Oxalates And Nightshades

[Flor]

Just a follow up on the biotin deficiency issue, from Susan Owens over at yahoo group trying low oxalates:

"I'm glad you asked that question, for yes, I think anyone suspected of

having oxalate issues should be taking biotin. I did a LONG investigation

of biotin on abmd and sulfurstories a few years ago, and many tried it an

the stories were fascinating, but we didn't understand the link to oxalate

back then. There is a study I've read that says oxalate will not be as

damaging to carboxylase and decarboxylase acitvity IF there is sufficietnt

biotin around. I don't think we really know what 'sufficient" is in our

population, but you moms and dads and others here are just the people to

figure it out.

Nature's way puts out a lozenge that is 1 mg of biotin and it tastes good

and is small. Using this, one can increment up by 1 mg per day, dviding

the dose in the day, and go up to 10 mgs or even higher."

[Rachel--24]

Florence, I've read that article on CFS/glutathione a couple times before and yes....glutathione and the whole methylation cycle are critical for detoxification. Thats the main role of glutathione but things are going wrong in the body when these systems are not functioning as they should...and when the body isnt able to manufacture glutathione as it normally does.

The infections (fungi, viruses, bacteria) and heavy metal toxicity found in the Autistic population are the same things that are identified in those who are diagnosed with CFS...thats why there are so many similarities between these two conditions.

Its these issues that are keeping the body in a chronic state of illness....they affect the immune system and the toxic overload affects every body system. Detoxification is impaired in those of us who become chronically ill and are dealing with alot of allergies or sensitivities.

Supplemenation can help the body to deal with the toxins but ultimately the *source* has to be dealt with to completely resolve a block in the methylation cycle (if there is one). Genetics can play a role but its also the toxins themselves which can impair the bodys ability to detoxify itself.

How does mercury toxicity affect methylation?

Mercury toxicity may disrupt this cycle making it practically unsolvable until the metals are removed.

Mercury is highly attracted to sulfur. If there is mercury floating around, it will gravitate to sulfur compounds and tie them up. Any or all of the sulfur reactions will be faulty, and it will be hard to fix unless (or until) you remove the mercury or other metals.

This is one way that the pathway becomes disrupted. Sulfur is needed to produce glutathione and if its tied up with mercury ...it is not available for the body to use for building glutathione. Detoxification becomes impaired.

Mercury is involved in defeating so many pathways. Mercury may lead to the problems with phenol intolerance too. The mercury disrupts the cysteine pathway, so sulfate is limited and is not supplied for detoxing the phenol compounds (or other compounds).

This leads to food intolerance. Phenols are chemical compounds found in virtually all foods.

If you have read my pathogenesis paper, you know that I now believe that the fundamental biochemical issue in at least a large subset of the CFS patients is that the methylation cycle is blocked. Therefore, I think that the main goal of treatment must be to remove this block and to get the methylation cycle back into normal operation. I believe that it is also true that glutathione depletion is present in these patients and is directly responsible for many of the features of CFS, as I described in my recent poster paper, but I have found in interacting with clinicians as well as with many patients on the CFS internet lists, that it is usually not possible to normalize the glutathione levels on a permanent basis by direct approaches of glutathione augmentation. Instead, it appears that the methylation cycle block must be corrected first, to break the vicious circle that is holding down the glutathione levels.

I agree that its very important to correct a block in the methylation cycle but this is not always easy....especially if the cause of the block remains in the body.

Some autistic kids have had amazing responses to Methyl B12 shots (methylcobalamin). Check out the videos and stories on this site.

Open Original Shared Link

I was actually on this protocol (the shots are very easy to administer) but for me there was no improvement.

[Rachel--24]

I'm very interested in trying this diet. The more I'm reading about and all your posts makes me believe this could help me. Like many of you going gluten free helped but I know there's along road ahead to get to where I feel good. To summarize my problems I could say it started with candida yeast shortly after the birth of my second son in 84. But I think it started way before that with mercury poisoning, just as you Rachel. I have alot of fillings and wanted to get them removed but never did. Twice I've had a filled tooth crack and them had them crowned. Which I don't think was done proper.

Hi Gail!

Looking forward to seeing how you do on the diet. I hope you do get some positive results.

I know for me these foods are definately off limits. They cause immediate aggravation of the already swollen tissue in my sinuses/jaw. This has been going on for so long and I've been avoiding the "trigger" foods for quite some time...but not truelly knowing which chemical compound was causing the problem.

I think there are several natural ocurring as well as synthetic chemicals that I'm having difficulties with but oxalates really makes sense as far as the increase in inflammation in my sinuses.

It was actually more widespread (basically from head to toe) prior to making diet changes but since then it only persists in my head. Even if I do not eat *anything* the inflammation does not subside. To me this indicates that something present in that area is also producing something toxic...could be an oxalate-producing fungi....thats what I'm trying to determine.

I'm going ahead with trying to make a diagnosis and hopefully to start treatment (possibly next week).

I've posted in the OMG thread about my unpleasant Dr. appt. today and how I'm proceeding to get this aspergillus/fungi problem ruled in or out.

Heres the page if you're interested..

