Sodium Nitrates

[Woolygimp]

I'm not one to believe in all these intolerances but I definitely feel like there is something up when I eat processed meats. I'll get headaches, feel very fatigued, sleep for long periods of time and although I don't get the classical digestive symptoms, I do feel like something is wrong.

I ate some lunchmeat/hotdogs yesterday, slept all night...woke up for a couple hours then got a very fatigued sensation and fell back to sleep all day long. I find that pretty abnormal, and I suspected it would happen before I ate the processed meats as it wasn't the first time something like that happened to me.

The only thing I could find in the Oscar Meyer meats that may cause something like this is the sodium nitrates, as they are all gluten free. I do not have this reaction when eating cooked chicken/steaks/ham.

Anyone else have any related experiences? Is there somewhere where I can find packaged nitrate free meats?

[Mother of Jibril]

One thing I learned in organic chemistry (I started out as a chemistry major in college) is that nitrates are WAY bad for you... extremely toxic to living things. That's why they make such great preservatives. So... I suspect the effects you experienced were from killing off bacteria in your digestive system. Sorry.

I haven't eaten nitrates for about fifteen years, but I did recently find a brand of organic, pork-free, gluten-free turkey hot dogs made by Organic Prairie. They also have beef hot dogs (and pork). Pretty tasty!

[Rachel--24]

Yes, nitrates are toxic......one of the worst chemicals we have in our foods. Its definately one to avoid.

Heres a list of some of the worst ones...you will find nitrates on most lists of additives/preservatives to AVOID.

Acesulfame-K - "Sunette"; may cause low blood sugar attacks; causes cancer, elevated cholesterol in lab animals.

Artificial colors - contribute to hyperactivity in children; may contribute to learning and visual disorders, nerve damage; may be carcinogenic

Artificial sweeteners - associated with health problems; see specific sweetener.

Aspartame - may cause brain damage in phenylketonurics; may cause central nervous system disturbances, menstrual difficulties; may affect brain development in unborn fetus.

BHA - can cause liver and kidney damage, behavioral problems, infertility, weakened immune system, birth defects, cancer; should be avoided by infants, young children, pregnant women and those sensitive to aspirin.

BHT - see BHA; banned in England.

Blue No. 1 - see FD&C colors.

Blue No. 2 - see FD&C colors.

Brominated vegetable oil - linked to major organ system damage, birth defects, growth problems; considered unsafe by the FDA, can still lawfully be used unless further action is taken by the FDA .

BVO - see brominated vegetable oil.

Caffeine - psychoactive, addictive drug; may cause fertility problems, birth defects, heart disease, depression, nervousness, behavioral changes, insomnia, etc.

Citrus Red No. 2 - see FD&C colors.

FD&C colors - colors considered safe by the FDA for use in food, drugs and cosmetics; most of the colors are derived from coal tar and must be certified by the FDA not to contain more than 10ppm of lead and arsenic; certification does not address any harmful effects these colors may have on the body; most coal tar colors are potential carcinogens, may contain carcinogenic contaminants, and cause allergic reactions.

Free glutamates - may cause brain damage, especially in children; always found in autolyzed yeast, calcium caseinate, enzymes, flavors & flavorings, gelatin, glutamate, glutamic acid, hydrolyzed protein, hydrolyzed soy protein, plant protein extract, protease, protease enzymes, sodium caseinate, textured protein, yeast extract, yeast food and yeast nutrient; may be in barley malt, boullion, broth, carrageenan, malt extract, malt flavoring, maltodextrin, natural flavors, natural chicken flavoring, natural beef flavoring, natural pork flavoring, pectin, seasonings, soy protein, soy protein concentrate, soy protein isolate, soy sauce, soy sauce extract, stock, whey protein, whey protein concentrate, whey protein isolate, anything that is enzyme modified, fermented, protein fortified or ultrapasteurized and foods that advertise NO MSG; see MSG.

Green No. 3 - see FD&C colors.

Hydrogenated vegetable oils - associated with heart disease, breast and colon cancer, atherosclerosis, elevated cholesterol.

MSG - may cause headaches, itching, nausea, brain, nervous system, reproductive disorders, high blood pressure; pregnant, lactating mothers, infants, small children should avoid; allergic reactions common; may be hidden in infant formula, low fat milk, candy, chewing gum, drinks, over-the-counter medications, especially children's, binders and fillers for nutritional supplements, prescriptiona nd non-prescription drugs, IV fluids given in hospitals, chicken pox vaccine; it is being sprayed on growing fruits and vegetables as a growth enhancer; it is proposed for use on organic crops.

