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Nisa's Mama

My Baby Is In Pain!

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hi. i stumbled on this group by looking up "problems passing gas" and i read a post in june by Diane about her son and problems at night. My DD has those same problems and no one could tell me why she was just crying and waking at night (and naps). she is 9 months old. i am breatfeeding her and i have been on the elmination diet now for two weeks and she is still waking every hour or less! she is also fine in the day time but cries all night and can't sleep unless i am holding her. she used to cry and then pass gas, but lately she hasn't been passing gas at all, and just like your son, nurses till she passes out for another hour or less. :( except lately she hasn't been passing gass at all and is still in just as much pain! i give her milicone drops (symethicone), are those gluten free? i thought so. how long does the gluten take to get out of our systems? for two weeks all i have eaten (and fed her) is rice, rice milk, green beans, cabbage, dried peas and lentals, peeled pears, and free-range turkey. i didn't know if it was sals or amines, but since reading your email it sound JUST like her!! the doctor said "if she isn't in pain in the day, why is she in the night?" it was like no one believed me that she is hurting soo bad. passing gas seems so painful for her, and now she hasn't been passing any at all but is still up crying all night!! please help! i will try the bouncing up and down thing, she cries if i rub her tummy. but like you said, it is all night so i just lay her next to me and end up being up ALL night. help!

~Barbara

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I'm certainly no expert on the baby end of things, but I know that cabbage can cause gas. Colic also sounds like a possibility. And do you have celiac?

richard

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no i don't have celiac, but her great grama (on her dad's side) says she gets horrible stomach aches when eating bread. i haven't eaten cabbage in a few days. i just don't know why she isn't passing gas anymore and is still in so much pain!

~Barbara

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Guest j_mommy

Sounds alot like collic...which sadly you have to wait until they grow out of that!

I am much older than my sisters and I have a son....I was in high school(Junior yr) my mom had her second child(Whoops!LOL) and we would take turns walkign with her at night...we would each take a shift.....thsi went on from about 3 months-1 yr)

None of teh drops ect worked for her either....I'm the only one that has tested positive and she(my sister) has tested negative!!!

I woudl defiently not eat anymore cabbage!

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when your sister was a year old, it just stoped? she has been like this since birth, but got where she was sleeping 4 hours at a time, now she woke 5 times in the last two hours!! :( she got real bad, so i went on this special diet, was your mom breast feeding?

~Barbara

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rice dream, it says it's gluten free. should i have seen some improvement in 2 weeks? any idea why she isn't passing gas?

Nisa's Mama

I would not trust Rice Dream. It has said in the past that it contains a small amount of barley. I use the rice beverage from Pacific. This is good.

"Forget what I said about Rice Dreams. I just read this thread and found out that, while the packaging has changed, the formula has NOT."

I just found this on the thread about soy milk. I hope this helps.

Susan

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Hi

I had the same problem with my dd...we would call her angel by day and TERROR by night....sad but true

Haveyou ever considered reflux....treating her with some reflux meds just at night (even a little OTC mylanta or MoM...might help with the tummy issues gas)

i would also avoid all gassy foods...cabbage, beans and peas (peas are related to soy and if she can't tolerate soy, peas may be too much for her)

Sorry for what you are going through

GOOD LUCK

Kim

when your sister was a year old, it just stoped? she has been like this since birth, but got where she was sleeping 4 hours at a time, now she woke 5 times in the last two hours!! :( she got real bad, so i went on this special diet, was your mom breast feeding?

~Barbara

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Barbara, I'm sorry your daughter is having so much nighttime pain - and that you are not getting sleep either! I DEFINITELY understand what you are going through!! Likely foods (and/or reflux) are definitely affecting her.

