Questions Regarding Antigliadin Antibody Testing

[Benjaminn]

Hello all, I have some questions regarding my recent Food Allergy Testing. I was blood tested for Candida and for Food Allergies and came back negative for gluten but positive for casein and one of the four proteins associated with whey, bovine serum albumin.

My first question is, since casein and gluten are so similar, is it normal to test positive to casein and not gluten? It seems every diet I come across for casein free includes gluten free. My casein and whey sensitivities are only slight, scoring +1 out of a [+1 to +5] scale. The doctor hopes that by eliminating casein for 3 months and the candida, I should no longer be sensitive.

My second question is, my AntiGliadin Antibodies came back:

IgG ELISA Test: 6 units; negative

IgA ELISA Test: 10 units; negative

It says on my test results that <20 is negative and from 20 to 30 signals weak positive, but I can not actually recall how much wheat I had eaten in the past couple of weeks. I don't eat large amounts of bread on a daily basis, but I do have sandwiches every other day or so and have never watched my diet for gluten. I probably consumed some gluten at least in the week prior to the testing, but is it normal to score as high as a 10 on the IgA immunoglobin? I am assuming this is equal to a 5 on the tests which use the standard of 10 as >10 equals positive. I would expect from a lifetime of eating bread and such the immunoglobins would be higher if I was positive, but I have never experienced irritable bowel syndrome or other such symptoms. I did come back somewhat Vitamin D deficient which could be from lack of sun. Is this something I should worry about though? Am I scoring false negative on the gluten? The doctor believes the casein and whey sensitivities stem from dysbiosis but expected me to come back positive to gluten as well. I was thrilled to be negative, but now she is making me worried that I am gluten intolerant and don't even know it.

My last question is, a couple of my food allergies were to yeast: both Baker's at +3 and Brewer's at +2. Is this a further symbol that I may in fact be gluten intolerant?

Has anyone else had these tests done or who is knowledgable about the results? I would appreciate any help at all. Thank you!

[ravenwoodglass]

You mention eating gluten for a week before the tests. How long have you been gluten free or gluten light? It can take time for the antibodies to build back up after you have been gluten free. How did your body react when you added gluten back in? Have you had your total IGA done? If you are naturally IGA defiecient that can cause a false negative.

Also if these were panels for allergies gluten intolerance will not show up because it is not an allergy.

[Benjaminn]

You mention eating gluten for a week before the tests. How long have you been gluten free or gluten light? It can take time for the antibodies to build back up after you have been gluten free. How did your body react when you added gluten back in? Have you had your total IGA done? If you are naturally IGA defiecient that can cause a false negative.

Also if these were panels for allergies gluten intolerance will not show up because it is not an allergy.

I have never been gluten free or gluten light. Before the test I didn't even really know anything about gluten. It has only been two weeks since my blood was drawn. I did not have my total IgA measured, but I would assume that my IgG antibodies would be vastly different if I was? I read that only 2 to 5% of people are IgA deficient? I know gluten is not an allergy, but I was just mentioning the allergies in case they somehow correlated with gluten intolerance. I read on another board that the antibodies have a 120 day half life? In the 120 days previous I can say with relatively certainty that I ate wheat products at least every other day. I am concerned however, as I have read that usually a casein sensitivity comes along with a gluten sensitivity. My casein and whey sensitivites, even though they are slight, make me believe that I may also be reacting to gluten. I am wondering more if my test results are on average with negative results, or if my results are above average as a negative, signifying a possible false negative? I saw on your signature that you tested negative to blood results for a long period of time? Are you IgA deficient? Is this something I should look into or is the similarities between my IgA and IgG results enough?

[gfb1]

My first question is, since casein and gluten are so similar, is it normal to test positive to casein and not gluten? It seems every diet I come across for casein free includes gluten free. My casein and whey sensitivities are only slight, scoring +1 out of a [+1 to +5] scale. The doctor hopes that by eliminating casein for 3 months and the candida, I should no longer be sensitive.

what makes you think that casein and gluten are similar?? they are not. casein is from milk (read: animal protein -- and, in most food products, specifically cow's milk), while gluten is a plant protein found in some of the grasses (wheat, rye, barley).

i seem to say this a lot in the forum; but, not to be mean-spirited or rude, but....

i'm not sure what a 'candida' problem is.. but, be careful. there are a lot of people making money by providing genuinely sick folks Open Original Shared Link.

