal issues, but I would use the real pills. Even a "to-do" about them would draw attention to the excesses of prescription drugs. And I expect that for you, gluing the real thing onto a canvas will be a huge emotional release.

Do the art for the sake of the art, not for the response it might cause.

I agree with what Jess said.

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If you're concerned withthe legality of it, I would call your local pharmacy and see what they say. I know there's legal/illegal methods of disposal, they know what you're supposed to do with what meds. I would think they would be a good resource


Rachelle 20dance.gif

Daughter diagnosed 1/06 bloodwork and biopsy
-gluten-free since 1/06

Son tested negative-bloodwork (8/07), intestinal issues prompted biospy (3/08), results negative, but very positive dietary response, Dr. diagnosed Celiac disease (3/8)

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Thanks for all the replies.

After thinking about it some more I think I really need to use the actual pills. I think what I am going to do is have my local frame shop encase it in a box frame, if I should ever decide to show it. When I worked with youth and we had cases or displays of illegal drugs that is what they did. Maybe check with my local PD to be sure. I don't usually show my work, other than glass.

I do most of my art for me, and I never ever sell my paintings. This one in particular deals with the years and years and years of testing and meds thrown at me. Most did more harm than good. Too many of us are all to familiar with that scenario. I still have a hard time dealing with the anger and the sadness of all those lost years and hope that I can resolve some of those feelings.

But as they say, without pain there would be no art.

I'll post them as I get them finished.

GFP, I would love a link to that exhibit if you can find one.

Again thanks all for your input, it is appretiated.


Courage does not always roar, sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying

"I will try again tommorrow" (Mary Anne Radmacher)

Diagnosed by Allergist with elimination diet and diagnosis confirmed by GI in 2002

Misdiagnoses for 15 years were IBS-D, ataxia, migraines, anxiety, depression, fibromyalgia, parathesias, arthritis, livedo reticularis, hairloss, premature menopause, osteoporosis, kidney damage, diverticulosis, prediabetes and ulcers, dermatitis herpeformis

All bold resoved or went into remission in time with proper diagnosis of Celiac November 2002

 Gene Test Aug 2007

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 1 0303

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 2 0303

Serologic equivalent: HLA-DQ 3,3 (Subtype 9,9)

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Good luck on your painting. I think we all have different ways of working our way through things.

Just one bit of advice, though. If you do decide to use the real thing, make sure it is well out of reach of kids. My Uncle was a Narcotics detective when I was a kid. He had a large board on which he had mounted real meds next to pieces of candy to show how much they can look alike. One day my cousin (age 5 or 6, she couldn't read yet) found the board and started prying the pills off and eating them (may of them looked identical to candy). After a trip to the hospital to have her stomach pumped, he got rid of the board. That was always an entertaining topic of conversation around the table at Christmas. :lol:


-Colleen

Dx 8/05 via bloodwork and biopsy (total villous atrophy)

13-year old son Dx 11/05 via bloodwork and biopsy

Daughters (16 and 5) have tested negative via bloodwork

A woman is like a tea bag - you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water. - Eleanor Roosevelt

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I am intrigued by your idea...cannot wait to see some photos! I've worked through one or two difficult periods in my life by painting them out on big canvases...it can be very cathartic. Here's a link to Cradle to Grave, at the British Museum:

http://www.britishmuseum.org/explore/highl...e_to_grave.aspx


Emily

diagnosed type one diabetic 1973

diagnosed celiac winter 2005

diagnosed hypothyroid spring 2006

But healthy and happy! 253.gif

11 year-old Son had negative blood panel, but went on gluten-free diet of his own volition to see if his concentration would improve, his temper abate, and his energy level would increase. Miraculous response!

The great are great only because we are on our knees.

--Pierre Joseph Proudhon (1809-1865)

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Thanks for all the replies.

After thinking about it some more I think I really need to use the actual pills. I think what I am going to do is have my local frame shop encase it in a box frame, if I should ever decide to show it. When I worked with youth and we had cases or displays of illegal drugs that is what they did. Maybe check with my local PD to be sure. I don't usually show my work, other than glass.