1. I stopped using Rice Dream due to the things I've read in the past about the small gluten content. The link that Susan posted didn't take me anywhere so I don't know what the newest information is. But, I switched to either the Pacific rice milk or the Hannaford rice milk (it is the store brand at my local Sweetbay grocery store). I don't know if the small amount of gluten in Rice Dream is actually a problem for my son or not, but I decided to stop taking that chance. I have not added tree nuts to my diet yet so I don't know how my son would do on Almond milk. If you are able to do potatos, there is a potato milk that some use ("Vance's DariFree Fat-Free Non-Dairy Milk Alternative from Potatoes" - http://www.vancesfoods.com/darifree.htm). I am planning on trying that soon, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

2. My son is has MFPI (multiple food protein intolerance) and is intolerant of milk, soy, and gluten. He also had a slightly elevated RAST allergy test result for peanuts. So, I personally have chosen to stay away from eating all legumes and even including green beans. According to WebMD: "Soybeans are legumes. Other foods in the legume family include navy beans, kidney beans, string beans, black beans, pinto beans, chickpeas (garbanzo or chichi beans), lentils, carob, licorice and peanuts."

3. Congrats on continuing to breastfeed through all of this. Even though it might be hard to deal with your diet and hers at the same time, at least you can comfort her through the nighttime gas pain and sucking often helps pass the gas. (My son has never taken a pacifier, so sucking on it hasn't been an option.)

4. Let me point you to some other areas of possible help:

(1) The book "Colic Solved" by Dr. Bryan Vartabedian (www.colicsolved.com) is a Must Read in my opinion. He is a ped GI who specializes in dealing with "colicky" babies. I sat there and SOBBED as I read the first pages. It was such validation to me to read a doctor saying what I already knew - there is no disease called "colic" so "colic" can NEVER be a diagnosis!! Colic is a description of symptoms. A baby can, of course, have a high-needs temperament and need extra swaddling or shushing or swaying. But babies like ours are in pain - typically due to misdiagnosed reflux and/or milk (or other) protein intolerances and are in need of medicines or diet changes to truly solve their "colic". I just wish that this book had been in print 18 months ago when I really needed it!

(2) A new non-profit organization has been formed to provide information and support for parents of protein intolerant children (PIC). It is called The PIC Foundation and the website is www.thepicfoundation.org. On the Parents Connections tab, the 1st and 4th links are especially helpful (a MSPI forum and a reflux forum). And on the Breastfeeding tab, there are some links to information, recipes, product info, etc., that some of us have compiled about surviving on a limited TED diet. I would highly encourage you to check out these links and post questions on those two forums.

(3) Some of the moms on the MSPI forum have been discussing the success they have had with their little ones after starting them on digestive enzymes. One of the moms posted information about huge improvements in her son that has made me interested in pursuing getting my son onto digestive enzymes. From what I've read, digestive enzymes can't hurt, and can maybe help. I guess I'll see...I just need to go purchase some and get started. :-) http://www.quicktopic.com/23/H/aSxbbAkUULVMX/m9996 is the one post I was referring to and then http://www.quicktopic.com/23/H/aSxbbAkUULVMX/m10007 and http://www.quicktopic.com/23/H/aSxbbAkUULVMX/m10008 have additional information.

As an update about my son, his night wakings are definitely not gone yet. But about 3 weeks ago, he slept all the way through the night one night and then last night I only had to help him once! (He passed two or three toots while nursing at 2:15 and then stayed asleep till morning - yeah!) Of course, the night before last, I was probably up with him every 45-60 mins from 2-6 AM...! But, I think some of these most recent wakings could also be teething pain as well as gas pain. I've been trying to make myself wait longer before going in to get him when he starts crying. I don't want him to wake the whole house with his crying, but I have been finding that sometimes he is able to settle himself (by passing gas, I assume) after flopping all around for a bit longer than I was allowing before. Of course, he is 18 months and your little one is only 9 months so it is a different issue.