Neotame - similar to aspartame, but potentially more toxic; awaiting approval.

Nitrates - form powerful cancer-causing agents in stomach; can cause death; considered dangerous by FDA but not banned because they prevent botulism.

Nitrites - may cause headaches, nausea, vomiting, dizziness; see nitrates.

Nutrasweet - see aspartame.

Olean - see olestra.

Olestra - causes gastrointestinal irritation, reduces carotenoids and fat soluble vitamins in the body.

Partially hydrogenated vegetable oils - see hydrogenated vegetable oil.

Potassium bromate - can cause nervous system, kidney disorders, gastrointestinal upset; may be carcinogenic.

Red No. 3 - see FD&C colors.

Saccharin - delisted as a carcinogen in 1997, however, studies still show that saccharin causes cancer.

Sulfites - destroys vitamin B1; small amounts may cause asthma, anaphylactic shock; dangerous for asthma, allergy sufferers; has caused deaths; banned on fresh fruits and vegetables, except potatoes.

Sweet 'N Low - contains saccharin.

Yellow No. 6 - see FD&C colors.

[happygirl]

Is there somewhere where I can find packaged nitrate free meats?

Open Original Shared Link

[lorka150]

Rachel - do you have a link to that info? That is a good one, I'd like to save it in my favourites. Thanks!

[Rachel--24]

Rachel - do you have a link to that info? That is a good one, I'd like to save it in my favourites. Thanks!

Here's the link...

Open Original Shared Link

[Rachel--24]

Is there somewhere where I can find packaged nitrate free meats?

Do you have a Whole Foods in your area? All of the packaged meats they sell are free of nitrates.

[Fiddle-Faddle]

Woolygimp, if you look closely at the tiny little writing on the hot dog packaging (use a magnifying glass!), you'll see that it's sodium nitrite, not sodium nitrate.

Nitrites and nitrates are different.

Nitrites are WORSE.

When I was a teenager, ANYTHING with sodium nitrite gave me zits. My teenage son is going through the same thing. I did outgrow it, but I try to avoid sodium nitrite anyway. I figure, there's a reason my body didn't like it!

There are hot dogs and bacon that are nitrite-free, made by Coleman brand, and they're yummy.

[Fiddle-Faddle]

From Wikipedia:

As a food additive, it serves a dual purpose in the food industry since it both alters the color of preserved fish and meats and also prevents growth of Clostridium botulinum, the bacteria which causes botulism. In the European Union it may be used only as a mixture with salt containing at most 0.6% sodium nitrite. It has the E number E250. Potassium nitrite (E249) is used in the same way.

While this chemical will prevent the growth of bacteria, it can be toxic for mammals. (LD50 in rats is 180 mg/kg.) For this reason, sodium nitrite sold as a food additive is dyed bright pink to avoid mistaking it for something else. Cooks and makers of charcuterie often simply refer to sodium nitrite as "pink salt".

Various dangers of using this as a food additive have been suggested and researched by scientists. A principal concern is the formation of carcinogenic N-nitrosamines by the reaction of sodium nitrite with amino acids in the presence of heat in an acidic environment. Its usage is carefully regulated in the production of cured products; in the United States, the concentration in finished products is limited to 200 ppm, and is usually lower. In about 1970, it was found that the addition of ascorbic acid inhibited nitrosamine production. U.S. manufacturing of cured meats now requires the addition of 500 ppm of ascorbic acid or erythorbic acid, a cheaper isomer. [1][2]Sodium nitrite has also been linked to triggering migraines.[3]

Recent studies have found a link between high processed meat consumption and colon cancer, possibly due to preservatives such as sodium nitrite.[4][5]

Recent studies have also found a link between frequent ingestion of meats cured with nitrites and the COPD form of lung disease.[6]

[ShayFL]

If you eat nitrate/nitrite free lunch meat and still get the same reaction, consider "tyramine". Processed and aged meats have very high levels of this amine. Tyramine is an amine which causes elevated blood pressure and tachycardia by displacing norepinephrine from storage vesicles. Tyramine is generally produced by decarboxylation of the amino acid tyrosine during fermentation of food products. All protein-rich foods which have been matured will contain more tyramine depending on the temperature and how long they have been stored.

Fresh liver, meat and fish have no significant levels of tyramine, but old liver and meat contain high amounts. Processed meats, lunch meats, cured or pickled meats, and meat by-products and broths often contain large amounts of tyramine.

