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schuyler

Vegetarian Vs Eating Meat

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I am not sure what you mean by that, however, thank you for sharing your knowledge anyway! It's nice to see the other side.

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The man (cardiologist and not sure of his name) on Oprah said that meat putrifies in your colon when you eat it. He didn't say it was putrified before. It isn't digested the same way as fruits and veges. Therefore you need fiber and such to carry it through your intestines was the way he described it.

Nuts are high in protein and so are beans, so that is plenty of protein. I personally do eat some dairy and eggs are a good source of protein. If you don't eat dairy, then food combining for protein works great. I am just allowing the person that asked the question to see that there are sources of protein other then meat out there to eat and she could do it without soy. She doesn't eat meat currently and she wanted to know how others felt about it from a nutritional stand point was what I understood.

SHe can choose to disagree with it or to try it. We all are just searching for what makes us healthy and what makes us feel better. If meat is what works for some and makes them feel better then that is fine.

Monica

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The man (cardiologist and not sure of his name) on Oprah said that meat putrifies in your colon when you eat it. He didn't say it was putrified before. It isn't digested the same way as fruits and veges. Therefore you need fiber and such to carry it through your intestines was the way he described it.

I have seen this said on vegan sites, but that's not how meat digests. Meat is digested within a few hours of eating it, leaving very little residue. So you do need to eat fiber in addition, in order to keep from being constipated.

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Even on Oprah one day they talked about meat being putrified when you eat it. It doesn't digest in our bodies like other things. Also there are studies that say vegetarians live longer on average then meat eaters.

=====================================

i recall reading a study containing statistics showing meat eaters having a 40% higher risk for colon cancer than vegetarians.

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any diet is equally healthy. it's just how you make it healthy and take the steps to get there. i know many healthy and unhealthy vegetarians/vegans, and many heahtlhy and unhealthy non-veg, too.

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Here's some more info just to throw a different perspective out there. Don't shoot me. I didn't write it :)

Consider that Weston A. Price traveled the globe studying the diets of native societies in the 1930’s while there were still natives untouched by white man and his processed foods (Nutrition & Physical Degeneration by W.A. Price). His primary result was to show that wherever natives were exposed to processed foods such as white flour and sugar, degeneration and disease soon followed. But he also discovered that there were no healthy vegetarian societies or tribes. While he did find some vegetarians, there were always healthier tribes near by eating meat or animal products. In fact, if you study cultural anthropology one of the things you will find is that the amount of meat eaten by any society was determined not by religious beliefs or health fads, but rather by availability alone. A clear example of this can be seen by looking at the diets of traditional Aboriginals in Australia. The inland Aboriginals eat a diet of approximately 75-90% vegetable and 10-25% animal foods. The coastal Aboriginals, who have access to fish and larger animals like Kangaroo eat about 75% animal and 25% vegetable foods (1) .

The whole concept of vegetarianism being safer for your heart is an unfounded, scare tactic fostered by the processed food industry. Before 1920, coronary heart disease was rare (2) . Hydrogenation of vegetable oils began around 1910 and between 1910 and 1970 consumption of vegetable oils increased some 400%, while saturated animal fat consumption decreased on the whole. In short, we’ve had a reduction of animal fat consumption, an increase in hydrogenated vegetable oils and an increase in heart disease since 1920. It’s hard to see how consuming less animal fats has made for healthy hearts. Moreover, statistical analysis of chronic disease shows that we are far worse off with today’s dietary recommendations when looked at from a disease perspective.

If viewed from a purely historical perspective, the current dogma over eating meat and heart health is suspect as well. Humans have been eating animal foods as a primary food staple in every part of the world with a winter. This includes the fish eaten in every region near lakes and the ocean. More generally, humans have eaten meat and saturated animal fats throughout an evolutionary history spanning hundreds of thousands of years. If eating meat were as unhealthy as suggested, we’d never have lasted so long.

http://www.paulchek.com/articles/list.aspx...d=200&auth_id=1

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My doctor's appt yesterday wasn't great :(. I'm down another 5 pounds (102 lbs at 5'8''), my oxygen saturation was low, and my blood pressure was 67/47. The nurse actually asked me if I felt like I was alive, and I told her "no." Right now, my body isn't digesting much; vegetables, most fruits, soy, dairy, and nuts are out for now ( I'm pretty much living off of rice and potatos- although I'm really not eating much at all). I'm always tired and I constantly feel like I'm going to pass out. My vitamin levels are extremely low, so I was put on supplements. If things don't improve in the next week, I will have to be tube fed. Sounds like fun. Not. All of these years that I have been a vegetarian, I always said that I would never cosider eating meat again, but right now I'm not healthy. I've decided that since what I'm doing now obviously isn't working, I need to try something else. I'm just not getting enough nutrients through the vegi diet right now. I know that it is possible to get all the right nutrients being gluten-free and vegi free, but I'm just not. Last night, I ate a piece of chicken, and to my suprise, I had no problems digesting it. For the time being, I am going to continue to eat chicken. Once my body starts digesting foods normally again, I will probably go back to the strict vegetarian diet again, but I need to wait until I'm healthy again. Thanks to everyone for providing info and insight for both sides of the issue.

