• Ads by Google:
     




    Get email alerts Celiac.com E-Newsletter

    Ads by Google:



       Get email alertsCeliac.com E-Newsletter

  • Announcements

    • admin

      Frequently Asked Questions About Celiac Disease   09/30/2015

      This Celiac.com FAQ on celiac disease will guide you to all of the basic information you will need to know about the disease, its diagnosis, testing methods, a gluten-free diet, etc.   Subscribe to FREE Celiac.com email alerts What are the major symptoms of celiac disease? Celiac Disease Symptoms What testing is available for celiac disease? - list blood tests, endo with biopsy, genetic test and enterolab (not diagnostic) Celiac Disease Screening Interpretation of Celiac Disease Blood Test Results Can I be tested even though I am eating gluten free? How long must gluten be taken for the serological tests to be meaningful? The Gluten-Free Diet 101 - A Beginner's Guide to Going Gluten-Free Is celiac inherited? Should my children be tested? Ten Facts About Celiac Disease Genetic Testing Is there a link between celiac and other autoimmune diseases? Celiac Disease Research: Associated Diseases and Disorders Is there a list of gluten foods to avoid? Unsafe Gluten-Free Food List (Unsafe Ingredients) Is there a list of gluten free foods? Safe Gluten-Free Food List (Safe Ingredients) Gluten-Free Alcoholic Beverages Distilled Spirits (Grain Alcohols) and Vinegar: Are they Gluten-Free? Where does gluten hide? Additional Things to Beware of to Maintain a 100% Gluten-Free Diet Free recipes: Gluten-Free Recipes Where can I buy gluten-free stuff? Support this site by shopping at The Celiac.com Store.

Rye Bread
0

5 posts in this topic

I SEEM TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE RYE BREAD WITHOUT TROUBLE. I DO LOOK FOR RYE FLOUR ON THE BREAD BECAUSE SOME RYE BREADS CONTAIN HI GLUTEN FLOUR. DOES ANYONE HAVE THE EXPERIENCE OF BEING TOLERANT OF CERTAIN FOOODS WHICH WERE THOUGHT TO BE OFF-LIMITS?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ads by Google:
Ads by Google:


Well, the current wisdom is that rye, and barley contain gluten and are off-limits, as you say.

You do raise a good question. Corn has gluten,too, I believe--at least, I see "corn gluten" on ingredient lists occasionally, yet it does not seem to be a problem for most celiacs, though many have reported developing an intolerance to corn as well as to gluten.

Some celiacs have reported that they had able to tolerate sourdough bread (made with regular flour), and others report that they had not had problems with spelt.

Perhaps these people have a wheat-specific allergy rather than what is believed to be the standard definition of celiac? Or perhaps celiac is different than what we believe?

I have long wondered if the current understanding of celiac is either inaccurate or incomplete or both. There is an awful lot of debate over the difference between gluten intolerance and celiac, but the only officially "acceptable" diagnosis of celiac is via intestinal biopsy--which itself has an extremely high false negative rate unless the villi are uniformly severely damaged.

There are also people with NO visible intestinal damage who have active celiac in the form of DH (though most DH sufferers probably do have some intestinal damage). Genetic testing is not an accurate diagnostic tool, as some people with biopsy-diagnosed celiac do not have any of the genes that mark a predisposition to celiac.

Canadian Karen posted a fascinating article a while back on the DNA of wheat--the wheat grown today, that has been genetically modified over the last couple of hundred years to have more gluten. Here is the article:

THE NATURAL HISTORY OF WHEAT

"The Roman Empire was built on Egyptian wheat, which they called "korn". It was Einkorn, which is the ancestor of modern wheats. (In Latin, this was the earliest form of Triticum, not to be confused with what we call "corn", which is Zea.)

It had two sets of chromosomes like human beings and is described as 2N or diploid. There were also some naturally occurring wheat that had four sets of chromosomes, or 4N or tetraploid. This was the wheat that the Roman Emperor, Eqyptian pharoahs and Christ were eating.

But what is on our table has been selectively bred over time to increase the gluten content for baking or pasta-making. Most are hexaploid, octoploid, double hexaploid, or hexaploid-octoploid hybrids. This means that they have 6, 8, 12, or more sets of chromosomes. Some of this extra DNA is coding for amino acid sequences that human beings cannot break down, including a 33-amino acid sequence named 33-MER. This 33-MER is what is causing the problem for celiac. Our immune systems are attacking this chain as though it were an invader or parasite. But this sequence is also similar to human tissue, and this inflammation can progress into an auto-immune disease. This auto-immune phase is really damaging, and largely incurable. Control is the only treatment, and life-long gluten free diet is the only control."

I wouldn't go out and eat rye bread or sourdough at this point, though, even if you don't have obvious symptoms. Heck, I don't even eat oats, and Scott has an article on celiac.com that says that studies show that oats do NOT do damage to celiacs. I am too afraid of developing still more autoimmune disorders. I will never forget that miserable feeling of being severely allergic to my own skin; I never want to go through that or anything like that again. And I know too many people with fibromyalgia, lupus, MS, RA, and other similarly gluten-induced or gluten-exacerbated illnesses to feel that eating a piece of bread is worth that kind of risk.