About the massage - I found it beneficial to get him used to being massaged during the day so that he was more OK with it at night. After some of his daytime diaper changes, I would keep him on the changing table and massage his belly. I use the palm of my hand and rub in a spiral - starting at his belly button going clockwise and getting bigger from there. At night when he is suffering from his terrible gas pain, there is NO WAY he will let my put him on the bed and massage him - not at all! But, while I'm nursing him, I can sort of do a massage on at least part of his belly. Some nights he will let me do that and I think it helps the gas move down and out. Other nights, he grabs my hand and pulls it away from his belly very purposefully. It must hurt worse, I guess. For a while I was trying to massage him after his "just before bed" diaper change. I've stopped doing that because I think the massage at that time was directly tied into him having really bad gas episode about an hour after going to bed. Maybe it was moving the gas too much.

About the bouncing and walking - it did help for a long time. He would eventually pass gas that way that wasn't coming out any other way. I also would hold him with his back to mine chest and my arms under his bottom - and gradually bring my arms to the backs of his knees - thus compressing his knees to his chest. That position would help too while walking. But now, he is just way too heavy for me to bounce with him for any length of time while I am so groggy and sleepy in the wee hours of the night. (He's around 28-30 lbs.) But, in the MANY months of doing that, I learned to put my daughter's foam 2-ft square interlocking play mats on our wood floors in his room to make the bouncing easier on my feet and knees. I also bought a pair of slip-on style sneakers and put my arch supports in them. When I would climb out of bed, I put them on immediately so that as I'm walking/bouncing on our wood floors, I had the springy cushioning of the sneakers and the support from the arch supports. Those two things really helped ME survive even if they didn't help him get rid of the gas.

Another gas removing position I have found recently is to sit in the rocking chair (it is a true rocking chair, not a glider) with his back to my chest. As I rock forward, I actively lean forward while also raising my knees up. Then as I rock back, I kind of stretch him out a bit. This compressing - stretching pattern seems to help him pass some gas sometimes. Unfortunately, he has really associated the rocking chair with nursing and wants Nothing to do with sitting there in any position other than to nurse. I have to pretty firmly hold him upright in my lap until he relaxes into the rocking motion (singing softly at the same time, too). :-)

I hope that some of this information is of help to you. At least, through your internet research and finding message boards like this one, you know that you are NOT alone! I'm glad you sent me a PM since I haven't checked this board in a little while. I am glad to share what I know with you and hope at least some of it helps. I will try to check in on this forum regularly for a while. But feel free to PM me anytime if you want so that I get the notification into my personal email.

Hang in there!

Dianne

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My grandson had colic really bad and I read in parents magazine of a tea to make. We tried it and within one day he was doing great no more gas or crying spells.

Here is what you do.

Make a tea of caraway seeds, you can use fennel or dill as well but I used caraway. Put 2 tablespoons of seeds in 2 cups of water, pop in the microwave for 3 minutes and let steep until cool. Give your baby 2 tablespoons 3 x a day. I put in in with the baby's formula and he didn't notice at all. Since you are breast feeding you will need to do it with a dropper or bottle nipple. I kept the extra in a jar in the fridge. I have a day care in my home and have had several babies with the same problem and told their moms about this. All have done it with success.

Yellow Rose

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My grandson had colic really bad and I read in parents magazine of a tea to make. We tried it and within one day he was doing great no more gas or crying spells.

Here is what you do.

Make a tea of caraway seeds, you can use fennel or dill as well but I used caraway. Put 2 tablespoons of seeds in 2 cups of water, pop in the microwave for 3 minutes and let steep until cool. Give your baby 2 tablespoons 3 x a day. I put in in with the baby's formula and he didn't notice at all. Since you are breast feeding you will need to do it with a dropper or bottle nipple. I kept the extra in a jar in the fridge. I have a day care in my home and have had several babies with the same problem and told their moms about this. All have done it with success.