Danielle

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*hugs*

good luck.

add a little extra olive oil to those potatoes! (works well in mashed potatoes)

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Danielle,

It sounds like you are having a very rough time. Do you like bananas? Have you tried ensure. You definitely need to do something very quickly. Your blood pressure is very low and that is why you are feeling like passing out. I am glad the meat agreed with you. If it is making you feel better then your body needs it. You need to eat whatever works for your digestive system right now. I guess you can't drink ensure if you can't have dairy, duh. Does dairy make you sicker??

Hoping feel better and get the help you need.

Monica

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Danielle, keep us posted on how you made out at Dr. and how everything is going. I am concerned over your current state of health at this point.

D.

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Hi Danielle--I'm concerned, too! Hopefully, you can build on the chicken--use a little olive oil, as was mentioned, and when that settles right maybe cooked zucchini, summer squash. Try your veggies (slowly) and fruit cooked very well--that may help. Best of luck--let us know how you're doing! :)

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*hugs*

good luck.

add a little extra olive oil to those potatoes! (works well in mashed potatoes)

I never thought about olive oil; I'll definately try that.

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Hi Danielle--I'm concerned, too! Hopefully, you can build on the chicken--use a little olive oil, as was mentioned, and when that settles right maybe cooked zucchini, summer squash. Try your veggies (slowly) and fruit cooked very well--that may help. Best of luck--let us know how you're doing! :)

Last night, I made some baby food out of zucchini. It was pretty gross, but since it was so soft, it was easier on my digestive system. I'm going to slowly start adding things back into my diet, and hopefully all will go well. Thanks for all of the advice. I'll definately keep everyone updated on how I'm doing.

Danielle

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Just to jump on the bandwagon with what everyone else has said...concentrated soy makes me very ill. My wife had me drink soy milk for a while several years ago (after my celiac diagnosis), and it made me very sick. Just like I had been before going gluten free. Soy in small amounts doesn't affect me, but the milk seemed to big time. Oddly enough, when my wife was breastfeeding our son (who we think now is celiac as well), she couldn't have a large soy intake either, or he would have major colicky episodes. So, like everyone else has said, I would limit or eliminate soy for a few days, and see if that changes anything.

Good luck!

Chris

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Unfortunately the vegetarian diet is really high in a lot of foods people get intolerances to, to make up for the otherwise poor protein content. If you're not getting better then you really should see if getting off soy and dairy will help you.

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I have been a vegetarian for about 7-8 years, and before my celiac diagnosis, I relied heavily on meat substitutes. I cut out the fake meats after my diagnosis because almost all of them contain gluten as a filler. Since then I have been eating tofu and drinking soy milk about 3 times a week.

Basically, what I'd like to know is whether I should start eating some meat (like chicken) again, and cut out tofu and soy milk. The reason that I'm asking everyone on here, is because you all seem to know more about these things than the medical community :D. I'm not trying to start a debate on here between vegetarians and meat eaters, I'm just really confused about what I should do. I'd do anything to start feeling better, even if it means eating meat again. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Danielle

Danielle,

I haven't read through the forum yet, but I wanted to let you know what I've read online and rely part of my story.

I have read that soy is not as good as we were led to believe. It causes as much or more damage to the intestines as gluten. I was on a vegan diet for 3 years as I believed it was healthier to not eat meat. I relied heavily on soy and gluten. This was in February. My son developed eczema on his face the beginning of February (I think soy protein in his pnuemococcal shot was the push) and after talking to a friend of mine, made an appointment for allergy testing the beginning of March. I had cut soy out of the family's diet in February. The beginning of April I found out that I was allergic to soy/gluten&gliadin/and some beans among other things. Those are the main protein staples in the vegan diet. My family has since left off the vegan diet for a meat eating diet. Before becoming vegan we had been lacto-ovo for 4 or 5 years, leaning more on the ovo side. I am also allergic to dairy.

