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scarlett77

Experiment Or Not

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I hate the idea really but I think I have come to the conclusion that I just cannot tell when my son might have had a gluten reaction. Would any of you knowingly give your child gluten to see what his reaction would be for the sole purpose of identifying it in the future?

My son was diagnosed just before his 2nd birthday (he's now almost 3). What led us to diagnosis in the first place was his size and weight loss. He tested positive on the Celiac panel and with the biopsy. Since at the time he had overlapping issues with the iron deficiency, low thyroid, as well as Celiac it is hard to tell what symptoms are directly from being glutened. I know that the iron and thyroid were a result of the Celiac, but they also masked some of the "traditional" symptoms of it.

Would love to hear your thoughts.


Mommy to James, who is Celiac diagnosis by blood test and confirmed by endoscopy on 9/29/2009. Our household has been gluten free since.

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i dont think its a good idea- 1st you already know he has celiac, giving him any gluten is hurting him. PLUS 2nd- i and maybe many other celiacs could tell you- that our reactions to gluten are not always the same reaction. in the past my reaction to gluten could be "rocks in my stomach" or anxiety, or post nasal drip, or constipation. the last time i had gluten- my heart rate shot up to 160- and i almost vomited. i had to lay on the couch with an ice pak on my head for 20 minutes.

that's why im not so sure your experiment would give you what you're looking for.

?? you may want to "experiment" with other foods- you may find additional allergens... there's a lot of people on here who've had to experiment with dairy, different grains, nightshades, fructose and fructans, corn, soy, etc, etc, etc...

hope that helped


1986- Elevated Speckled ANA/no Lupus.negative Sjorgens

2008- AntiGliadin IGA/IGg~ Negative,TTG IGA/IGg~ Weak Positive, Endomysial Antibody~ Positive, IGA Deficient.

no biopsy (insurance denied)

6/2010- Enterolab Gene Test:

HLA-DQB1 Allele 1 0302

HLA-DQB1 Allele 2 0302

HLADQ 3,3 (subtype 8,8)

7/2010- 100% Gluten Free

8/2010- DH

10/2010-Hypothyroid dx-> 12/2010 Hashimoto's dx + 1/11- Graves dx :(

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i dont think its a good idea- 1st you already know he has celiac, giving him any gluten is hurting him. PLUS 2nd- i and maybe many other celiacs could tell you- that our reactions to gluten are not always the same reaction. in the past my reaction to gluten could be "rocks in my stomach" or anxiety, or post nasal drip, or constipation. the last time i had gluten- my heart rate shot up to 160- and i almost vomited. i had to lay on the couch with an ice pak on my head for 20 minutes.

that's why im not so sure your experiment would give you what you're looking for.

?? you may want to "experiment" with other foods- you may find additional allergens... there's a lot of people on here who've had to experiment with dairy, different grains, nightshades, fructose and fructans, corn, soy, etc, etc, etc...

hope that helped

You make a very valid point that a gluten reaction from him may not be the same every time he is glutened. I guess my issue is that I can't tell when he has had a reaction to anything. I though I could, but I have been doubting myself lately. He is generally a mild mannered child and it is not really apparent when he isn't feeling good. Part of this is because of a thread about McD's fries. Now I know there are some that have no issues and some people would not touch them with a 10 foot pole. I had decided earlier on that they are OK and that I would allow them as a special treat, which he LOVED. I cut them out of his diet completely a few months ago because he started taking more and/or longer naps which could be a sign of either being glutened or low iron. But it was an over time thing that I noticed it. At the same time as the fries I also had been using hair products containing wheat (unknowingly) and had been giving him yogurt that I had believed to be safe. I started hearing about malt flavorings in some yogurts and since I was unable to find information on this particular brand I decided to stop giving it to him just to be safe. So honestly it could have been any one of those daily interactions that may have set him back. He's OK now for the most part, so I'm pretty sure that he's not really reacting to any other allergens...I just want to know what a "glutening" would look like so I can recognize and be able to trace back to an incident. Right now all I have to go on is sweating (which could be from the hot weather) and amount of time he sleeps (which varies depending on his activity level also).

Every time he sees the McD's sign he yells "french fries!". He misses those treats. I wanted to try the fries again after talking to someone who actually used to work for McD's.


Mommy to James, who is Celiac diagnosis by blood test and confirmed by endoscopy on 9/29/2009. Our household has been gluten free since.

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I have 2 non celiac boys. One was not a napper after 3 years old. The other is now 17 and still naps 2-3 times a week. Noting is wrong with him, he's very busy and active. When he was small, sometimes he would go through a period of eating a bunch, then a period of extra sleeping.....then his shoes or clothes wouldn't fit one day. I'm not saying the sleeping may have to do with gluten but maybe not. Also, this one when allergies ( pollen) are bothering him and he hasn't been taking his Clariton, he sleeps extra and extra deeply. Maybe he's just like my J.