[ravenwoodglass]

I have never been gluten free or gluten light. Before the test I didn't even really know anything about gluten. It has only been two weeks since my blood was drawn. I did not have my total IgA measured, but I would assume that my IgG antibodies would be vastly different if I was? I read that only 2 to 5% of people are IgA deficient? I know gluten is not an allergy, but I was just mentioning the allergies in case they somehow correlated with gluten intolerance. I read on another board that the antibodies have a 120 day half life? In the 120 days previous I can say with relatively certainty that I ate wheat products at least every other day. I am concerned however, as I have read that usually a casein sensitivity comes along with a gluten sensitivity. My casein and whey sensitivites, even though they are slight, make me believe that I may also be reacting to gluten. I am wondering more if my test results are on average with negative results, or if my results are above average as a negative, signifying a possible false negative? I saw on your signature that you tested negative to blood results for a long period of time? Are you IgA deficient? Is this something I should look into or is the similarities between my IgA and IgG results enough?

I do not know if I am IGA deficient. If I am none of the scores of doctors I saw ever mentioned it. They also did not mention that up to 30% of celiacs test negative on the blood tests and that I should try the diet anyway for a while. There are also times when people will register a very low positive and doctors will report it as a negative. That happened in my family but the person chose to try the diet anyway and had good results with relief from a skin issue, brain fog and what seemed to be narcolepsy.

In myself what I found to be interesting about the allergy aspect was that before I was put on the elimination diet my allergist did skin testing for 99 substances. The only thing I didn't react to was beech trees. He later said that was when he suspected celiac. He explained that my immune system was in hyperdrive and that was a factor in those allergies. When I was finally diagnosed he said not to be surprised if a lot of my allergies and other problems went away. I was just happy not to have a constant upset stomach anylonger. He was right though. I still have allergies to a couple of things but all others resolved.

What you may want to try after you have finished any testing you want to do is a trial of the Gluten-free Casein-free diet. Sometimes our bodies can tell us what testing can't. After you have been feeling better for while you could then challenge both, one at a time, and see if you react.

[lbd]

Casein and gluten are from different sources, but they are very similar in structure:

"Casein is the phosphoprotein present in milk, which has a molecular structure that is extremely similar to that of gluten[7]. Glutens are proteins found in the plant kingdom subclass of monocotyledone (monocats). These plants are members of the grass family of wheat, oats,rye, triticale and their derivatives. The exorphins i.e. casomorphins and gluteo-morphins or ghadorphin, which are produced by incomplete break down of casein and gluten are easily transferred across the lumen of the gut into the circulation where they exert opioid-type action on the brain[8]."

Reference: Impact of Casein and Gluten Free Dietary Intervention on Selected Autistic Children. Iran J Pediatr. Vol 18 (o 3); Sep 2008

References from this paper noted above:

7. Gilmore J, Bosmans E, Deboutte D, et al. Activation of the inflammatory response in autism. Neuropsychobiol. 2002;45(1): 1-6.

8. Kabierch N, Conference Writing Panel. Measles

[gfb1]

Casein and gluten are from different sources, but they are very similar in structure:

"Casein is the phosphoprotein present in milk, which has a molecular structure that is extremely similar to that of gluten[7]. Glutens are proteins found in the plant kingdom subclass of monocotyledone (monocats). These plants are members of the grass family of wheat, oats,rye, triticale and their derivatives. The exorphins i.e. casomorphins and gluteo-morphins or ghadorphin, which are produced by incomplete break down of casein and gluten are easily transferred across the lumen of the gut into the circulation where they exert opioid-type action on the brain[8]."

[snip]

This was one of many sources that noted the structural similarities between gluten and casein. It is well-known that marker proteins in cell membranes will lock in with similar chemicals. That is how drugs work for the most part - by mimicking structurally a chemical found in the body and producing a similar effect. So, it is certainly not far-fetched to think that the cells reaction to gluten and casein might be similar if those two proteins are structurally very similar.

