Celiac and Diabetic

[Crystal Starkey]

Hello, I am new to this...Just found out I have celiac disease and I'm diabetic.  Double whammy!!  Just wondering if anyone else is too and if so, what advice do you have for me?

[plumbago]

18 minutes ago, Crystal Starkey said:

Hello, I am new to this...Just found out I have celiac disease and I'm diabetic.  Double whammy!!  Just wondering if anyone else is too and if so, what advice do you have for me?

Hi, it may help others if they know what type diabetes you have.

Plumbago

[trents]

Celiac Disease and Diabetes have significant genetic overlap on the genome map. So having both is very common. In fact, there is an element in the medical/scientific community are advocating that all diabetics should also be screened for celiac disease.

The good news for you is that the modifications to eating habits necessary to address celiac disease symptoms will also be good for keeping your diabetes under control. A high proportion of the bad calories most of us consume have to do with wheat products. But it can be more than just avoiding gluten containing grains (what, barley, rye) since many celiacs develop other food allergies/sensitivities. Dairy and soy are commonly among them but it can be almost any food for the individual. celiac disease causes "leaky gut" which in turn results in a very dysfunctional immune system.

But the immediate challenge for you is to educate yourself as to how gluten is hidden in the processed food products category. There is terminology to be aware of that masks gluten and a full realization of the fact that gluten is put in things that you would never suspect. For instance, soy sauce and tomato soup. Almost all canned soup has wheat starch in it for a thickener. Sauces and seasonings can contain gluten as well as chocolate syrup. Medications and supplements, etc., etc. It's daunting at first by after a while you develop a sixth sense about what might have gluten. And there is a difference between processed food products that carry the label "Gluten Free" from those that are "Certified" to be gluten free.

[Crystal Starkey]

3 minutes ago, plumbago said:

Hi, it may help others if they know what type diabetes you have.

Plumbago

Type 2

[Crystal Starkey]

4 minutes ago, trents said:

Celiac Disease and Diabetes have significant genetic overlap on the genome map. So having both is very common. In fact, there is an element in the medical/scientific community are advocating that all diabetics should also be screened for celiac disease.

The good news for you is that the modifications to eating habits necessary to address celiac disease symptoms will also be good for keeping your diabetes under control. A high proportion of the bad calories most of us consume have to do with wheat products. But it can be more than just avoiding gluten containing grains (what, barley, rye) since many celiacs develop other food allergies/sensitivities. Dairy and soy are commonly among them but it can be almost any food for the individual. celiac disease causes "leaky gut" which in turn results in a very dysfunctional immune system.

But the immediate challenge for you is to educate yourself as to how gluten is hidden in the processed food products category. There is terminology to be aware of that masks gluten and a full realization of the fact that gluten is put in things that you would never suspect. For instance, soy sauce and tomato soup. Almost all canned soup has wheat starch in it for a thickener. Sauces and seasonings can contain gluten as well as chocolate syrup. Medications and supplements, etc., etc. It's daunting at first by after a while you develop a sixth sense about what might have gluten. And there is a difference between processed food products that carry the label "Gluten Free" from those that are "Certified" to be gluten free.

This is great information!  This may explain why I feel like all food is against me at this point.  I am finding it a challenge to have anything other than meat and veggies.  I try to incorporate other things but I immediately feel ill to my stomach.  

 

[cyclinglady]

Type 2 is not autoimmune.  But are you sure you have type 2?  Many doctors assume type 2 if you are an adult.  They still think that TD1 is reserved for kids!  But you can develop TD1 at anytime.  Your doctor should check your antibodies for diabetes (e.g. GAD antibodies).  But you could be a type 2.  For a while, we thought that I had TD1.  I am thin and my blood sugar was wonky.  But it turns out that I am insulin resistant.  Like my Dad and his family.  Except I am thin and in shape!  
 

I bought a cheap meter and strips at Walmart.  I tested after meals.  Wow!  Rice can spike me higher that a gluten-free cupcake!  So, I went on a low carb high fat diet.  Have been doing that for seven years.   I also started an intermittent fasting diet.  I do a daily 15 to 16 hour fast.  The theory is that it helps to mange blood sugar even if you do not have access to healthy low carb foods.  I had my best HA1c in years in June.  despite cheating like crazy during COVID.  I thought for sure I was going to get a scolding from my doctor.  So, I do the IF diet and try hard to reduce carbs.  Makes me feel good.  My goal is to prevent taking Metformin because I worry about GI upset.  I have experienced enough of that with celiac disease and AI Gastritis.  