I don't know where you live but In& Out as well as 5 Guys have gluten-free fries. He can make them at home with Ore Ida. Let him choose crinkle, steak or circle fries at the store. Then he can wash his hands and put them on a cookie sheet. Show him the buttons to push to turn the oven on. No putting food in & out until he is 5 ft tall ( our rule). Letting him be responsible for listening for the timer and telling you to check. These may be his most favorite fries ever! My boys loved to cook. They still do when no one else will.


 

 

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You can also get sweet potato fries and bake them at home. Just in case he has a reaction to potatoes or nightshades. I wouldn't eat McD's fries myself. Just isn't worth the risk to me.

Not so sure about teaching kids to play with the oven. Sometimes they have a way of making things go haywire that you wouldn't expect. Ornery rascals they is. :D


Proverbs 25:16 "Hast thou found honey? eat so much as is sufficient for thee, lest thou be filled therewith, and vomit it."

Job 30:27 My bowels boiled, and rested not: the days of affliction prevented me.

Thyroid cyst and nodules, Lactose / casein intolerant. Diet positive, gene test pos, symptoms confirmed by Dr-head. My current bad list is: gluten, dairy, sulfites, coffee (the devil's brew), tea, Bug's Bunnies carrots, garbanzo beans of pain, soy- no joy, terrible turnips, tomatoes, peppers, potatoes, eggplant, celery, strawberries, pistachios, and hard work. Have a good day! 🙂 Paul

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ok, so- im not a super sensitive celiac- i do NOT eat McD's fries because i know they contain gluten.. but in the past, i didnt neccesarily have a reaction to them, the way i do from a piece of bread.

also- be aware that some individuals with celiac or gluten intolerance dont express ANY gut symptoms. i read only 1 in 6 Celiacs have gut issues.

AND, last but not least- what led me to investigate MCD's fries, was an article i read about a mother and her autistic boy. once she realized that a gluten free casein free diet COULD possibly help her son- she tried it. his autism completely lifted... she thought the fries from McD's were fine- but when he would eat them- he would get "lost" again... she contacted McD's and found out they indeed had wheat in them. (it's also on their allergen list online).

Chick Filet's fries are gluten free. and In'n'Out i believe (if you're lucky enough to live next to one of those)


1986- Elevated Speckled ANA/no Lupus.negative Sjorgens

2008- AntiGliadin IGA/IGg~ Negative,TTG IGA/IGg~ Weak Positive, Endomysial Antibody~ Positive, IGA Deficient.

no biopsy (insurance denied)

6/2010- Enterolab Gene Test:

HLA-DQB1 Allele 1 0302

HLA-DQB1 Allele 2 0302

HLADQ 3,3 (subtype 8,8)

7/2010- 100% Gluten Free

8/2010- DH

10/2010-Hypothyroid dx-> 12/2010 Hashimoto's dx + 1/11- Graves dx :(

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You make a very valid point that a gluten reaction from him may not be the same every time he is glutened. I guess my issue is that I can't tell when he has had a reaction to anything. I though I could, but I have been doubting myself lately. He is generally a mild mannered child and it is not really apparent when he isn't feeling good. Part of this is because of a thread about McD's fries. Now I know there are some that have no issues and some people would not touch them with a 10 foot pole. I had decided earlier on that they are OK and that I would allow them as a special treat, which he LOVED. I cut them out of his diet completely a few months ago because he started taking more and/or longer naps which could be a sign of either being glutened or low iron. But it was an over time thing that I noticed it. At the same time as the fries I also had been using hair products containing wheat (unknowingly) and had been giving him yogurt that I had believed to be safe. I started hearing about malt flavorings in some yogurts and since I was unable to find information on this particular brand I decided to stop giving it to him just to be safe. So honestly it could have been any one of those daily interactions that may have set him back. He's OK now for the most part, so I'm pretty sure that he's not really reacting to any other allergens...I just want to know what a "glutening" would look like so I can recognize and be able to trace back to an incident. Right now all I have to go on is sweating (which could be from the hot weather) and amount of time he sleeps (which varies depending on his activity level also).

Every time he sees the McD's sign he yells "french fries!". He misses those treats. I wanted to try the fries again after talking to someone who actually used to work for McD's.

McD's fries absolutely have gluten in them. It's right in the ingrediants. http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/nutritionexchange/ingredientslist.pdf

French Fries:

Potatoes, vegetable oil (canola oil, hydrogenated soybean oil, natural beef flavor [wheat and milk derivatives]*, citric acid [preservative]), dextrose, sodium acid

pyrophosphate (maintain color), salt. Prepared in vegetable oil (Canola oil, corn oil, soybean oil, hydrogenated soybean oil with TBHQ and citric acid added to

preserve freshness). Dimethylpolysiloxane added as an antifoaming agent.

