gfp

Ooops,I think we posted at the same time!

Yes,I agree that the support groups are invaluble to some,but I think the most useful info I have gained is through a message board I use in UK (and this one.)

To end with a positive note for CUK,

Recently North Lincs PCT recommended their G.P's stopped giving out food prescriptions for coeliacs (to help recoup their financial defecit)

There was uproar-and finally CUK stepped in and overturned the recommendation-but I suppose in those circumstances they had to be seen to do something.

Not unless you know the real reason .... the NHS pays something like £5.25 for a gluten-free loaf which you can buy in the shops for £1.50 so the gluten-free manufacturers cream a whole load off the NHS with CUK support...

Most coeliacs have a yearly subscription so they only pay the £80 or whatever a year ....

In reality wouldn't it be easier to have a coupon on the supermarket loaf you could pay the £1.50 and be reimbursed? Of course the manufacturers would loose a whole load of profit .... but the supermarkets would carry far more gluten-free stuff.

I read that article you mention in crossed grain-''there is no link between coeliac disease and depression''

''They only get depressed through lack of choice''

Oh perleeze!.How patronizing is that.

Pretty much as far as it goes, but you notice its carried as a kinda interview so they are not forced to stick to facts...

My husband has suffered from depression and mental health problems most of his life (I also suspect he's been undiagnosed with celiac disease most of his life)

Interestingly the psychiatrist I spoke to when my husband was sectioned because he was hell bent on suicide said he sees alot of coeliacs.

Rather unsurprising and if you want to add ADD and a whole load of related illnesses I would hardly be surprised if its a very very high number....

Did you read another article in crossed grain that states

''Coeliacs are not more likely to suffer other food intolerances/sensitivities''

I honestly try not to.... they get me seething and we don't want that ^ (as per what we just discussed)

My mum used to send me them and they gather dust ... the problem is so many coeliacs rely on these for information not like you and I who use the internet....

If you have a spare week or month follow the links from here: Open Original Shared Link

Seriously this is an enormous compedium of information ... so pick a single subject ....

I'm afraid I'm inclined to agree

However the local support groups can be very good and run by coelaics as opposed to some director who doesn't have celiac disease.

The problem i have is that I see CUK rather negatively and I don't want my money going to support what I believe to be bad for UK coelaics....

When they use that money to lobby actively against better labelling or to bury research which is inconvenient for them I worry that any money I give is being misused. My mum always pays for a second directory to send me, they are still in the wrappers but I regret her spending £5 that will be negatively used.

On the other hand many of the local groups are an absolute godsend to people who would otherwise be lost....

Hi,

I was diagnosed as gluten intolerant many years ago via a blood test. I am now wanting to be tested again through a biopsy of the small intestine. I have been on a gluten free diet for several years and was wondering over what period of time would I need to eat gluten for damage to the villi of the small intestine to occur (in other words how long does it take for the damage to occur - is it only after a short time or a prolonged period?). I just want to be sure that the biopsy is taken at a time when any damge to the villi will have occurred if the intolerance is present.

Any advice on this matter will be most welcome.

Thanks,

Jeff

Jeff, as a tool as to whether you need a gluten-free diet the biopsy is practically useless and for seeing if you should continue worse than useless. At the same time if it required for other purposes then you are going to have to make yourself very ill. If its for insurance purposes and you need to make sure its positive then you have the problem of making sure its a good sample and also just how damaged the villi have to be before they accept it as proof added to the fact that the chance of misidentification is based on the experience of the person taking the biopsy and the person intepreting the slides. The other use of the biopsy is looking for rather nasty things like cancer or other complications ....

In this case you don't need to eat gluten...

edited to comply with board rules

If you are just doing it for yourself then honestly save the money and discomfort.

Here is a recent article about diagnosis, its in kids but the principle is the same..

Open Original Shared Link

Who warrants a gluten-free diet?

Ford, R. P. K.*

rodney@rodneyford.co.nz

www.rodneyford.co.nz

Paediatric gastroenterology and allergy clinic, Christchurch, New Zealand.

Message: Many more children, other than coeliacs, warrant a gluten-free diet.

Conventionally, medical practitioners have only recommended a gluten-free diet for children with coeliac disease. Doctor Rodney Ford challenges this.

He did an audit of all the children who were referred to him for investigation of coeliac disease (during 2001-2005). Doctor Rodney Ford runs a gastroenterology and allergy clinic, Christchurch, New Zealand.