Yellow Rose

Thanks for providing a recipe, since various gripe waters and "colic" tea solutions can be expensive. But, please, please, please be careful of grouping all distressed infants as just having "colic". I know you have experience with babies since you have a day care, but some babies are in pain for genuine reasons - reflux (needing medical treatment), milk protein intolerance (needing mom's diet to change or needing specialized formulas), or gluten intolerance (which you obviously realize cannot be "solved" by caraway tea). These babies have often been misdiagnosed by doctors as having "colic" and their overwhelmed, exhausted, frustrated parents have already been told again and again that their baby will grow out of it! Some babies do stop being so fussy as they get a bit older and they get used to being alive and their disgestive and nervous systems matures, but others are truly sick - and no one recognizes that except for the parents! Just as frustrating as it must be for you to have friends or relatives or restaurant employees minimize your concerns about gluten or cross-contamination issues, it is just as frustrating for parents of genuinely distressed infants to be told that teas, or gripe waters, or swaddling, or shushing will make their crying baby feel better. That may work for normal infants who simply have a bit of a hard time coping with life, but as you can tell - it didn't do anything for my son. We bought so many types of gripe water. We tried teas. We tried belly bands. We tried swaddling, shushing, swaying. He cried and was in obvious digestive distress for about 80% of the day for 7.5 months until Finally we learned that he was intolerant of the milk/soy/gluten that I was eating and passing to him in my milk.

I apologize for getting on my "soapbox" this morning. I hope I haven't offended you. I just know how passionate everyone on this board is about the frustrations of having gluten intolerance and cross contamination minimized by others since it is definitely a real problem. That is also how passionate I am about grouping all fussy babies as having "colic"!

OK, I'm off my "soapbox" and I hope everyone has a great day. :-) Dianne

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I'm sorry I don't have time to read all the replies, but get rid of the dairy 100% in her diet and yours (I think I read you are breastfeeding). See if that helps. If not, take her back to the doctor! I used the FAILSAFE diet for my son for awhile. It worked for a friend of mine, but not for me. It only made matters worse because I fed my son lots of whole wheat stuff since his diet was so narrow. Now, he is Celiac :(

My advice is the dairy exclusion and keep taking your baby back to the doctor until they test some more or do something. Be careful with excluding so many foods from the diet when you don't know yet what is going on. I know you're anxious to fix things as I was, but do try to work with a doctor first. If he or she is putting you off, go to another.

Take care,

Debbie

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Thanks for providing a recipe, since various gripe waters and "colic" tea solutions can be expensive. But, please, please, please be careful of grouping all distressed infants as just having "colic". I know you have experience with babies since you have a day care, but some babies are in pain for genuine reasons - reflux (needing medical treatment), milk protein intolerance (needing mom's diet to change or needing specialized formulas), or gluten intolerance (which you obviously realize cannot be "solved" by caraway tea). These babies have often been misdiagnosed by doctors as having "colic" and their overwhelmed, exhausted, frustrated parents have already been told again and again that their baby will grow out of it! Some babies do stop being so fussy as they get a bit older and they get used to being alive and their disgestive and nervous systems matures, but others are truly sick - and no one recognizes that except for the parents! Just as frustrating as it must be for you to have friends or relatives or restaurant employees minimize your concerns about gluten or cross-contamination issues, it is just as frustrating for parents of genuinely distressed infants to be told that teas, or gripe waters, or swaddling, or shushing will make their crying baby feel better. That may work for normal infants who simply have a bit of a hard time coping with life, but as you can tell - it didn't do anything for my son. We bought so many types of gripe water. We tried teas. We tried belly bands. We tried swaddling, shushing, swaying. He cried and was in obvious digestive distress for about 80% of the day for 7.5 months until Finally we learned that he was intolerant of the milk/soy/gluten that I was eating and passing to him in my milk.

I apologize for getting on my "soapbox" this morning. I hope I haven't offended you. I just know how passionate everyone on this board is about the frustrations of having gluten intolerance and cross contamination minimized by others since it is definitely a real problem. That is also how passionate I am about grouping all fussy babies as having "colic"!