Open Original Shared Link

Good to "see" you.

[Judyin Philly]

HI AGAIN

POSTED ON THE 'OMG' FOR YOUR APT TODAY

SO GLAD YOUR GETTING MORE INFO.

YOUR HELPING US HERE ...........HOPE YOU KNOW THAT

HUGS JUDY

[Rachel--24]

Heres more about fungi/oxalate connection...

William Shaw, director of the Great Plains Laboratory has been testing oxalates for years. Shaw reports that arabinose, ( a marker used for yeast/fungal overgrowth on the organic acid test for years) is correlated with high amounts of oxalates. Arabinose is also an important fuel for oxalate production. Candida organisms have been discovered surrounding oxalate stones in the kidney."

Lactose has been found to increase the amount of oxalates. (In an experiment,the Aspergillus Niger fungus produced a large output of oxalates when given lactose )

[Yellow Rose]

Hi All,

It's taken me a couple of hours to read all of this but it is very interesting. I started an elemination diet a week ago that was very restrictive and suppose to help Rhematoid Athritus. For the first 6 days you could only eat, white fish, lamb, carrots, zuchinni, sweet potatoes, rutabagas, peaches, pears, and spring water. I don't like fish or rutbagas so it was a long 6 days. It was suppose to clear all of your symptoms by the 4th day. Then you start adding back in foods one at a time over the next 21 days and see if you react to them. If you don't clear then possibly you have a yeast or bacteria overgrowth. I didn't clear very much and have started adding back in the foods. Today was the first time I reacted and it was to butter. So I am thinking milk or casin is off my list. I am going to note as well if any of the reactions are to high oxalate foods or night shades and will keep you posted.

There was a bacteria cure that involved Pepto Bismal over a couple of days. I will go back and find it and post it tomorrow. I know I have a yeast problem as sugar feeds yeast and every time I eat anything sweet I start itching all over. Does anyone know how to kill the yeast?

Two other things,

Robin, avocados (if you like them) are high in potassium more so than bannanas which I don't really care for either. If you must eat bannanas try them with a drizzle of honey, dash of cinnamon, and pop in the microwave for a minute and a half. It's the only way I will eat them.

Someone else was saying they missed coffee. I just printed up the lists and brewed coffee is on the low oxalate list with instant coffee on the high oxalate list.

Yellow Rose

[Rachel--24]

Florence,

These replies to your posts ended up in the OMG thread so I'm re-posting them here.

They are Rinne's replies.

And thank you for the Rachelville info. Why do you all speak of it in the past tense? Can I be minister of research for Rachelville? Or, um, town jester?

Hi FLorence, I still think of Rachelville a happening place though it is much quieter these days than it once was, you can be anything you want to be in Rachelville as long as you observe the spirit of Rachelville.

Hey you all,

.....

I think it's really a question of what your own body can handle and at what stage of gut damage. For me right now because I have had non-stop diarrhea for two years and fewer than a dozen "good days" I feel like I have to eliminate EVERYTHING that is hard on a damaged gut -- casein, lectins, gluten, oxalates, nightshades, blah blah blah. But it seems like this is highly individual and only through experimentation can we figure out where we are. I think my guts are in the very early stages of healing -- I had hoped, after more than a year of dairy and soy and gluten free, that I would be farther along, but I think now that eating more nightshades and oxalates than I did before being sick probably has delayed my recovery. Or at least that's what I'm guessing for the moment.

.....

Your description sounds a lot like me, after going gluten and dairy free in May of 2006 I continued to eat nightshades until October of 2006, lots of nightshades and then giving them up I was loading up on oxalates without realizing they were a problem too.

[Judyin Philly]

I TOOK THESE FROM THE OMG THREAD BUT I THINK THEY ARE SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO THE KEY AND SO TRUE FOR ME..............

FLORENCE---QUOTE--

I feel like I have to eliminate EVERYTHING that is hard on a damaged gut -- casein, lectins, gluten, oxalates, nightshades, blah blah blah. But it seems like this is highly individual and only through experimentation can we figure out where we are. I think my guts are in the very early stages of healing -- I had hoped, after more than a year of dairy and soy and gluten free, that I would be farther along, but I think now that eating more nightshades and oxalates than I did before being sick probably has delayed my recovery. Or at least that's what I'm guessing for the moment.

.....

RENNI--QUOTE--

Your description sounds a lot like me, after going gluten and dairy free in May of 2006 I continued to eat nightshades until October of 2006, lots of nightshades and then giving them up I was loading up on oxalates without realizing they were a problem too.

THIS IS ME EXACTLY.

I THINK THAT I'M 'DEFEATING' THE ACROPHOBIA AGAIN.................I HATE IT..........GOT IT THE FIRST TIME AFTER SURGERY FOR THE GOITER THE SIZE OF LARGE GRAPEFRUIT...THEN HAD HYPOGYCEMIA....AND WAS STILL TEACHING EVERY DAY BUT THE ANXIETY ATTACKS WERE HORRID.......

DEEP BREATHES................SLOW BREATHING JUDY.....................HERE I GO..............