[Crystal Starkey]

7 minutes ago, cyclinglady said:

Type 2 is not autoimmune.  But are you sure you have type 2?  Many doctors assume type 2 if you are an adult.  They still think that TD1 is reserved for kids!  But you can develop TD1 at anytime.  Your doctor should check your antibodies for diabetes (e.g. GAD antibodies).  But you could be a type 2.  For a while, we thought that I had TD1.  I am thin and my blood sugar was wonky.  But it turns out that I am insulin resistant.  Like my Dad and his family.  Except I am thin and in shape!  
 

I bought a cheap meter and strips at Walmart.  I tested after meals.  Wow!  Rice can spike me higher that a gluten-free cupcake!  So, I went on a low carb high fat diet.  Have been doing that for seven years.   I also started an intermittent fasting diet.  I do a daily 15 to 16 hour fast.  The theory is that it helps to mange blood sugar even if you do not have access to healthy low carb foods.  I had my best HA1c in years in June.  despite cheating like crazy during COVID.  I thought for sure I was going to get a scolding from my doctor.  So, I do the IF diet and try hard to reduce carbs.  Makes me feel good.  My goal is to prevent taking Metformin because I worry about GI upset.  I have experienced enough of that with celiac disease and AI Gastritis.  

Yes, I have been tested by my doctor.  I am barely over at 6.6.  I do take the Metformin and have had no stomach upset at all!  After 2 years of nothing but I had my reservations and decided to give it a go anyway.  Seems to be working for me.  

[cyclinglady]

2 minutes ago, Crystal Starkey said:

Yes, I have been tested by my doctor.  I am barely over at 6.6.  I do take the Metformin and have had no stomach upset at all!  After 2 years of nothing but I had my reservations and decided to give it a go anyway.  Seems to be working for me.  

Glad for you that metformin works for you.  Bet you can get into the 5% club if you reduce your carbs.   Carbs is what has driven our obesity crisis.  You know, cut out the fat....but eat more grains that was pushed in the 1980s.    But you do the research.  
 

 

[Crystal Starkey]

7 minutes ago, cyclinglady said:

Glad for you that metformin works for you.  Bet you can get into the 5% club if you reduce your carbs.   Carbs is what has driven our obesity crisis.  You know, cut out the fat....but eat more grains that was pushed in the 1980s.    But you do the research.  
 

 

Thanks for the tip!  I have already cut most of my carbs and I've already lost 12 pounds in a month!  

[knitty kitty]

4 hours ago, cyclinglady said:

Type 2 is not autoimmune. 

I apologize for disagreeing with you yet again, Cycling Lady.  

According to this latest research, some Type Two Diabetes is on the Autoimmune spectrum.  Already having one autoimmune disease like Celiac Disease increases the autoimmune component of Type Two Diabetes.

"Type 2 Diabetes: How Much of an Autoimmune Disease?"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6620611/

Be careful of Metformin.  Metformin can cause thiamine deficiency!  

Diabetics have a higher metabolic need for thiamine.  Metformin blocks thiamine utilization in certain pathways, causing a deficiency.  

Please discuss with your doctor taking a B-Complex supplement and supplementing with additional thiamine.  

I experienced severe thiamine deficiency after taking metformin while already being low thiamine due to malabsorption caused by undiagnosed Celiac Disease.  I no longer take Metformin nor any prescription medications to control my Type Two Diabetes.  I control my blood sugar levels with the Autoimmune Paleo diet and fasting.  I'm in the 5% club.  Last A1C was 4.7.  I take high dose thiamine (300mg a day) and a B-Complex.  

Thiamine is needed to turn carbohydrates, fats and proteins into energy for the body.  Feeling sick to your stomach after carbohydrate consumption can be an early symptom of low thiamine.  Please discuss the low thiamine possibly with your doctor.  Thiamine is water soluble.  Your body excretes any excess easily.  Thiamine has no toxicity level.  Thiamine supplementation may be beneficial.  Please discuss thiamine supplementation with your doctor before starting.