CONTAINS: WHEAT AND MILK *(Natural beef flavor contains hydrolyzed wheat and hydrolyzed milk as starting ingredients).

I just can't imagine putting my child through gluten exposure. I wasn't diagnosed due to GI issues, but I stupidly grabbed a handful of Reeses Pieces the other day, and my reaction was very unpleasant, to say the least. We have to protect our children from those things which hurt them, even if they are disappointed. That's the tough part of this job. :)

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McD's fries absolutely have gluten in them. It's right in the ingrediants. http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/nutritionexchange/ingredientslist.pdf

French Fries:

Potatoes, vegetable oil (canola oil, hydrogenated soybean oil, natural beef flavor [wheat and milk derivatives]*, citric acid [preservative]), dextrose, sodium acid

pyrophosphate (maintain color), salt. Prepared in vegetable oil (Canola oil, corn oil, soybean oil, hydrogenated soybean oil with TBHQ and citric acid added to

preserve freshness). Dimethylpolysiloxane added as an antifoaming agent.

CONTAINS: WHEAT AND MILK *(Natural beef flavor contains hydrolyzed wheat and hydrolyzed milk as starting ingredients).

I just can't imagine putting my child through gluten exposure. I wasn't diagnosed due to GI issues, but I stupidly grabbed a handful of Reeses Pieces the other day, and my reaction was very unpleasant, to say the least. We have to protect our children from those things which hurt them, even if they are disappointed. That's the tough part of this job. :)

Sorry, trying to follow the part about the Reese's Pieces...are you saying they were glutened? Reese's are on a lot of published gluten free lists and I bake with their peanut butter chips. Let me know what you meant if you don't mind. Thanks.

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Not so sure about teaching kids to play with the oven. Sometimes they have a way of making things go haywire that you wouldn't expect. Ornery rascals they is. :D

After literally blowing up my family's oven at age 4 I have to agree with this. You don't know when you might be out of the room and he might turn on a burner instead and start a fire.

As to the original posters question, no I would not advise deliberately glutening him. Reactions can differ and you would be doing damage. When he gets a bit older and gets it accidentaly and can tell you how he feels then things may become more obvious. I also won't touch McD's fries. You were in my opinion wise to stop giving them to him. He will get over it.


Courage does not always roar, sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying

"I will try again tommorrow" (Mary Anne Radmacher)

Diagnosed by Allergist with elimination diet and diagnosis confirmed by GI in 2002

Misdiagnoses for 15 years were IBS-D, ataxia, migraines, anxiety, depression, fibromyalgia, parathesias, arthritis, livedo reticularis, hairloss, premature menopause, osteoporosis, kidney damage, diverticulosis, prediabetes and ulcers, dermatitis herpeformis

All bold resoved or went into remission in time with proper diagnosis of Celiac November 2002

 Gene Test Aug 2007

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 1 0303

HLA-DQB1 Molecular analysis, Allele 2 0303

Serologic equivalent: HLA-DQ 3,3 (Subtype 9,9)

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It's weird how this all works. Now that I've been gluten-free for a few years my reactions have changed. Early in, I got all the classic symptoms of celiac with just a cross contamination. But I figured out this summer that I get a rash on my scalp and nothing else when I get trace amounts. My guess is it's DH, but I can't really see it because I have too much hair. I've wondered if I would have a full-blown episode if I ate gluten. I can't see doing that, though. It's too scary because I don't know how sick it would make me.

I can hear your struggle. It must be tough to deal with a child diagnosed so young. But it's obvious you are very conscious of health and are trying to protect him.

Here's a french fry recipe for you that surpasses all others I've tried. It's seems strange, but it really works! They taste just delicious!

Serves 3 to 4. Published July 1, 2009. From Cook's Illustrated.

Flavoring the oil with bacon fat (optional) gives the fries a mild meaty flavor. We prefer peanut oil for frying, but vegetable or canola oil can be substituted. This recipe will not work with sweet potatoes or russets. Serve with dipping sauces (see related recipes), if desired. See "Cutting Potatoes for French Fries," below, for help on cutting even batons.

INGREDIENTS

2 1/2 pounds Yukon Gold potatoes (about 6 medium), scrubbed, dried, sides squared off, and cut lengthwise into 1/4-inch by 1/4-inch batons (see note)

6 cups peanut oil

1/4 cup bacon fat , strained (optional) (see note)

Kosher salt

INSTRUCTIONS

1. Combine potatoes, oil, and bacon fat (if using) in large Dutch oven. Cook over high heat until oil has reached rolling boil, about 5 minutes. Continue to cook, without stirring, until potatoes are limp but exteriors are beginning to firm, about 15 minutes.