There is a connection to tyramine and your symptoms.

Hopefully it is just the nitrate/nitrites.

[AliB]

Just out of interest does anyone know whether you can get rid of the nitrites/nitrates by washing the meat or is is intrinsically within the the meat fibres? I wondered the same with dried fruit. I always soak dried fruit in hot water for a while to soften it which also helps remove some of the mineral oil and hopefully the sulphite. Not sure what difference it makes, if any.

Just EVERYTHING has to be mucked about with - is nothing sacred? Even fresh food - the animals have been fed other animals and given drugs, the vegetables and fruit may well be coated with stuff, sprayed to within an inch of its life with every chemical known to man and quite likely contaminated with or of GM construction.

I am convinced there is a hidden agenda out there that is hell-bent on destroying us all.

I am still looking for a source of nitrate-free meat locally here in Wales. Trouble is when I find it, it is bound to be exorbitantly expensive.

[Mother of Jibril]

You're right that there's an awful lot of horrible stuff being done with our food

I do find healthy food a bit expensive. I hope my income grows fast enough to keep up with my kids as they get older and start eating greater quantities Over the last five years, my husband and I have been buying more and more organic food. We hope the investment will be offset by saving on medical bills! We're careful about eating foods that are in season and buying on sale. Also, I've been growing a container garden with hot peppers and herbs... it adds a lot of flavor to our food at a very cheap price.

I know sometimes people don't have a choice. My family was really poor when I was a teenager... our family is still suffering from the poor quality of the food and lack of medical care.

[AliB]

My family wasn't very well off but neither were we poor. My lovely Mum used to make all home-made food, grow her own veg, raise chickens and bake her own bread mostly with wholemeal flour, but still I succumbed to the dreaded Candida. I have not been well since I was a teenager.

I was given a lot of anti-biotics as a child as I used to get a lot of chest infections and colds and I am sure it was probably that that has wrecked my immune system, despite my Mum's healthy outlook. Back then of course, it was a case of 'Doctor knows best' and as a young Mum she didn't know any different.

I did things back when my kids were younger that I would do very differently now. I am certain that my Mum was Celiac and/or had severe bacterial issues and if she didn't have very good gut flora herself then she would not have had much to pass on to me - adding in the factor that I was bottlefed, and I was pretty much doomed from the start to have a sickly life ahead of me.

I always ensured that we had 'good' wholemeal bread and REAL butter in our family - one of the family stories is of our son coming back round from visiting his 'Auntie' Barbara next-door-but-one. "I've had a real treat", says this little 4 year-old, hopping from foot to foot with excitement. "Have you?", says I, "what was that?". "White bread an' margarine", comes the reply! You couldn't make it up, could you!

Little did I know that I might has well have been giving them white bread and margarine for all the benefit the 'good' stuff did us!

[Mother of Jibril]

I've been thinking about all the things my parents did with me too. They really meant well. I have a good relationship with them and I know for a fact they were not trying to make me suffer.

I grew up eating a LOT of cheese sandwiches, eating cereal, drinking 2-3 glasses of milk a day. Turns out I have genes for celiac and casein intolerance Plus... all the antibiotics. Ugh!! I was sick all the time. As a baby I had the measles... then I had my tonsils taken out (at age three)... pneumonia (at age nine... landed me in the hospital for a week so they could pump me full of antibiotics)... then as a teenager I had severe acne and they gave me massive, long-term doses of antibiotics No wonder I have problems. I remember my mom getting bags of "dinner rolls" (pure white bread) from the discount bakery. Could there be a less healthy food? My mom is diabetic and has constant yeast infections.

Anyway... sorry I got off this tangent, since this thread is supposed to be about nitrates I remember eating cold hot dogs straight out of the refrigerator. Ugghhhh.

[Woolygimp]

If you eat nitrate/nitrite free lunch meat and still get the same reaction, consider "tyramine". Processed and aged meats have very high levels of this amine. Tyramine is an amine which causes elevated blood pressure and tachycardia by displacing norepinephrine from storage vesicles. Tyramine is generally produced by decarboxylation of the amino acid tyrosine during fermentation of food products. All protein-rich foods which have been matured will contain more tyramine depending on the temperature and how long they have been stored.

Fresh liver, meat and fish have no significant levels of tyramine, but old liver and meat contain high amounts. Processed meats, lunch meats, cured or pickled meats, and meat by-products and broths often contain large amounts of tyramine.

There is a connection to tyramine and your symptoms.

Hopefully it is just the nitrate/nitrites.