Hope this helps!

 

 

[cyclinglady]

1 hour ago, knitty kitty said:

I apologize for disagreeing with you yet again, Cycling Lady.  

According to this latest research, some Type Two Diabetes is on the Autoimmune spectrum.  Already having one autoimmune disease like Celiac Disease increases the autoimmune component of Type Two Diabetes.

"Type 2 Diabetes: How Much of an Autoimmune Disease?"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6620611/

Be careful of Metformin.  Metformin can cause thiamine deficiency!  

Diabetics have a higher metabolic need for thiamine.  Metformin blocks thiamine utilization in certain pathways, causing a deficiency.  

Please discuss with your doctor taking a B-Complex supplement and supplementing with additional thiamine.  

I experienced severe thiamine deficiency after taking metformin while already being low thiamine due to malabsorption caused by undiagnosed Celiac Disease.  I no longer take Metformin nor any prescription medications to control my Type Two Diabetes.  I control my blood sugar levels with the Autoimmune Paleo diet and fasting.  I'm in the 5% club.  Last A1C was 4.7.  I take high dose thiamine (300mg a day) and a B-Complex.  

Thiamine is needed to turn carbohydrates, fats and proteins into energy for the body.  Feeling sick to your stomach after carbohydrate consumption can be an early symptom of low thiamine.  Please discuss the low thiamine possibly with your doctor.  Thiamine is water soluble.  Your body excretes any excess easily.  Thiamine has no toxicity level.  Thiamine supplementation may be beneficial.  Please discuss thiamine supplementation with your doctor before starting.

Hope this helps!

 I

 

 

I agree that inflammation may be a factor (diet which contributes to insulin resistance and leads to obesity).  I also agree that if you have autoimmune disease, TD2 may need different treatment options as indicated in the study:

“Indeed, T2D patients with a significant autoimmune component: (i) need insulin earlier during disease progression, (ii) are likely to poorly respond to classical anti-diabetic medications, (iii) may be highly responsive to immunomodulator therapy (16).“

 

Congratulations on that A1c....wow!  

[Posterboy]

On 9/23/2020 at 10:52 AM, Crystal Starkey said:

Hello, I am new to this...Just found out I have celiac disease and I'm diabetic.  Double whammy!!  Just wondering if anyone else is too and if so, what advice do you have for me?

Crystal,

Try taking you some Chromium Poly....it really helped my blood sugar levels.

Also try taking you some Benfotiamine a fat soluble B1 form found in most diabetic sections.

It helped me with some of the complications I was having from diabetes.

It (Thiamine) at least in part helped with my complications......

My diabetes is now uncomplicated....meaning no neuropathy or creatine in my kidneys.

Thiamine and Biotin are Sulphur containing Vitamins and they help us regulate oxidative stress in the body.

Here is a coupe links about it of how being low in Sulpur in your body might lead to Diabetic complications and why taking Benfotiamine might help with your diabetes.

See this research entitled "Role of sulfur containing amino acids as an adjuvant therapy in the prevention of diabetes and its associated complications"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23547683/

And this one by Livestrong that list Vitamins that are a good source of Sulphur.

https://www.livestrong.com/article/239140-what-vitamins-contain-sulfur/

You can also take Epsom Salt baths too to get more Sulphur into your body in a gentle, relaxing way.

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise.

Posterboy,

[ch88]

Also consider theanine supplementation. It has neuro-protective, and strong antioxidant properties. It will help the cells in your intestine grow. 

http://www.phcog.com/article.asp?issn=0973-1296;year=2018;volume=14;issue=55;spage=36;epage=39;aulast=Saha

[Crystal Starkey]

On 9/25/2020 at 10:00 PM, Posterboy said:

Crystal,

Try taking you some Chromium Poly....it really helped my blood sugar levels.

Also try taking you some Benfotiamine a fat soluble B1 form found in most diabetic sections.

It helped me with some of the complications I was having from diabetes.

It (Thiamine) at least in part helped with my complications......

My diabetes is now uncomplicated....meaning no neuropathy or creatine in my kidneys.