OK, I'm off my "soapbox" and I hope everyone has a great day. :-) Dianne

I'm sorry you took my reply as defining all fussy babies as colic babies. I didn't mean to imply that at all. Several people were suggesting colic and since I have had my own experience with colic babies and this worked for them I thought I would provide a receipe. I know when babies are crying parents will try anything to make them feel better. Since it worked in such a short time for the babies that have tried it I figure it can't hurt to try and see if it will work for another one and if it doesn't then try something else.

Yellow Rose

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I know what youy are going trhough my DD will be 10 month old on Friday, tomorrow! It is so hard to say what is wrong! Regular colic I doubt since she's already so old. I'm breastfeeding too, and it can be everything from Veggies you eat, you yeastproducts, to YOU eating wheat or you eating anything Dairy like Cheese, Milk, Fish, Nuts, Soda and so on! I'm saying you should have your DD tested until tghen I can highly recommend something, which has worked wonders for me! Forget the Mylicon, it always made the Gas worse in my kids, not better. Throw it out! Go to Walgreens and to the Baby-Aisle! Look for the Brand "Gentle Naturals"! Look, here is their Website, it is Homeopathic and has worked the best ever so far! The stuff I'm using is Tummy-Soother and their Teething-Drops! with my DD her bowels where already so irritated by the time I realized it was probabnly something she couldn't digest, like Wheat! We started ion the Tummy-Soother after she'd been several nights up every 30-45 minutes!!!!! I made sure I avoided wheat and such and It did show a little improvement after the first night, the following night, bit by bit it got better and better and now after about using it for only 1.5 weeks only in the evening (you can use it 3 times a day) shes back to only waking once a night at least! I'm sooooo happy! It helps her so much! Try it instead of those Mylicon Drops, like I said they don't work for your Baby how could it get worse! Here is the Website! Let me know if you tried it and if it helped, just give it a week and look if it did somoething for you- you got nothing to loose, and yes it's gluten-free!

big hugs, you are not alone!@

http://www.gentlenaturals.com/

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I know what youy are going trhough my DD will be 10 month old on Friday, tomorrow! It is so hard to say what is wrong! Regular colic I doubt since she's already so old. I'm breastfeeding too, and it can be everything from Veggies you eat, you yeastproducts, to YOU eating wheat or you eating anything Dairy like Cheese, Milk, Fish, Nuts, Soda and so on! I'm saying you should have your DD tested until tghen I can highly recommend something, which has worked wonders for me! Forget the Mylicon, it always made the Gas worse in my kids, not better. Throw it out! Go to Walgreens and to the Baby-Aisle! Look for the Brand "Gentle Naturals"! Look, here is their Website, it is Homeopathic and has worked the best ever so far! The stuff I'm using is Tummy-Soother and their Teething-Drops! with my DD her bowels where already so irritated by the time I realized it was probabnly something she couldn't digest, like Wheat! We started ion the Tummy-Soother after she'd been several nights up every 30-45 minutes!!!!! I made sure I avoided wheat and such and It did show a little improvement after the first night, the following night, bit by bit it got better and better and now after about using it for only 1.5 weeks only in the evening (you can use it 3 times a day) shes back to only waking once a night at least! I'm sooooo happy! It helps her so much! Try it instead of those Mylicon Drops, like I said they don't work for your Baby how could it get worse! Here is the Website! Let me know if you tried it and if it helped, just give it a week and look if it did somoething for you- you got nothing to loose, and yes it's gluten-free!

big hugs, you are not alone!@

http://www.gentlenaturals.com/

PS: yo9u should also consider that she's teething like a Maniac too and that hurts like crazy, specially at night, give her a dose of Tylenol or Motrin before Bed with the Tummysoother.

Aslo consider adn maybe have her tested foer Acid Reflux, make sure her upper body lays elevated, about 30 degrees is enough, a towwel rolled up under hte matress edct.!