I get the same reaction when eating canned sardines/tuna.

Although I feel fine when I eat bananas, which is suppose to have a good amount, so I don't think this is it.

[AliB]

I get the same reaction when eating canned sardines/tuna.

Although I feel fine when I eat bananas, which is suppose to have a good amount, so I don't think this is it.

It is not the banana that contains the high levels of tyramine but the skin. A banana typically contains 7

[Woolygimp]

but I'm perfectly fine with avacados and eat quite a lot of them.

[ShayFL]

Try the nitrate/nitrite free lunch meats and then worry about what else it could be. Maybe that will be the answer and you wont have to go any further. Maybe the will sit with you just fine.

[Woolygimp]

Try the nitrate/nitrite free lunch meats and then worry about what else it could be. Maybe that will be the answer and you wont have to go any further. Maybe the will sit with you just fine.

Well I'm having the same problem with almonds, only about 2-3x worse.

I mean, I can go from having tons of energy to feeling like I just took 10 sleeping pills. It immediately knocks me out for hours... I'm not one to believe in undocumented medical issues, because I don't trust the alternative market at all...but something is definitely going on.

I tested some almonds yesterday at 4pm and within 45 minutes I could barely walk and literally passed out for about 10 hours. I have celiac, but it's odd that none of my celiac symptoms are the same as the ones I get when I eat these foods.

I don't have any digestive issues. Just extreme brain fog, fatigue, and weakness.

[kdanner1010]

I am currently being tested for Celiacs due to some major Gi diseases and ran across this on Tyramine...It gives me blinding Migrains to the point I end up in the ER getting shots just to stop the pain...I have to keep track of what I eat because the migrain happens with 24 to 48 hrs of me eating what ever triggered it.....This last bout couldnt for the life of me figure out what I had eatin ....Come to find out I started eating Yogurt....I cannot eat Hotdogs any kind of processed lunch meats cheeses Dark choclate ( milk choc is ok ) chinese foods anything in the cereals with Cocoa...Its a pain in the butt so this thing with celiacs really doesnt surprise me due to how sick I get when I eat the things listed above I am almst thankful that may be what it is just so I can possibly get relief with my stomach issues I have Barretts and and Severe IBD with intestinal bleeding...I am having my second endo and colonoscopy done this Monday to see if it has gotten worse....its been 3 years since my diagnosis of Barretts and IBD and not once have they ever said hey you may be affected by what your eating...I cut out all spicy foods and things that might set off the pain and issues and no getting better.....I just hope this is the answer becuase eating shouldnt be a burden...Anyway that is my little story with what tyramine does and a little more info If it makes your head hurt and feel horrible keep track of what it is and avoid it Hopefully if it is celiacs which they say most likely it is then I can learn to eat food that doesnt make me double over in pain and live in the bathrooms

[uncle russ]

I am currently being tested for Celiacs due to some major Gi diseases and ran across this on Tyramine...It gives me blinding Migrains to the point I end up in the ER getting shots just to stop the pain...I have to keep track of what I eat because the migrain happens with 24 to 48 hrs of me eating what ever triggered it.....This last bout couldnt for the life of me figure out what I had eatin ....Come to find out I started eating Yogurt....I cannot eat Hotdogs any kind of processed lunch meats cheeses Dark choclate ( milk choc is ok ) chinese foods anything in the cereals with Cocoa...Its a pain in the butt so this thing with celiacs really doesnt surprise me due to how sick I get when I eat the things listed above I am almst thankful that may be what it is just so I can possibly get relief with my stomach issues I have Barretts and and Severe IBD with intestinal bleeding...I am having my second endo and colonoscopy done this Monday to see if it has gotten worse....its been 3 years since my diagnosis of Barretts and IBD and not once have they ever said hey you may be affected by what your eating...I cut out all spicy foods and things that might set off the pain and issues and no getting better.....I just hope this is the answer becuase eating shouldnt be a burden...Anyway that is my little story with what tyramine does and a little more info If it makes your head hurt and feel horrible keep track of what it is and avoid it Hopefully if it is celiacs which they say most likely it is then I can learn to eat food that doesnt make me double over in pain and live in the bathrooms

You can eat all the meats , potaotos  vegies,  you can hold.  read labels,  for wheat . malt, barley rye, and probably oats.

[kareng]

You can eat all the meats , potaotos  vegies,  you can hold.  read labels,  for wheat . malt, barley rye, and probably oats.

 

 

Just an FYI, the poster you are responding to hasn't been on in 2 years.