I do most of my art for me, and I never ever sell my paintings. This one in particular deals with the years and years and years of testing and meds thrown at me. Most did more harm than good. Too many of us are all to familiar with that scenario. I still have a hard time dealing with the anger and the sadness of all those lost years and hope that I can resolve some of those feelings.

But as they say, without pain there would be no art.

I'll post them as I get them finished.

GFP, I would love a link to that exhibit if you can find one.

Again thanks all for your input, it is appretiated.

I'll see if I can get over this weekend, its only around the corner.

If its at home then I don't see a problems but I would be very careful about any public showing.

The real problem (from my perspective) is this is the sort of stupid thing that legal systems like to make an example of. They can't touch the criminals dealing illegal drugs but they can make an example of a harmless piece of self expression. Your name in the paper associated with a lot of legal costs might not be the release you are seeking... I'm not saying it would happen .. just if someone has a bee in their bonnet this sort of thing can be very hard to make disappear.

All you need is someone who has a bee in their bonnet (someone who's kid picked up disguarded pharmaceuticals) who's life now revolves around being a busybody on this to make a big fuss....

So keep it at home would be my advice


Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt. (JC, De Bello Gallico Liber III/XVIII)

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If you are in USA you could be violating some obsure, but new FDA law. You need to talk to a lawyer.

Not all pills are created equal: some are Class C which are narcotics - even a mild narcotic like Ambien or Xanax and the C's could post a higher risk for you to have legal troubles. I'd recommend fake pills until you chat with a lawyer. I don't think police would have the correct answer on this one and any answer they give, after you've been arrested the judge would amonish you for not getting an attorney's advice as police cannot take the place of an attorney... At least with the attorney, if he gave you the "ok" and you still got arrested you can sue the attorney for bad advice: you can't sue the police.

I know I am sending the issue into the "extreme case scenario" but stranger things have happened. Remember that expression: The road to hell is paved with good intentions.


Husband has Celiac Disease and

Husband misdiagnosed for 27 yrs -

The misdiagnosis was: IBS or colitis

Mis-diagnosed from 1977 to 2003 by various gastros including one of the largest,

most prestigious medical groups in northern NJ which constantly advertises themselves as

being the "best." This GI told him it was "all in his head."

Serious Depressive state ensued

Finally Diagnosed with celiac disease in 2003

Other food sensitivities: almost all fruits, vegetables, spices, eggs, nuts, yeast, fried foods, roughage, soy.

Needs to gain back at least 25 lbs. of the 40 lbs pounds he lost - lost a great amout of body fat and muscle

Developed neuropathy in 2005

Now has lymphadema 2006It is my opinion that his subsequent disorders could have been avoided had he been diagnosed sooner by any of the dozen or so doctors he saw between 1977 to 2003

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If you are in USA you could be violating some obsure, but new FDA law. You need to talk to a lawyer.

Not all pills are created equal: some are Class C which are narcotics - even a mild narcotic like Ambien or Xanax and the C's could post a higher risk for you to have legal troubles. I'd recommend fake pills until you chat with a lawyer. I don't think police would have the correct answer on this one and any answer they give, after you've been arrested the judge would amonish you for not getting an attorney's advice as police cannot take the place of an attorney... At least with the attorney, if he gave you the "ok" and you still got arrested you can sue the attorney for bad advice: you can't sue the police.

I know I am sending the issue into the "extreme case scenario" but stranger things have happened. Remember that expression: The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Pretty much my feeling ....

Although from my perspective the chance of being found guilty of some obscure FDA law is unlikely BUT the pure cost and hassle of having to deal with it, pay an attorney and go through the process is what I would find offputting.

It always seems to be the "easy examples" which are targetted ...

As a UK judge told the guy he just found guilty last year.. he was extremely sorry to be finding him guilty and thought it was completely unproductive but ....

What did the guy do? Threw some personal post into a public trash bin?

As the judge said, he thought we were meant to be encouraging people to use trash cans not throw litter on the street... yet some busybody went through the trash and found addressed envelopes ....

Is this stupid? IMHO its worse than that but that just seems to be the way of making examples of those with good intentions to try and scare those who habitually have bad ones.


Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt. (JC, De Bello Gallico Liber III/XVIII)

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Thanks all for your input. I think contacting the family lawyer may be the best way to go, I hadn't even thought of that. I had already decided to leave off the 'true' narcotics but would like to be able to use the other stuff. Boy would this tackle box shock my doctors, since they all thought I was a 'drug searcher' the full bottles of pain meds would surprise them. Depending on what the lawyer says I may go with using the ads for the products out of magazine. Of course that means I have to go out and buy mags but with all the ads for drugs. I shouldn't have a hard time finding them, after all I cancelled many mag subsriptions because they were cover to cover drug ads. I am also thinking about using just the bottles, emptied out of course. In a country that is so drug driven it seems bizarre that I should even have to worry about it. But then again we are the top country in the world for imprisoning our citizens so I do realize caution is the best way to go.

Elye, Thanks for the link. Imagine if one of us was used as an example, they wouldn't have been able to fit the display in the building. LOL


Courage does not always roar, sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying

"I will try again tommorrow" (Mary Anne Radmacher)

Diagnosed by Allergist with elimination diet and diagnosis confirmed by GI in 2002

Misdiagnoses for 15 years were IBS-D, ataxia, migraines, anxiety, depression, fibromyalgia, parathesias, arthritis, livedo reticularis, hairloss, premature menopause, osteoporosis, kidney damage, diverticulosis, prediabetes and ulcers, dermatitis herpeformis

All bold resoved or went into remission in time with proper diagnosis of Celiac November 2002

 Gene Test Aug 2007

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 1 0303

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 2 0303

Serologic equivalent: HLA-DQ 3,3 (Subtype 9,9)

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SUCH A GREAT IDEA TO SHARE IN ART WORK.

I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING A PHOTO.

THINK YOU SAID IT WOULD BE BEHIND GLASS,,,,,,,,,,GO GIRL

I LOVE IT.

JUDY


Judy in Southern CA

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Usually I tend to err on the side of caution and maybe I'm just being really naive here, but I would think that if you still have the bottles with the labels on them proving you have legal right to be in possession of the medication, and if you are not making the medication available to others, there should not be any legal issues with making them totally inedible and encasing them within a work of art.


Sandi ~ learning to live in a world obsessed and infested with wheat.

"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows" probably was not referring to us . . .

"For the love of money gluten is a root of all sorts of evil, and some by longing for it have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs." (apologies to 1 Timothy 6:10 (NASB)

The person we most dislike is still a soul for whom Christ died. (David Jeremiah)

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Depending on what the lawyer says I may go with using the ads for the products out of magazine. Of course that means I have to go out and buy mags but with all the ads for drugs. I shouldn't have a hard time finding them, after all I cancelled many mag subsriptions because they were cover to cover drug ads. I am also thinking about using just the bottles, emptied out of course. In a country that is so drug driven it seems bizarre that I should even have to worry about it. But then again we are the top country in the world for imprisoning our citizens so I do realize caution is the best way to go.

Try the drug companies' websites for photos or ads.....or go to public library & look at the Physicans Desk Reference as there are photos in the front and photocopy those photos...


Husband has Celiac Disease and

Husband misdiagnosed for 27 yrs -

The misdiagnosis was: IBS or colitis

Mis-diagnosed from 1977 to 2003 by various gastros including one of the largest,

most prestigious medical groups in northern NJ which constantly advertises themselves as

being the "best." This GI told him it was "all in his head."

Serious Depressive state ensued

Finally Diagnosed with celiac disease in 2003

Other food sensitivities: almost all fruits, vegetables, spices, eggs, nuts, yeast, fried foods, roughage, soy.

Needs to gain back at least 25 lbs. of the 40 lbs pounds he lost - lost a great amout of body fat and muscle

Developed neuropathy in 2005

Now has lymphadema 2006It is my opinion that his subsequent disorders could have been avoided had he been diagnosed sooner by any of the dozen or so doctors he saw between 1977 to 2003

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Hmmmmm......I would not bother contacting a lawyer.....art/creativity is simply expression in any medium - whether one finds it "art" or not is subjective - and people can pretty much use anything.....I say GO FOR IT, and I am absolutely mad for your idea. :)


SUSIE

Diagnosed January 2006

"I like nonsense. It wakes up the brain cells." ~Dr. Seuss

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