2. Using tongs, stir potatoes, gently scraping up any that stick, and continue to cook, stirring occasionally, until golden and crisp, 5 to 10 minutes longer. Using skimmer or slotted spoon, transfer fries to thick paper bag or paper towels. Season with salt and serve immediately.

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I appreciate all your responses. Thank you. I do want to clarify a few points. I do buy frozen fries/tater tots occasionally and sometimes I do make them. That was an very interesting recipe I may have to try that sometime. We do live by an In& Out and do go there occasionally (but anyone will agree the fries are totally not the same). I am aware that the ingredients state wheat on McD's fries but I have seen they were tested to be gluten-free after all the processing so I based my original decision on that. I know the McD's is a hot debate and I didn't really want to open up that can of worms, I was just listing it as an example.

But you are all right...I should not try to experiment because I don't know what kind of reaction he would get. It just bothers me that I don't know. And that's really not enough of a reason to risk the health of my son.


Mommy to James, who is Celiac diagnosis by blood test and confirmed by endoscopy on 9/29/2009. Our household has been gluten free since.

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Yep, that's how it always goes when McD's is mentioned.

If it's about driving through and picking up fries--well, the only place I would trust is Chick-fil-a. Although tasty, their fries are nothing like McD's. I can't think of a safe place to drive thru and pick up fries like McD's. I like those other places fries, but they are different. :( Maybe you can find some other treat?

I wish I had something more to offer.

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Yep, that's how it always goes when McD's is mentioned.

If it's about driving through and picking up fries--well, the only place I would trust is Chick-fil-a. Although tasty, their fries are nothing like McD's. I can't think of a safe place to drive thru and pick up fries like McD's. I like those other places fries, but they are different. :( Maybe you can find some other treat?

I wish I had something more to offer.

It's not so much about the fries or a treat...just the McD's got me thinking about knowing a reaction when I saw it. Kind of like when you first give your little one peanut butter for the first time to see how/if they react. I mean peanut butter is quite healthy, but if you are allergic it can be deadly. So my question was really if you don't KNOW and aren't 100% sure if your kid is allergic to peanut butter, do you still try it? I'm not 100% convinced McD's is safe OR unsafe so I am operating under the "when in doubt don't eat it" logic. Which is the safe play I understand that. I'm sure in time as he gets older and more vocal I will better be able to figure out if he has been glutened. For now I just will have to do my best.


Mommy to James, who is Celiac diagnosis by blood test and confirmed by endoscopy on 9/29/2009. Our household has been gluten free since.

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I assume your doctors will do a follow up blood test and biopsy to be sure he's healing. Feed him reasonably and see how the follow-up looks.

I like In-N-Out fries better than McDonald's. That said, I eat McDonald's fries without hesitation if I'm traveling and don't have healthier choices. (Or sometimes even if I do. ;) ) They've never made me sick and I'm pretty sensitive.

By the way, my first job was at McD's in the '80s and not much has changed as far as their extreme process control. The fryers are all at different temperatures, and there are timers on each of the stations. If you put the wrong food in the wrong fryer, it doesn't cook right, food is wasted, and you get warned and eventually fired.

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boy oh boy- i REALLY hope you naysayers are right!!! cause i really really LOVE mcd's fries!!!


1986- Elevated Speckled ANA/no Lupus.negative Sjorgens

2008- AntiGliadin IGA/IGg~ Negative,TTG IGA/IGg~ Weak Positive, Endomysial Antibody~ Positive, IGA Deficient.

no biopsy (insurance denied)

6/2010- Enterolab Gene Test:

HLA-DQB1 Allele 1 0302

HLA-DQB1 Allele 2 0302

HLADQ 3,3 (subtype 8,8)

7/2010- 100% Gluten Free

8/2010- DH

10/2010-Hypothyroid dx-> 12/2010 Hashimoto's dx + 1/11- Graves dx :(

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My son just had a tTg/celiac screen repeat (something his GI does every 18 months or so, even after 8 years) and it was negative. My son eats a large order of McD fries two or three times a month, and always has. (Naturally, we stay away from super crowded or super dirty McDs, and yes, I know they are bad for him in other ways, I don't care, it's a normality issue) The presence of "wheat" on the label is more of a legal stance than a food issue, but this is all a highly charged issue for people. We eat them.

I would NEVER "test" my son. Firstly, how will you make "no gluten" stick when he's testing YOU on that? Later in his life, you don't want him to become a damaged celiac who thinks it's okay to cheat "sometimes". Secondly, how can he trust you to keep him safe if you slip him some gluten on the sly? How will he learn to trust anyone else to feed him (and you need him to do that in school settings) if his own mom gives him poison?

I get the reaction problem, my husband is a silent celiac. But no, I would never give it to them on purpose.


Mom/wife to celiacs dx 12/03 and 12/04

Success is never final and failure never fatal. It's courage that counts -George Tilton

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