SO EATING CORRECTLY...........TO BED AT A DECENT TIME LAST NITE AND UP AT 7:30 AM ...UNUSUAL FOR ME..........EARLY........GOT GARDENING CLOTHES ON WITH THE STOCKING AND ALL THE STUFF I HAVE TO DO TO GO OUT....

FEELING PRETTY SECURE........ENJOYING THE WEATHER AND THE OUTSIDE BREEZE..........HAD 2 CUPS OF COFFEE FOR GOD'S SAKE..................NO LIKE IT DID COKE........... IT WAS DAMN COFFEE THAT I'VE BEEN CUTTING OUT FOR LOD....

I'M LUGGING POTTED TREES AND RE-POTTING FOR INSIDE IN THE WINTER.........

RE-POTTING PLANTS TO BRING IN...............I'M FEELING REALLY PROUD AND STONG...........DAMN IT

THE 'D' HITS.

HAS ANYONE EXPERIENCED THIS WITH THE OXALATE DUMPING.????

GOING TO POST ON THE OXALATE THREAD TOO.................JUST SO SICK AND TIRED OF BEING SICK AND TIRED OF ALL THIS...................................HELL SHOULD HAVE WRITTEN THAT BOOK FIRST..............

CATCH YOU ALL LATER AND THANKS FOR LISTENING.........................I'M TRYING TO HANDLE MY ANGER BETTER.........................NO KEEP IT INSIDE...................PHYSICAL WORK SEEMS TO HELP ME WHEN I CAN PHYSICALLY GET MOVING. THIS MAY NOT BE UP LONG AS I MIGHT CHICKEN OUT AND DELETE IT.

THANKS FOR BEING THERE...............AND LISTENING TO MY RANT.

JUDY

[Flor]

Judy,

I'm so sorry. What a rotten day, huh?

I seem to be alternating good days and bad days. Yesterday was good, today is bad. Woke up bloated with my stomach hurting, new joints hurt that have never hurt before. Diarrhea first thing (but that's normal for me). Went to the health food store and had to RUN to their restroom but once I got there, nothing. That happens a lot too.

The uncertainty of when the D will hit makes daily life very difficult. I have a three year old and there are many days I want to take him to the zoo or the library or for a walk in the park and cannot do it.

Anyway, I'm so sorry!

There will be better days ahead!

xoxo

Florence

[Judyin Philly]

Florence. thanks for the note

your doing well and trying so hard.......it will come..............of course this is from the same woman who was 'in the dumpster' this am.

love judy

[Yellow Rose]

Hi Gail!

Looking forward to seeing how you do on the diet. I hope you do get some positive results.

I know for me these foods are definately off limits. They cause immediate aggravation of the already swollen tissue in my sinuses/jaw. This has been going on for so long and I've been avoiding the "trigger" foods for quite some time...but not truelly knowing which chemical compound was causing the problem.

I think there are several natural ocurring as well as synthetic chemicals that I'm having difficulties with but oxalates really makes sense as far as the increase in inflammation in my sinuses.

It was actually more widespread (basically from head to toe) prior to making diet changes but since then it only persists in my head. Even if I do not eat *anything* the inflammation does not subside. To me this indicates that something present in that area is also producing something toxic...could be an oxalate-producing fungi....thats what I'm trying to determine.

I'm going ahead with trying to make a diagnosis and hopefully to start treatment (possibly next week).

I've posted in the OMG thread about my unpleasant Dr. appt. today and how I'm proceeding to get this aspergillus/fungi problem ruled in or out.

Heres the page if you're interested..

Open Original Shared Link

Good to "see" you.

It was actually more widespread (basically from head to toe) prior to making diet changes but since then it only persists in my head. Even if I do not eat *anything* the inflammation does not subside. To me this indicates that something present in that area is also producing something toxic...could be an oxalate-producing fungi....thats what I'm trying to determine.

Rachel,

Check out the following site it might be the answer you are looking for.

www.frot.co.nz/dietnet/resources/ediet_howto.hmt

look at (What if you don't clear) there is a lot of info on toxins in the home that can cause inflamation

there is also a bacteria cure in there as well

and

I found this late last night it talks about meat fats that cause inflamation and foods that are good at reducing inflamation. Personally I am willing to try anything that will fix the pain. If the e-diet doesn't work then I am proceeding on to cutting out the meat fats. It is a couple of pages long and I hope it goes through ok.

Yellow Rose

Diet for a Pain-Free Life

Harris H. McIlwain, MD

University of South Florida College of Public Health

s many as 150 million Americans live with ongoing pain. This usually is caused by such problems as arthritis or injuries to the neck or back.

Being overweight and having a poor diet are crucial factors. Fatty tissue is an endocrine (hormone-producing) organ, just like other organs in the body. Studies show that patients who are overweight produce high levels of cytokines, C-reactive protein and other proinflammatory chemicals -- substances that promote joint and tissue damage and increase pain.

Good news: Losing as little as 10 pounds can significantly reduce inflammation, pain and stiffness -- regardless of the underlying cause of the discomfort. People who combine weight loss with a diet that includes anti-inflammatory foods (and excludes proinflammatory ones) can reduce pain by up to 90%. The effect rivals that of ibuprofen and similar painkillers -- without gastrointestinal upset or other side effects.