Thiamine and Biotin are Sulphur containing Vitamins and they help us regulate oxidative stress in the body.

Here is a coupe links about it of how being low in Sulpur in your body might lead to Diabetic complications and why taking Benfotiamine might help with your diabetes.

See this research entitled "Role of sulfur containing amino acids as an adjuvant therapy in the prevention of diabetes and its associated complications"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23547683/

And this one by Livestrong that list Vitamins that are a good source of Sulphur.

https://www.livestrong.com/article/239140-what-vitamins-contain-sulfur/

You can also take Epsom Salt baths too to get more Sulphur into your body in a gentle, relaxing way.

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise.

Posterboy,

Yes, very helpful!  I feel much better since I'm gluten free and working on the diabetes part but I also feel like I am low on something.  I will definitely talk to my doctor about all of this!  I'm realizing my doctor does not know much about Celiac Disease. 

[Posterboy]

On 9/26/2020 at 11:55 AM, ch88 said:

Also consider theanine supplementation. It has neuro-protective, and strong antioxidant properties. It will help the cells in your intestine grow. 

http://www.phcog.com/article.asp?issn=0973-1296;year=2018;volume=14;issue=55;spage=36;epage=39;aulast=Saha

Ch88,

Thank you for that! I always enjoy good pure research that highlights possible changes I can use to give me an edge against my diabetes.

I have been fighting it back for 10 years now successfully with medicine!

Hopefully this Theanine research will help me get rid of my blood sugars issues for good!

You rarely ever see research that so clearly shows a "dose dependent" reaction.

Again thanks for the  good research!

If it helps I will report back...

Almost everything I have tried so far....only works for a few weeks or months at most as a fall back....measure only....not a true treatment per se.

For any one looking for a "Temporary" supplement that can be helpful for treating yourself when you are wanting to sneak a sweet treat into your diet.

Gymnema  an Indian herb called the "Sugar Destroyer" works pretty well 30 minutes after you have begun your meal.

Nature's Way sells a Standardized extract of it (Gymnema)...

As always I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise.

Posterboy,

[KyleL]

On 9/23/2020 at 11:52 AM, Crystal Starkey said:

Hello, I am new to this...Just found out I have celiac disease and I'm diabetic.  Double whammy!!  Just wondering if anyone else is too and if so, what advice do you have for me?

I am type 1 and also have Celiac. I have had type 1 for 26 years and Celiacs 2 years. Since I have been on a gluten-free diet and been on Medtronic insulin pump 670g my A1C has been 5.7 to 5.2 now. I believe having Celiac had really helped my blood sugars.

[Scott Adams]

In case you are interested we've done many research summaries and articles on diabetes and celiac disease:

https://www.celiac.com/celiac-disease/celiac-disease-amp-related-diseases-and-disorders/diabetes-and-celiac-disease/ 

[Crystal Starkey]

8 minutes ago, Scott Adams said:

In case you are interested we've done many research summaries and articles on diabetes and celiac disease:

https://www.celiac.com/celiac-disease/celiac-disease-amp-related-diseases-and-disorders/diabetes-and-celiac-disease/ 

Thank you for the information!  Have you ever heard of a correlation between someone who is taking the blood pressure medication, Lisinopril, and developing Celiac from this?

[Scott Adams]

The only medication I've seen possibly linked to celiac disease is Benicar, and it's unclear if there is a real link, although there are lawyers suing the maker for this:

https://www.celiac.com/tags/benicar/

[plumbago]

37 minutes ago, Crystal Starkey said:

Thank you for the information!  Have you ever heard of a correlation between someone who is taking the blood pressure medication, Lisinopril, and developing Celiac from this?

In January 2018, there was a discussion on this site of the ARB class of medications and villi blunting. Lisinopril is an ACE inhibitor, not an ARB. I haven't heard about a linkage between lisinopril and Celiac or between lisinopril and villi blunting, but that doesn't mean much!

Here's something I cited in Jan. 2018:

Small Bowel Histopathologic Findings Suggestive of Celiac Disease in an Asymptomatic Patient Receiving Olmesartan

“Although Rubio-Tapia et al are careful to avoid claiming a proven causal relationship between olmesartan therapy and the observed spruelike enteropathy, the data are highly suggestive of more than just a coincidental association.