Laurie

anything is 'possible' i suppose...

however, antibodies interact with epitopes, which are short amino-acid sequences (usually 2-4 amino acids) contained in the proteins. a clustal analysis of the sequence of bovine casein and wheat gluten has a score of 12 -- which is the same score found between human hemoglobin and wheat gluten.

this means that there are NO shared epitopes for allergic reactions to occur.

as for the similarities of short peptides with short sequences of peptides in the endorphin-family of drugs -- things can be 'similar' in a variety of ways --- for example, having amino acids of the same charge rather than the identical amino acid; and even similar to a third party. however, similar sounding words are not the same thing as empirically identical sequence and structure.

related structures can be viewed Open Original Shared Link. Dosages in rat studies demonstrating some effect of one or several exorphins have been 30mg/kg of purified peptide -- so an 60kg person would need to consume 1.8grams of the purified exorphin just to mimic the rat studies. to my knowledge, there is no human equivalent and no way of knowing how much gluten is actually partially digested into an exorphin.

a stretch, imo.

BTW: there is also a sequence in human beta-hemoglobin, YPWTQ, which has a similar degree of homology to the other exorphins, and can also result from incomplete hydrolysis of hemoglobin.

omg; hemoglobin is an endorphin!!!!

ok.. not really

[Benjaminn]

Thank you all very much for the information. Unfortunately, it seems that many of you disagree with each other? I am not sure how to interpret this. The only advice I've been able to understand is to go ahead and try a gluten free diet after getting some more tests done? I have heard that other blood tests other than AGA are more reliable. If so, where should I inquire about getting another blood test? I heard there is one for tTG antibodies which is very reliable?

As to the member questioning the candida diagnosis, the one that posted a link for quackwatch.com which loves to crash on anything which isn't conventional medicine, I have already been to 2 gastroenterologists. One of which who gave me an endoscopy and sent me away with heavy doses of Aciphex, which I took for 4 weeks and had no improvement for my GERD. I had never had GERD until December when I suddenly developed very severe acid reflux. I am now seeing a holistic doctor in hopes that alternative treatment might help. Since I have taken broad spectrum antibiotics several times in the past, it sounds more plausible to me that I have a candida overgrowth which is causing the dysbiosis which is further causing some reactions to food. She has blood tested me for gluten sensitivity and milk sensitivities as well, as I have already mentioned. I am not here to discuss the validity of a candida diagnosis or whether or not I am being "taken" for a fool by some marketing companies. Candida is obviously very controversial and so many people have their own opinions on the matter, all of which I am not interested in. Being helped by a holistic doctor seems far better than being sent away from my gastro doctors with "I don't know why you have so much acid, but please take these pills for the rest of your life and go away." AT LEAST my holistic doctor is testing for gluten intolerance and casein and whey sensitivities, vitamin deficiencies, anemia, and etc., which is something my conventional doctors NEVER considered. So whether or not it works, I'll find out. What I am really concerned about is whether or not my blood tests were reliable? It seems I scored relatively low and my sheet says negative and that I am not even in the range for the weak positive for gluten sensitivity. Again, the casein and whey sensitivities worry me concerning a possible false negative on my gluten sensitivities. Is it reasonable for me to be reassured that since on my antigliadin tests both IgA and IgG were tested and both tests have an 80% sensitivity, that at least one of them should've tested positive if I was gluten intolerant?

[lbd]

I think the moral of the story is that if you go on a gluten free diet and your symptoms resolve and then you reintroduce gluten and they return, you most likely have your answer. Removing casein from the picture may resolve even more symptoms. Despite remarks by some, the current tests for gluten intolerance or sensitivity, gold standard or not, are just not very reliable. I feel sorry for all of the people who get false negative results and are turned away from gluten as a cause without giving the diet a try, who actually do have a gluten sensitivity or celiac disorder. There may be severe health consequences down the road for them.

There are many studies linking similar reactions by the body to casein and gluten. I guess all of those researchers are wrong, despite the fact that they probably have quite a bit of experience listed on their curricula vitae as well.

laurie