PAIN-FREE DIET

The saturated fat in beef, pork, lamb and other meats is among the main causes of painful inflammation. People who eat a lot of meat (including poultry) consume arachidonic acid, an essential fatty acid that is converted into inflammatory chemicals in the body.

Although a vegetarian diet is ideal for reducing inflammation and promoting weight loss (no more than 6% of vegetarians are obese), few Americans are willing to give up meat altogether.

Recommended: A mainly plant-based diet that includes little (or no) meat and poultry... at least two to four weekly servings of fish... and plenty of fiber and anti-inflammatory foods. Patients who follow this diet and limit daily calories to about 1,400 can lose 10 to 25 excess pounds within three months.

Helpful: It takes at least two to three weeks to establish new dietary habits. People who give up meat entirely usually find that they don't miss it after a few weeks -- while those who continue to eat some meat may find the cravings harder to resist.

My favorite cookbooks: Vegan with a Vengeance by Isa Chandra Moskowitz (Marlowe) and Pike Place Market Seafood Cookbook by Braiden Rex-Johnson (Ten Speed).

Here are the best painkilling foods and beverages. Include as many of these in your diet as possible...

RED WINE

Red wine contains resveratrol, a chemical compound that blocks the activation of the COX-2 enzyme, one of the main substances responsible for pain and inflammation. Resveratrol may be more effective than aspirin at relieving pain from osteoarthritis and other inflammatory conditions.

Other beverages made from grapes, such as white wine and grape juice, contain some resveratrol, but not as much as red wine.

Servings: No more than two glasses daily for men, and no more than one glass for women. Alternative source of antioxidants for nondrinkers: Two or more cups of tea daily. Both green and black teas contain epigallocatechin-3 gallate (EGCG), a chemical that blocks the COX-2 enzyme.

BERRIES

Virtually all fruits contain significant amounts of antioxidants, which prevent free radical molecules from damaging cell membranes and causing inflammation. Berries -- particularly blueberries, cranberries and blackberries -- are among the most powerful analgesic fruits because they're high in anthocyanins, some of the most effective antioxidants. One-half cup of blueberries, for example, has more antioxidant power than five servings of green peas or broccoli.

Servings: One-half cup of berries daily, fresh or frozen.

Bonus: Berries are very high in the antioxidant vitamin C, a nutrient that builds and protects joint cartilage.

PINEAPPLE

Fresh pineapple contains the enzyme bromelain, which is in the stem and fruit of the pineapple and inhibits the release of inflammatory chemicals. It has been shown in some studies to reduce arthritic pain. I advise patients with sports injuries to eat pineapple because of its healing powers.

Servings: At least two half-cup servings weekly, more if you're suffering from injuries or an arthritis flare-up. Bromelain also can be taken in supplement form -- 200 milligrams (mg) to 300 mg, three times daily before meals.

GINGER

Ginger contains potent anti-inflammatory substances and was found in one study to reduce knee pain in 63% of patients.

Servings: One teaspoon of ginger daily. Fresh and powdered ginger are equally effective and can be added to food.

FISH

I advise patients to substitute oily fish (such as salmon, tuna and sardines) for meat. Fish has little saturated fat (the main proinflammatory nutrient in the American diet) and is high in omega-3 fatty acids. Omega-3s increase the body's production of inhibitory prostaglandins, substances that lower levels of inflammatory chemicals and can reduce arthritis pain.

Servings: Two to four three-ounce servings of fish weekly or 1,000 to 2,000 mg of fish oil (available in capsule form) daily. If you don't like fish, omega-3s also are found in flaxseed, walnuts and soy foods.

WHOLE GRAINS AND BEANS

These are among the best sources of B vitamins -- especially important for people who eat a lot of processed foods, which are usually deficient in these nutrients. Studies suggest that vitamins B-1 (thiamin), B-6 (pyridoxine) and B-12 (cyanocobalamin) may reduce inflammation.

Other B vitamins, such as B-3 (niacin), also reduce inflammation and may increase natural steroid levels and reduce the risk of osteoarthritis.

Servings: At least one-half cup of whole grains and/or beans daily. Good choices:Brown rice, lentils, chickpeas, black beans and kidney beans.

Bonus: Grains and beans are high in fiber. High-fiber foods promote weight loss by increasing a sense of fullness and maintaining optimal blood sugar levels.

Bottom Line/Personal interviewed Harris H. McIlwain, MD, a rheumatologist and pain specialist with Florida's largest rheumatology practice, and adjunct professor at University of South Florida College of Public Health, both in Tampa. He is coauthor, with Debra Fulghum Bruce, PhD, of Diet for a Pain-Free Life (Marlowe).

[Flor]

G'morning all....

I was reminded reading over at low-oxalate-diet at yahoo about glutamine -- is anyone taking this? I know a lot of people with gut damage do take it and have reported help with it, including post-chemo patients. I took it for awhile and didn't notice any difference.

Also, does anyone understand glutathione supplementation? Rachel -- you seem to grasp this incredibly complicated stuff. Glutathione is needed for methylation, right? But supplementation of it directly doesn't necessarily work if the sulphur pathway is blocked by poisons?