But I think we SHOULD be asking questions like this, and keep asking them until (decades later) more studies are done, and we know more than we do today.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rye flour has gluten but it's low in gluten. Not nearly as much as wheat. Most rye breads in the store will have wheat flour in them to get a better rise. They are selling a sour dough german rye bread in our local health food store right now. It does look good so I bought it for my husband. He loves it. The other thing I know about rye is that its a hearty grain and can grow under the toughest conditions. And for some reason its suseptable to mold.

Gail

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi

Is there a book or souce that this is from? Would love to share the info and attribute it

thanks

Ken

--

THE NATURAL HISTORY OF WHEAT

"The Roman Empire was built on Egyptian wheat, which they called "korn". It was Einkorn, which is the ancestor of modern wheats. (In Latin, this was the earliest form of Triticum, not to be confused with what we call "corn", which is Zea.)

It had two sets of chromosomes like human beings and is described as 2N or diploid. There were also some naturally occurring wheat that had four sets of chromosomes, or 4N or tetraploid. This was the wheat that the Roman Emperor, Eqyptian pharoahs and Christ were eating.

But what is on our table has been selectively bred over time to increase the gluten content for baking or pasta-making. Most are hexaploid, octoploid, double hexaploid, or hexaploid-octoploid hybrids. This means that they have 6, 8, 12, or more sets of chromosomes. Some of this extra DNA is coding for amino acid sequences that human beings cannot break down, including a 33-amino acid sequence named 33-MER. This 33-MER is what is causing the problem for celiac. Our immune systems are attacking this chain as though it were an invader or parasite. But this sequence is also similar to human tissue, and this inflammation can progress into an auto-immune disease. This auto-immune phase is really damaging, and largely incurable. Control is the only treatment, and life-long gluten free diet is the only control."

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ads by Google:


Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
0

  • Forum Statistics

    • Total Topics
      106,466
    • Total Posts
      930,723
  • Member Statistics

    • Total Members
      63,898
    • Most Online
      3,093

    Newest Member
    alfonzo nelson
    Joined
  • Popular Now

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • JaneWhoLovesRain, what is odder to me than that there is an older disease that Doctor's have forgotten that explains many of the same symptom's and doctor's do not even think about it today since the "War on Pellagra" was declared over a 100 years and why doctor's don't (at least in the West) think about it any more. Dr. Heaney wrote a nice online article about this topic. http://blogs.creighton.edu/heaney/2013/11/18/pellagra-and-the-four-ds/ Here is fairly recent article about how Pellagra can present in patients and the title says' it all from the International Journal of Dermatology. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/227807440_Pellagra_Dermatitis_dementia_and_diarrhea Dermatitis, dementia and Diarrhea are the 3 D's (4th D is death) of Pellagra. Typically it is only diagnosed today if you are in a subset of the population like an alcoholic for example or you have a gastric bypass. See this article from the New England Journal of Medicine http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMicm050641 and despite all the signs of Pellagra (skin issues etc.) . . .. Pellagra in it native tongue (Italian) where it was first diagnosed was called "rough/sour skin" who knows that today??????? Very few I would venture to guess. The NEJM can only say they have "Pellagra-like dermatitis" it has been so long since any doctor's seen it they can't (with confidence) diagnose it clinically. But taking Niacinamide 3/day for 6 months can help alleviate your symptom's if indeed the DH of Celiac is the dermatitis of Pellagra being medically misdiagnosed. Here is a an article featured on celiac.com about why/how Pellagra can be confused for Celiac disease. https://www.celiac.com/articles/24658/1/A-Differential-Diagnosis-How-Pellagra-Can-be-Confused-with-Celiac-Disease/Page1.html Because they haven't seen Pellagra in 75+ years no one recognizes it anymore. ****this is not medical advice. I hope this is helpful. Knitty Kitty and I are the Niacin warriors on this board. See this thread where Knitty Kitty says Niacin helped the itching of DH. If that is so then it might help your DH (if you have it) and your GI problems too if they are caused by co-morbid Pellagra. see my blog post about where I say "I had Celiac Disease and Developed Pellagra" that talks about this in more detail. Again good luck and your continued journey and I hope this is helpful. 2 Timothy 2: 7 “Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things” this included. posterboy by the grace of God,
    • I should say I am confused about how to interpret---   Does this mean celiac or no celiac?   Thank you all---I greatly appreciate it.
    • KathleenH, I swear by MatteosPizza and they make National Delivery. I have been known to buy them by the dozen. https://www.matteospizza.com/ BellaMonica's is not a bad corn based crust.  By not bad I mean "suprisingly good" that can be bought at most grocery stores. Here is there ZIP locator page to see if they are carried in your local area. http://glutenfreepizza.typepad.com/gluten-free-pizza/where-to-find-bella-monica.html I hope this is helpful. posterboy,  
    • Hey all--have Hashimoto's and am being worked up for epigastric discomfort and IBS like symptoms---   My blood work had an IgA within the lower end of normal range, negative TTG, but weakly positive DGP.   My endoscopy showed a "nodular" duodenum with the biopsy stating there was "reactive lymphoid hyperplasia"...   I have a follow-up with the GI in 3 weeks.   Wondering about any help?
    • DH wasn't linked to celiacs until 1967 from my research...
  • Upcoming Events