This group of children all had evidence of an immunological reaction to gluten – they had positive blood tests for IgG-gliadin antibody. Also, they all had an endoscopy to obtain a piece of bowel tissue (a small bowel biopsy).

Finally, they had blood tests to look for evidence of tissue damage (tissue transglutaminase (tTG) or endomesial antibody (EMA))

The novel part of this study was that all of these children with elevated IgG-gliadin antibodies were offered a gluten-free diet, whatever the small bowel histology appearance.

Results: There were 190 children. There were 96 males and 94 females. Their average age was 5.3 years. These children were divided into three groups depending on their test results:

1) 31 (16%) had a histology diagnosis of coeliac disease;

2) 31 (16%) were deemed possible coeliacs because of elevated tTG or EMA antibodies (they had normal small bowel histology);

3) The majority, 128 (67%), did not have any supportive evidence of coeliac disease – they were labelled "not-coeliacs.

The clinical and demographic features were similar across these three groups. Therefore, these groups could not be distinguished from each other by their symptoms.

Of the 128 not-coeliacs, 81 (76%) reported substantial clinical improvements on a gluten-free diet within three months. Of the remaining 47: 31 did not try a gluten-free diet, and 8 reported no benefit.

If the response was measured for only those who tried a gluten-free diet, then 89/97 (92%) of the not-coeliacs got better on a gluten-free diet!

Conclusions: Many children have symptoms that are consistent with coeliac disease. However, most have normal small bowel histology and no evidence of gut damage (normal tTG or EMA results). But they usually have high IgG-gliadin antibody levels.

Notably, these children responded very well to a gluten-free diet, with the great majority improving. – these children are "gluten-sensitive".

This audit shows that IgG-gliadin is a valuable test to detect these children.

Could i call on all your advice. we seem to be going round in the most horrible circles with emma.

she can have 3-5 days no diorhea at all. then bang anything up to 8 episodes in one day!!!

This is not unusual.... its just a complete pain ....I mean its bad enough in adults when you can feel yourself and know what you have eating so it is 10x worse for mothers! This is why as an adult you need to keep a food diary but this gives me a rather cunning plan.....

You can use this to your advantage ... tell the kindergarten she is having problems and that you need to keep a record in case of any other intolerances and have themn write down in a book ANYTHING she eats at kindergarten. That in itself is useful but I bet they will be more careful with supervision !

This time she had what was my worst fear an exposure at kindergarden on friday morning (only her 4 th time there), another child gave her some braed roll and she ate it, only so they say 1-2 mouth fulls but enough i think????

no signs of any thing at all but today 3 days later and her 3rd birthday which is so sad, really violent diorrhea pale crying and misserable and asking to go to bed. Could after 3 days this be the gluten???

Absolutely I can have a single crumb and be up all night or a whole pizza and nothing for 3-4 days....

sorry for moaning per-haps not all that info was nessesary, jus feeling ...............................so sad more so because its her birthday.

thanks tracey

Don't feel sorry, thats why we all come here! Haven't you realised yet

-and they are only acting on the advice from CUK

CUK say most coeliacs can tolerate Codex levels(less than 200ppm),but there are an awful lot of coeliacs who can't.

I find the whole issue confusing.

CUK also recommend that you do not eat more than 5 slices of G.F Codex containing bread.

How do you transfer that theory to a bag of crisps (or how many)??

Nikki, my opinion of CUK isn't very good to say the least. Not the support groups of volunteers, by CUK I mean the HQ organisation.

CUK are self appointed and on a gravy train for life so long as they control.

They campaigned against better labelling based on the fact "we" would be too stupid to understand and should use their directory. For years they continued the 1:1000 stat on their website long after it was recongised to be known to be wrong because it suited their needs.

CUK are interested in one thing and one thing only ... their continued jobs.

Since they are a registered charity you can check their accounts and 90% of their funding comes from gluten-free (as in codex) suppliers and the gluten-free suppliers obviously have a continued interest in using wheat starch or they wouldn't be using it at all.

They have also published under the guise of "interviews" many deliberatly misleading articles in crossed grain... these include "there is no link between celiac disease and depression, celiacs only get depressed because of the lack of choice"

They also actively limit that choice ... look at Italy where resto's are certified and receive a sticker and you can go to tourist info in any italian town and ask... look at the UK where CUK have trademarked the logo and charge companies to use it...pretty much a deterrent....and makes them a few pennies...