Reading about the low inflammation diet yellowrose posted was helpful and it raises that issue about WHICH road to go down or how to find some way derive benefits from various approaches, even when they are contradictary. Seems like almost all the anti-oxidant foods are high-oxalate, except maybe white grapes and wine.

Do you all tolerate wine okay? I think I do in small amounts.

Fish is obviously a good thing, but not in enormous amounts every day because of the mercury issue, right?

I have not been eating beef or pork, but have been eating lamb and bison, and chicken. The trick about going vegetarian on a low-oxalate diet is that we can't eat soy or beans or whole grains. And most of us aren't eating dairy. That leaves eggs, which I know some of us don't tolerate.

I have also read about how a lot of the green foods (chlorella, etc) can help with detoxifying the body, but I bet they are way high in oxalates. Also, the supplement Zyflamend, which is highly recommended for inflammation, is filled with herbs that are likely high oxalate.

I have yet to understand whether those plant-based digestive enzymes that come in a lot of vitamin supplement mixtures are also high-oxalate or if they're okay.

Anyway, I guess the point is to LOWER oxalates and that there's no perfect road.

Side note: I baked a spaghetti squash yesterday, drizzled with honey and a little cinammon and it went down very well! There are some foods I haven't eaten for a long time (like winter squash) that this LOD is giving me a chance to enjoy. (can you tell I'm trying to find a silver lining?)

I continue to alternate good days with bad days. The mornings I wake up feeling "lighter" in my body generally turn out to be good days. I'm finding a lot of anger surfacing as well. I hope this is part of the "dumping" process -- it's not fun, for sure.

[Rachel--24]

I was reminded reading over at low-oxalate-diet at yahoo about glutamine -- is anyone taking this? I know a lot of people with gut damage do take it and have reported help with it, including post-chemo patients. I took it for awhile and didn't notice any difference.

I took glutamine a few years ago and it did not help. I think the key is understanding what it is that is causing gut damage to begin with. If its foods...then why?? Our bodies should be able to break down these foods w/out problems....its not normal to react this way to foods...so why is that happening??

Thats the way my mind always works. If the answer to the gut damage is Candida and/or parasites...then the next question is why?? Why is my gut flora out of balance...what is bringing my immune system down so that I'm in a chronic state of illness??

The gut can heal very quickly unless there is something chronic going on that prevents that from happening.

Also, does anyone understand glutathione supplementation? Rachel -- you seem to grasp this incredibly complicated stuff. Glutathione is needed for methylation, right? But supplementation of it directly doesn't necessarily work if the sulphur pathway is blocked by poisons?

Glutathione (GSH) is needed for so many things. Its the body's "master" anti-oxidant. All other anti-oxidants depend on the presence of glutathione to function properly.

Each and every cell in the body is responsible for its own supply of glutathione and must have the necessary raw materials in order to produce it.

Glutathione is always in great demand and is rapidly consumed when we

experience any sort of emotional or physical stress, fatigue and even

moderate exercise.

The body needs to build glutathione. One of the amino acids the body uses to build GSH is cysteine (a sulfur compound). If mercury is in the body there will be less cysteine available for GSH production. This is because mercury and sulfur compounds have a strong attraction and will bind together....like magnets. Thats an example of how glutathione can be reduced in the body.

Heres a list of things that can lower GSH in the body:

1) Acidic lifestyle and diet

2) Air and Water pollution

3) Prescription and recreational drugs

4) Ultraviolet and Radiation from cells phones, computers, electrical cars,

power lines, hair dryers, etc.

5) Emotional and physical stress

6) Injury, trauma or burns

7) Heavy metals

8) Cigarette smoke

9) Household chemicals

10) Acetaminophen poisoning

11) Exhaust from motor vehicles

12) Septic shock

Besides its role as the master anti-oxidant its also necessary for proper function of our white blood cells. Healthy growth and activity of the white blood cells depends on GSH.

With proper nourishment the body detoxifies itself efficiently but increasing levels of environmental pollution and synthetic toxins are reducing GSH more rapidly. Our main organs for cellular detoxification are the lymphatic system and the liver. This is where most of the GSH in our bodies will be used. Low GSH impairs lymphatic and liver function.

In my case both my liver and lympthic system are very stressed and overloaded with toxins. The main culprits for me are the heavy metals and infections. This is why I am not healthy. For me (and most others) the GSH is low because of the constant circulation of toxins produced by infections and/or the heavy metals. After that all other toxins begin to accumulate at a faster rate because of the body's inability to detox them....at that point we are in a chronic state of illness.

Also the more burdened we are by toxins the more "reactive" our immune system becomes....especially with leaky gut allowing all kinds of foreign things into the bloodstream. When our immune system becomes stressed like this *anything* can be targeted....even the important things like sulfur.

If the immune system becomes reactive to sulfur this interferes with its normal function in the body. This is one of the problems I've had and it interferes with detoxification. It can cause a disturbance in the sulfation pathway.

Most people supplementing GSH are doing so under the care of a Dr. I'm not sure if its a good idea to embark on something like that without guidance. GSH is very often used in the treatment of Autism and Lyme Disease. It can be administered through IV or in oral form. I take the oral form.