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I know what youy are going trhough my DD will be 10 month old on Friday, tomorrow! It is so hard to say what is wrong! Regular colic I doubt since she's already so old. I'm breastfeeding too, and it can be everything from Veggies you eat, you yeastproducts, to YOU eating wheat or you eating anything Dairy like Cheese, Milk, Fish, Nuts, Soda and so on! I'm saying you should have your DD tested until tghen I can highly recommend something, which has worked wonders for me! Forget the Mylicon, it always made the Gas worse in my kids, not better. Throw it out! Go to Walgreens and to the Baby-Aisle! Look for the Brand "Gentle Naturals"! Look, here is their Website, it is Homeopathic and has worked the best ever so far! The stuff I'm using is Tummy-Soother and their Teething-Drops! with my DD her bowels where already so irritated by the time I realized it was probabnly something she couldn't digest, like Wheat! We started ion the Tummy-Soother after she'd been several nights up every 30-45 minutes!!!!! I made sure I avoided wheat and such and It did show a little improvement after the first night, the following night, bit by bit it got better and better and now after about using it for only 1.5 weeks only in the evening (you can use it 3 times a day) shes back to only waking once a night at least! I'm sooooo happy! It helps her so much! Try it instead of those Mylicon Drops, like I said they don't work for your Baby how could it get worse! Here is the Website! Let me know if you tried it and if it helped, just give it a week and look if it did somoething for you- you got nothing to loose, and yes it's gluten-free!

big hugs, you are not alone!@

http://www.gentlenaturals.com/

PS: yo9u should also consider that she's teething like a Maniac too and that hurts like crazy, specially at night, give her a dose of Tylenol or Motrin before Bed with the Tummysoother.

Aslo consider adn maybe have her tested foer Acid Reflux, make sure her upper body lays elevated, about 30 degrees is enough, a towwel rolled up under hte matress edct.!

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Hi there,

My 11 month old has been having sleep issues since he was 8 wks old. He started with his first ear infection at 6 wks old, up all night crying, after the antibiotics he started sleeping throught the night and did so for a few weeks. At 8 wks old he started with this routine of going to sleep no problem...lay him down in his crib, he would fall asleep and then a few hours later he would start fussing, arching his back, acting like he was in pain. He also would get this terrible rash which eventually led him to the rheumatologist who ruled out rheumatoid arthritis, but referred us to an allergist who figured out he had some food allergies which was very interesting since we hadn't introduced food yet! Peanut and rice. We figured his rash was itchy and was keeping him up at night. I was nursing so I eliminated all rice and peanut and his rash cleared up! He kept on with the nighttime screaming though. Most nights he would wake every 30 minutes or so, sometimes screaming, arching his back, sometimes just whimpering. We then went the reflux route. Tried some Prevacid and miraculously after three days of being on it he went to sleep in his crib and slept 12 hours straight! This is a baby who just a week ago had been sleeping about 2-3 hours a night total. Well this was short lived and after about a week, he was back to his night misery. During the day he is great. happy, no diarrhea, no vomitting, no spitting up ever. just this night time pain. We tried letting him cry it out- he would go on and on all night long....a week went by and besides feeling like a terrible mother, nothing changed. When I go in his room, he is laying in his crib rolling around with his eyes closed crying, thrashing around and when i pick him up he is not consoled. Sometimes he thrashes so much he is even hard to hold on to. Even when I put him in bed with me, he doesn't sleep. He does the same thing, rolls around, moaning and groaning and eventually starts crying and is hard to console. He has seen a neurologist, a gastroenterologist- who ordered an upper gi and ultrasound which were both fine. now they want to do an overnight sleep study with a ph probe and eeg. It occurred to me today that he has had lots of gas at night...I got to doing some research and came across celiac disease and called our pediatrician who ordered some blood work. so he is going for the blood tests next week and i dont know what i am hoping for. i guess i am hoping they are negative although i realize that doesnt necessary mean he doesnt have it. if they are negative, my plan is to try a gluten free diet for a month and see what happens. for now, i dread the nights and just hope that he will just grow out of whatever is going on! I look forward to hearing how your little one is getting along with the nighttime screaming.

Take care,

MammaW

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