The directors also have other business interests you can search at companies house online for free and they operated a gluten free trading co from the same address as CUK with the same directors yet the accounts for CUK show no record of this company paying a penny in rent.

Meanwhile the support groups do a great job but also raise money for CUK ... and this money only flows in one direction. CUK advice the NHS trusts and governmental policy and all of it in a negative way for celaics to increase their dependance on CUK.

They claim to support all UK celiacs .. how can this be true if 9/10 are undiagnosed but most importantly they actively hide research. Somewhere along the line I'm afraid they lost the plot.

The problem is with them calling the shots companies like Walkers will follow.

you are in Europe, correct?

In Europe I believe that they allow Wheat Starch as an ingredient in gluten-free foods, and a small level (so many parts per million) of wheat/gluten to be present in a food and they will still call it "gluten-free"

I've heard that there is a bit of debate on this subject, and as far as I'm concerned, they are the ones that have it wrong, because Zero Tolerance is all that is acceptable. I react to the tiniest amount of cross contamination and I'm sure other's do to.

See what I wrote above.... First I agree on you 100% but lets say they decide 200 ppm can't do any damage (which neither you nor I believe but...) just look at the pure inverse logic ... I mean its just plain wrong ... how can a celaic start to understand whgen the very standard is completely illogical.

So in this case, it would be your personal choice to use this product or not. Me personally, I wouldn't use it... I would avoid anything with any trace of wheat...

this is kinda what we went through with McDonald's French Fries, where they were still claiming for a while that even though a flavoring in the oil was derived from wheat, it was such a minute amount and was processed out that the fries were still gluten-free... they have now come out and said they are not gluten-free.

I think we all need to take a stand with the companies that think that under so many parts per million is acceptable, and we need to let them know that it is NOT acceptable and we want Zero Tolerance for gluten.

Absolutely .. having said that a while back walkers had CC from the cheese and onion which were then not 'suitable' (in their terminology) and they actually issued a warning ....so while they do need to be told gluten-free means gluten-free they deserve recognition on this and the fact they put "suitable for celaics" instead of gluten-free .. I think they do have a disclaimer as well that it might not be suitable for all. Technically they could label them gluten-free.

What needs to be done is the codex needs completely rewriting without any industry involvement so that gluten free means gluten free !

A hangover for you or for him? I mean, for him it would be the same, but add being glutened to being hungover ...

The strange thing is, back in college in my pre-gluten-free days, I knew beer made me sicker than other alcohol. Makes sense now. I drank rum or tequila back then. Strange that I went for the stuff I can have.

When I was working in certain dry countires we used to make beer from a german baby suppliment which was basically malted corn and every time I went back to the UK and drank beer I got the worst hangovers after 1-2 pints...

I drink both Cuervo Gold Tequila and Strongbow and have never had any problems. Does this mean we can't have either???????

Its hard to say....

In europe its common for dextrines and deriviatives to be wheat derived wheras In N. America its very very rare but its only based on economics. Europe has a wheat surplus but not corn wheras the US has corn and wheat ...

No legislation prevents them using wheat so it must just be economics... but based on the dextrine history I would guess the caramel color is the same .... if you want to be certain then write to the US distributer and ask if the ingredients are all gluten free not the cider since this gives them the escape of measuring the whole thing ...

I have to agree that AA doesn't adequately address the issues... it does provide much needed support and is an extremely valid resource, but it should not be the ONLY tool one uses in helping to counter an addiction or two!

I think I was able to quit because of counseling. One on one counseling that forced me to deal with the reasons why I used drugs and drank... (I was sexually abused as a child repeatedly for many years by a relative)... when I finally realized that what happened to me was not my fault and I was able to break out of the "victim mentality" I was able to stop using and drinking... I really haven't desired it at all... In fact when I hear all the talk about the gluten-free beers, I just laugh... my hubby said if I ever find some I should try it, but I just don't want to. I no longer enjoy the feeling of being outside myself, or of numbing the pain.

I had someone tell me once that if I was asking if I had a problem, then it was obvious I didn't because I was asking and not in denial. The truth was, I did have a major problem, and by asking if I had a problem was the first step in gaining the strength I needed to fully address the problem and quit. When I quit, my husband and mother in law were still drinking quite heavily and kept trying to get me to join them and then they were angry at me when I wouldn't join in. (I learned misery loves company)... eventually my husband realized he needed to stop and he was able to do that, it still took him years to quit smoking (and he still is trying to break the cravings),,, my MIL on the other hand is still drinking... fortunately I don't have to live near her!

nini .. try the book by Alan Carr (usually priced about the same price as 1 packet of cigs) I have no interest in them selling the book other than helping someone who helped me!