The toxins produced by Borrelia (the bacteria that causes Lyme)....are known to deplete GSH in the body.

According to Dr. Radoff, patients infected with Borrelia burgdorferi have many other infections much like a complex of infections known to occur in AIDS, Babesia, Mycoplasma Pneumonia, HSV I and VI , cytomegalic virus, bartonella, Chlamydia P, EBV, and Ehrlichia.

It could be said that autism is a Borreliosis complex or that autism has a complex of infections. This is well-proven when you test children for these bacterial and viral co-infections. These children are greatly immunosuppressed and have numerous metabolic dysfunctions, including low glutathione, known to be caused by Borrelia infections and increased Reactive Oxygen Species .

The interesting thing is that up to 90% of autistic children test positive for Lyme. I believe the percentage is equal to that or even higher in studies where patients with Fibro diagnoses are tested for Lyme. So I believe that Lyme and co-infections is a major factor in reducing GSH in the body.

Do you all tolerate wine okay? I think I do in small amounts.

I dont tolerate any alcohol at all....unfortunately.

Fish is obviously a good thing, but not in enormous amounts every day because of the mercury issue, right?

Some fish have higher mercury content than others....I would stick to the ones that have smaller amounts of mercury if eating fish. I dont eat fish at all.

I have not been eating beef or pork, but have been eating lamb and bison, and chicken. The trick about going vegetarian on a low-oxalate diet is that we can't eat soy or beans or whole grains. And most of us aren't eating dairy. That leaves eggs, which I know some of us don't tolerate.

The problem with going vegetarian is that you are not supplying your body with the essential amino acids required for detoxification. Those are coming from the animal protein and vegetarians arent benefiting from that.

I have read a few different Dr.'s say that they have never been able to successfully detoxify a vegetarian...for that reason. Most Dr.'s treating someone for heavy metals or anything that depends on the body's ability to detox itself...will recommend high protein diet.

I stick with meats and I feel better on a high protein diet.

Fat-soluble toxins like mercury and PCBs are not eliminated by the body through fasting or through vegetarian diets. This is due to the slow bowel transit time common to people on vegetarian diets, allowing all the mercury excreted in the bile to be reabsorbed back into the body.

Also, mercury is a specific enzyme inhibitor. When there is an allergy to a food, there may be deficient production of that specific enzyme. The powerful enzyme-destroying abilities of mercury, I believe, make it a prime suspect as an important cause of most allergies.

A mercury-induced deficiency of digestive enzymes and a mercury toxic liver that does not filter out the foreign proteins in the blood are important factors in food allergy.

This is very true...as seen in Autism. Mercury is capable of blocking any enzyme in the body....it is known that the DPPIV enzyme is easily inactivated by mercury. The DPPIV enzyme is required for breaking down gluten and casein.

Mercury and chronic infections tend to lower the body temp. Allergic reactions caused by undigested food particles can also lower the body temp. Enzymes are affected by body temp. Bringing the body temp. up (even 1 degree) can improve enzyme function...allowing these foods to be broken down before they can cause the immune system to react.

I have also read about how a lot of the green foods (chlorella, etc) can help with detoxifying the body, but I bet they are way high in oxalates. Also, the supplement Zyflamend, which is highly recommended for inflammation, is filled with herbs that are likely high oxalate.

I do think they are very high in oxalates. I have to take things to help with my chelation therapy and my Dr.'s have had difficulties finding things which I can tolerate. I have never tested well for chlorella. One of my Dr.'s had said that my body just doesnt want anything to do with anything "green" or "with color".

Its very true....I do not do well with plant-based things.....most veggies, herbs, algaes, etc.

I am currently taking something called porphyrazyme (in place of chlorella) which I can tolerate in small amounts..but it does contain things which are high-oxalate.

Is winter squash low oxalate?? I have problems with it...as well as all other squashes. Oxalates is not my only problem though. I have trouble breaking down lots of food compounds.

I continue to alternate good days with bad days. The mornings I wake up feeling "lighter" in my body generally turn out to be good days. I'm finding a lot of anger surfacing as well. I hope this is part of the "dumping" process -- it's not fun, for sure.

Detox brings unresolved emotional issues or conflicts to the surface. Its part of the healing process. If the emotions are supressed it can actually stop the body from detoxing/healing.

A Dr. who is one of the world's leading experts on mercury detox has said that our bodies will store toxins during times of emotional stess, unresolved conflicts, trauma etc. If we hold onto these issues we do not release those toxins. In his patients that are not successfully detoxing with treatment....its very often the emotional issues that are holding them back.

[Yellow Rose]

Is winter squash low oxalate??

Rowans Resources The low oxalate diet has acorn squash listed in the low oxalate area. I checked several other lists and not one had any kind of winter squash listed.

Yellow Rose

[Judyin Philly]

GOOD MORNING ALL

LAST POST AFTER I 'CLEANED UP A INACCURATE POST IN OMG THREAD'

RACHEL......I HAD TO COMMENT ON THIS LAST QUOTE OF YOURS BEFORE I GO ....