“They further suggest that a potential mechanism for the enteropathy could relate to inhibitory effects of angiotensin II receptor antagonists on transforming growth factor β action because transforming growth factor β is important in gut immune homeostasis.

“Although anecdotal, these observations lead to the hypothesis that olmesartan, and perhaps other angiotensin II receptor antagonists, could be a cause of intraepithelial lymphocytosis in architecturally preserved proximal small intestinal mucosa.”

(One of the patients in question was offered the opportunity to do a gluten-free diet, but he/she declined.)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3547582/

 

 

[cyclinglady]

2 hours ago, Crystal Starkey said:

Thank you for the information!  Have you ever heard of a correlation between someone who is taking the blood pressure medication, Lisinopril, and developing Celiac from this?

Some of the ACE inhibitors caused villi damage.   The drug caused damage that looked like  (mimicked) celiac disease (no positive antibodies tests, but it was not celiac disease.  Small intestinal damage resolved once the patients stopped using the drugs.  Ask your pharmacist if your current medication is safe.  Read all the side effects and talk to your doctor if you still have concerns.  

Learn more:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3956379/

 

[cyclinglady]

12 hours ago, KyleL said:

I am type 1 and also have Celiac. I have had type 1 for 26 years and Celiacs 2 years. Since I have been on a gluten-free diet and been on Medtronic insulin pump 670g my A1C has been 5.7 to 5.2 now. I believe having Celiac had really helped my blood sugars.

Do you mean because of malabsorption (from active celiac disease),  you were better able to manage your blood sugar?  Or did you mean by treating your celiac disease with a gluten free diet, your blood sugar numbers have improved.  Congrats on being in the 5% club!  

[Crystal Starkey]

3 minutes ago, cyclinglady said:

Some of the ACE inhibitors caused villi damage.   The drug caused damage that looked like  (mimicked) celiac disease (no positive antibodies tests, but it was not celiac disease.  Small intestinal damage resolved once the patients stopped using the drugs.  Ask your pharmacist if your current medication is safe.  Read all the side effects and talk to your doctor if you still have concerns.  

Learn more:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3956379/

 

I spoke to my pharmacist already and he did say that one of the possible side affects is celiac disease.  So of course my next step is talking to my doctor.  

[cyclinglady]

25 minutes ago, Crystal Starkey said:

I spoke to my pharmacist already and he did say that one of the possible side affects is celiac disease.  So of course my next step is talking to my doctor.  

Sorry, but where is the proof?  It can cause celiac-like damage, but not actual celiac disease.  Once off the medication, healing occurs.  Of course there could be the possibility that you already had undiagnosed celiac disease when you went on this drug.  Many  things (more than a dozen) can cause sprue damage to the small intestine:

https://www.cureceliacdisease.org/faq/what-else-can-cause-damage-to-the-small-intestine-other-than-celiac-disease/
 

“

Causes of Villous Atrophy Other Than Celiac Disease (from the link above.  Source: University of Chicago celiac disease research center.  

Giardiasis

Collagenous sprue

Common-variable immunodeficiency

Autoimmune enteropathy

Radiation enteritis

Whipple’s disease

Tuberculosis

Tropical sprue

Eosinophilic gastroenteritis

Human immunodeficiency virus enteropathy

Intestinal lymphoma

Zollinger–Ellison syndrome

Crohn’s disease

Intolerance of foods other than gluten (e.g., milk, soy, chicken, tuna)

 

And this from the Mayo Clinic which on one of the tables list ACE inhibitors as a cause for intestinal damage and is not celiac disease:

https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(17)30892-3/pdf

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by cyclinglady

[plumbago]

1 hour ago, cyclinglady said:

Some of the ACE inhibitors caused villi damage.   The drug caused damage that looked like  (mimicked) celiac disease (no positive antibodies tests, but it was not celiac disease.  Small intestinal damage resolved once the patients stopped using the drugs.  Ask your pharmacist if your current medication is safe.  Read all the side effects and talk to your doctor if you still have concerns.  

Learn more:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3956379/

 

Olmesartan is not an ACE inhibitor. It's an ARB (angiotension receptor blocker).