This is only my opinion based on what I've read. Soy will cause you more harm and interfere with the healing of your intestines. Check out "the dark side of soy", I forget the authors name but you can just do a search on the book title. In the past I would have been wholeheartedly for the vegetarian/vegan diet. I can't do that anymore after learning what I have about wheat and soy. Each person's body needs a different ratio of protein/carbs/fats. You can check out mercola.com and take a basic metabolic test. I don't agree with everything that he does but there is a ton of information and he does address the soy issue as well. I believe he is a naturopath. Don't know if he turned naturopath after being in the mainline medical field or not.

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Danielle,

I haven't read through the forum yet, but I wanted to let you know what I've read online and rely part of my story.

I have read that soy is not as good as we were led to believe. It causes as much or more damage to the intestines as gluten. I was on a vegan diet for 3 years as I believed it was healthier to not eat meat. I relied heavily on soy and gluten. This was in February. My son developed eczema on his face the beginning of February (I think soy protein in his pnuemococcal shot was the push) and after talking to a friend of mine, made an appointment for allergy testing the beginning of March. I had cut soy out of the family's diet in February. The beginning of April I found out that I was allergic to soy/gluten&gliadin/and some beans among other things. Those are the main protein staples in the vegan diet. My family has since left off the vegan diet for a meat eating diet. Before becoming vegan we had been lacto-ovo for 4 or 5 years, leaning more on the ovo side. I am also allergic to dairy.

This is only my opinion based on what I've read. Soy will cause you more harm and interfere with the healing of your intestines. Check out "the dark side of soy", I forget the authors name but you can just do a search on the book title. In the past I would have been wholeheartedly for the vegetarian/vegan diet. I can't do that anymore after learning what I have about wheat and soy. Each person's body needs a different ratio of protein/carbs/fats. You can check out mercola.com and take a basic metabolic test. I don't agree with everything that he does but there is a ton of information and he does address the soy issue as well. I believe he is a naturopath. Don't know if he turned naturopath after being in the mainline medical field or not.

Mercola is a quack. He definitly has an agenda and is anti anything that doesn't fit into his diet. You can buy his book to find out all about it. That's what he really wants. Soy is no more bad for you than anything else. Everything in moderation. You can eat a moderate, well-balanced vegetarian diet just as easily as a omnivore diet. People, for some reason, hold a prejudice against vegetarians (maybe their lifestyle threatens you in some way) and then they run around finding any evidence they can that it is unhealthy and evil. Why can't people just live their lifestyle the way they want and leave others alone about their choices?

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I consider myself a "recovering vegetarian." I was veg for about 5 years and by the end I had lost so much brain function I couldn't even speak some days. If your symptoms haven't improved, I urge you to try the nutritionist's suggestions. I was bummed about giving up vegetarianism and kind of (ok really) grossed out by meat for a long time. Now I would never go back. I feel so much better this way. The veg diet was definitely NOT for my body.

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Soy also contains estrogen so if you eat a lot of it, it can cause some hormonal imbalances.

Girl Ninja - That's interesting that you feel so much better eating meat. I've been vegetarian for a few years and gluten-free for 9 months. I'm now feeling like I did a year or two ago before the celiac made me really sick, which means I can function, but I'm still more tired than I should be. I wonder if eating meat again would help me? Do you (or anyone else) have any idea why this would happen?

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Soy also contains estrogen so if you eat a lot of it, it can cause some hormonal imbalances.

Actually soy does not contain estrogen, it contains the plant equivilant of the female hormone, Animal products also contain hormones because animals have hormoones as well. If you eat animals or plants you are also consuming their hormones. There is no way to seperate the hormones from your food.

Soy hormones, as well as that of many other plants, help increase cancer fighting properties in our bodies.

I'm not a vegetarian and I am very allergic to soy, so I am not being biased or anything. I;ve just studied quite a bit of nutrition.

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I've been limiting my soy intake and I've been eating chicken for a few weeks now, and I'm feeling so much better. I still have some bad days, but not nearly as many as I used to. I'm also able to tolerate more fruits and vegetables. Yesterday, I discovered the joy of kinnikinnick. That stuff is amazing! I tried a few different things, and they all tasted close to gluten-filled food. I can't wait to get more of their products. I've also gained about 3 pounds (and I'm sure I'll gain more with all the kinnikinnick products I'll be eating :D ).

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Danielle,

That's great that you've gained weight and are starting to feel better. I've been researching gluten free/dairy free and soy free stuff. Kinnikinnick was one of the things I had been looking into. Do you buy it at a local store or did you order it?

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