""""A Dr. who is one of the world's leading experts on mercury detox has said that our bodies will store toxins during times of emotional stess, unresolved conflicts, trauma etc. If we hold onto these issues we do not release those toxins. In his patients that are not successfully detoxing with treatment....its very often the emotional issues that are holding them back.

WELL I HAVE A REAL PROBLEM WITH 'HOLDING ANGER IN' SO LET'S JUST SAY...........

MAYBE I'M DETOXING..............BECAUSE ALL YOU KNOW IF YOUR READ YESTERDAYS POST..........

I SURE RELEASED TOXINS YESTERDAY ...............AND TODAY I FEEL GREAT.

LOVING HUGS TO YOU ALL.

jUDY

[bluejeangirl]

I'm learning so much about myself in this thread, its just amazing. I still have so much to learn and will do that this week, kinda hard on weekends. I can tell just three days on the diet I feel so much better. No dumping yet so I must be in sort of a grace period before stuff starts to happen. I sleep better, my head is clearer and I don't get the head rushes I freguently get. Less burping and gas. My pain in my joints went from an 8 down to a 4. So this is working for me.

The difficulties are finding enough to eat. Today I made some muffins from the SCD book recipe section. It calls for almond flour but I used coconut flour and they turned out great. I'm eating alittle dairy like cottage cheese on my necturines but I seem to have just a low threshold with dairy....I only seem to get mucousy if I eat more then 1/2 c. of it.

I do eat alot of protein but I always have. Carbs are my enemy and veggies just don't fill me up. Yellow Rose I ate like that for the past 2 years and I didn't feel any better. We spent well over $250 on food a week, for 3 people. My husband pushed it to, nothing but the best. Still sick, tired and achy. Arachidonic acid is mostly in red meat and mainly marbalized steaks. I wouldn't worry about it in other leaner meats.

Wine is good but haven't been drinking it lately I think if I find one with no sulfites I'll try it to see if it works for me. But it hurts my bladder more then anything. Thats improved TOO I haven't had bladder pain in two days.

Rachel, amazing stuff I'm learning from you. So if mercury is taking out the neccessary sulfur could you just take it in suppliments like MSM or are you messing with the mercury by doing that? I love all foods that contain sulfurs like onions and garlics should I eat more? I do take a glutathione suppliment called reduced glutathione. It says 100 mgs of l-glutathione (reduced) (free-form) what ever that means.

I took l-glutamine and Sam-e about a year ago when I had to stop because it was making me so hyper. I wouldn't even sleep...I would just stare up at the ceiling. I then read it does that to some people. I was in a manic state and not coming off it. I stopped taking it and got better so I guess not for me. I think Sam-e has alot of sulfur in it too....hmmm maybe I don't handle sulfers to good.

Interesting what was said about the slow bowel and how that isn't good because of reabsorbtion of toxins. Another thing I worry about but with this low oxalate diet I know to make it work I have to have three to four servings of fruit. I mostly have apples, pears or necturines. I've been peeling the apples, chop it up and cooking it and having it warm with alittle fage (greek yogurt) on it. Its the only yogurt I tolerate. I'm eating about 4 to 6 servings of vegetables mostly cooked, and I don't see any problems with bowels. In fact I always to better without grains. Grains slow things down.

Its easy to see why I'm so toxic. Another thing that happened to me is I lost 40 lbs of weight in a short period of time which is what lead me to discovering my gluten intolerence. Alot of toxins are stored in fat tissues and I think I did my liver in with tying to toxify my body. It probably wasn't working that good in the first place and it was just pushed over the edge.

Well I want to say more but this is getting to long I have to try and understand this alittle better and read all the good links everyone has been sending.

Judy, I'm glad your doing better today...do you have an I-pod? I have this song I'm listening to alot and it really helps me. If you have one let me know.

Gail

[Judyin Philly]

THANKS GAIL.

YES, BETTER TODAY I GUESS THAT'S WHY WE KEEPING 'PLUGGING AWAY'

I DON'T HAVE AN I-POD.

IS YOUR TUNE ON U TUBE?

THANKS JUDY

[Judyin Philly]

WOULDN'T LOAD THUS DOUBLE POST SORRY

[Yellow Rose]

Blue Jean Girl,

I am at my wits end. 53 and not getting any younger have been in extreme pain for a solid year now. When first going off gluten got better but seem to have hit a plateau. I know it's something I am putting in my body on a daily basis so the e-diet made sense. But I didn't clear at all. So now am adding back in foods one at a time. The only thing I do eat a lot of is meat. Chicken, beef, pork, turkey I would rather eat meat than veggies and I love veggies. I have reacted to butter, chocolate, potatoes, and peaches so far but none of the meats made me react. Butter and chocolate indicate milk to me and potatoes high oxalte peaches medium oxalate. So I am thinking we may be on to something here. Think I'm gonna go get a huge poster board and graph this as I go along and see if I can make a positive connection. Will keep everyone posted as I go along.

Yellow Rose

[Flor]

Rachel,

Thank you so much for all your experience and information! What a resource!

Because I've stepped into a lot of this communication midstream, could I bother you to give just a quick overview of where you are -- treatment and symptoms?

I know Lyme and mercury have come up repeatedly -- are those your main diagnoses? Do you have a sense about how you got Lyme and mercury poisoning?

And it sounds like you're having a lot of sinus symptoms? How are your guts? Does the diet you've been on manage those symptoms?

On other stuff...

Winter squash: my guess is, but I don't know for sure, is that all winter squash is low oxalate. They are so closely related botanically, it would be weird if one was and another wasn't.

Susan Owens' sulfurstories site has a bunch more info this morning on biotin and oxalates and detoxing pathways. Too much to copy here, but those interested might go check it out.

Seems like two main points:

1. Biotin deficiency is linked to more problems that they previously realized -- including ability to deal with oxalates and building blocks needed for methylation.

2. Oxalobacter formigenes, the probiotic they're getting FDA approval to manufacture but is otherwise naturally-existing in our guts and is custom designed to take apart oxalates -- It turns out it's killed by the following antibiotics (at least):

chloramphenicol (chloromycetin)

nalidixic acid (no longer used in US)

erythromycin

clarithromycin (Biaxin)

co-amoxiclav (Augmentin)

metronidazole (flagyl)

and doxycycline (the only tetracycline they studied).

I took three of these during pregnancy and after. So, hmmmm, interesting!

I'm just over a week eating low oxalate and some days have been worse than before, some better. Nothing definite to report yet except it does seem like there's more CHANGE going on and hopefully that's good.

[dlp252]

Hello all, I'm so very interested in this topic, but haven't read the whole thread yet, lol. I'm printing it off now, and will read it and then hopefully join the discussion.

[Rachel--24]

So if mercury is taking out the neccessary sulfur could you just take it in suppliments like MSM or are you messing with the mercury by doing that? I love all foods that contain sulfurs like onions and garlics should I eat more? I do take a glutathione suppliment called reduced glutathione. It says 100 mgs of l-glutathione (reduced) (free-form) what ever that means.

Yes...if you have alot of mercury stored in your body taking something like MSM could move it around. Unless you're going through a detox program under the care of a Dr. its not good to mess with it. Mobilizing it can cause it to be moved and stored somewhere else where it may cause more damage.

If you have no problems with sulfur foods then it may be ok for you. You can try it and see how you feel but if you feel "off"...it could be moving heavy metals around. If you start feeling kinda crazy or depressed....thats mercury for sure.

I take the L-glutathione reduced also. Its a powder....I take a very tiny scoop under my tongue 4 x a day.

[Rachel--24]

1. Biotin deficiency is linked to more problems that they previously realized -- including ability to deal with oxalates and building blocks needed for methylation.

Biotin is another thing linked to fungus/yeast.

It is extremely important to know that the conversion of the yeast form to the fungal form of Candida is partially dependent upon biotin deficiency. Dr. Yamaguchi and colleagues have recently found that when biotin is added to the medium in high levels, it can prevent the conversion of the yeast form of Candida to its fungal form. They have also found that the fatty acid oleic acid seems to prevent this same conversion.

This concept has been used very successfully in conjunction with the Lactobacillus acidophilus culture to treat Candida Albicans. Biotin is given orally (1,000 mcg. taken three to four times daily) along with two teaspoons of olive oil taken three times daily, as a source of oleic acid. This is done along with a higher than normal fiber diet, using oat bran fiber, to increase the absorptive surface area of the fecal material and to hasten the elimination of metabolic by-products. This may have to be continued for a period of one to six months, depending on the severity of the infection and the length of time that there has been a Candida problem.

Once the organism is arrested in its growth and has been converted back to the yeast form, a program is then instituted to facilitate the healing of the gastrointestinal mucosa. This program includes higher levels of zinc (30 to 50 mg a day), vitamin A (25,000 to 30,000 units a day), vitamin E (400 to 800 I. U. per day), and Vitamin B5-calcium pantothante (200 to 1000 mg per day). The success of this program is determined by the improvement of symptoms, which could be everything from pan allergic syndrome to headaches, to acne, or menstrual irregularities.

Candida has also been linked to: mercury (amalgam) poisoning, diabetes, ME (Chronic Fatigue), Post Viral Fatigue syndrome, AIDS and Cancer. Like Candida, all these are linked with an inability of the immune system to cope.

Aspergillus is the most common genus of fungi in our environment with more than 160 different species of mold. Sixteen of these species have been documented as causing human disease. Aspergillosis is now the 2nd most common fungal infection requiring hospitalization in the United States. Exposure to aspergillus can often cause skin rashes and hair loss.

Many people seek relief by taking 5,000 mcg. of biotin per day with 3,500 mgs. of MSM. Beware, many vitamins and supplements are made with the aspergillus fermentation process or other types of fungi that the vitamin manufacturers fail to reveal.

[jerseyangel]

Hello all, I'm so very interested in this topic, but haven't read the whole thread yet, lol. I'm printing it off now, and will read it and then hopefully join the discussion.

Hi Donna!

Yea! Happy reading and I'm so glad you are joining us

[jerseyangel]

Biotin is another thing linked fungus/yeast.

Thanks for this--the more I read about biotin, the more I know I should be taking it.