What you realised (I bolded) ... because it never did help and you realise that now. Whatever it took you to realise that if you could bottle and sell you'd make millions! but the trick is realising without a doubt that drinking to get drunk doesn't help you feel better .. indeed quite the inverse.

I think your hubby quit smoking without ever realising this and that is why he still misses it .(all power to him because i believe its 10x harder and stats back this up and it takes 10x the effort and will power)..and has cravings because the mental connection is craving - cigarette ... he could be missing vitamins or anything and the feeling is still the same and once you realise that and its not actually the cig then you no longer crave ....

Just an example, something us celaics probably know....

You get up and feel like your hungry ... you eat and still feel the same, perhaps its a cup of tea or coffee? and you go through a whole load of things and still feel weird.... its because your body has only the one mechanism (well technically two but thats by the by) to tell you it needs something and that is the feeling of hunger pangs regardless of its a cigarette or a vitamin.

The problem and addication is the mental association we make with that feeling ... for a smoker its "I need a cig" ..

Well im off to go save the planet...... well ummm crap you where not supposed to know that

Sense of humor... always a good sign ...

Dude, on the food if your broke I have a few suggestions....

Get a big bag of cheap rice and do east asian.... with just a bare minimum of meat you can extend it with gluten-free soy sauce, garlic etc. and cheap vegetables...you can use some pinaple juice to marinade some and then a bit of cornstarch to make a sauce to cover the rice...

Another trick i taught my friend is buying the offcuts (prices are based on Paris so what's cheap here might be different for you) but you can buy a whole load of chicken legs or drumsticks really cheap.... about 2$ here

Grab 5-6 in a big pot and add whatever you throw away off the vegetables (except potato peel unless your really despo) so celery leaves , carrot peel etc. etc. most times you can scrounge this stuff completely FREE but any ways its left over from your other veg... stuff like the hard bit outside onions, tops of carrots etc. etc.

Boil it up all together for 1-2 hours with lots of water and if you have some seasoning like bay leaves (can be borrowed off trees outside fancy resto's when you know what it look like) garlic (esp bit you chop off)

and then take out the legs ... carefully they stay freakin hot! Leave em to cool and pull of the skin and chuck it back in the pan ... then pull off all the meat (usually they cool faster without skin) and throw anything dodgy back in the pan bones and all.

Give it another hour .. all the vitamins are still in the pan.... strain it and add a bit more water and boil it another 10-15 mins and strain this too.

So far total cost a couple of bucks....

Now you have the stock.... full of vits, calcium from the bones etc. etc.

recipe 1)

take a large bowl full of stock add decent veg .. doesn't need to be the best buyt stuff you'd eat... a bit of the chicken and you got basic chicken soup ...

From here you can add cream ... or you can add say sweetcorn (tinned works fine) for an asian type ... or just have it as it is.... the adsorbtion of the vitamins is much better because they are laready in the right state ....

There are lots of varaitions but they mean investing in herbs, spices and stock items...

Extra cost $1

recipe 2)

Onion chopped ... fry until tender then add some rice (real arborio is better but hey... ) fry this gently for 30 secs and add the chicken stock (a good cup) and some salt ... keep the liquid and cook for 15 mins and you have basic risotto or paella

extra cost an onion....

recipe 3)

chicken curry, chicken something.... chicken salad ... stirfry with some of the pork ... etc. etc.etc. if you need more ask...

I once lost my wallet on vacation and we were almost pennyless and I bought two rotiserie chickens and some veg we had some gluten-free chorizo saussage and lived like kings for about $5-10 for a week...

Try Patrone Silver - Yum! Yum!

LOL doesn't help though when its a present ....

Lots of caramel coloring in the UK, Europe and Austrialia is not gluten-free ... there is a particualr case involving cider where the manufacturers keep changing their minds as to if its gluten-free or not...

The letter states strongbow cider is gluten-free.

so I sent a letter and asked if the caramel coloring is gluten-free...

answer no....

Because the caramel coloring is (or can be) >200 ppm but when its in the cider its far less so they can say its gluten-free according to the codex.

In reality caramel color is a commodity like pork bellies or oil .. people buy 100 tonnes here and there according to what is cheapest so when there is a glut of wheat the price from wheat drops etc. so the manufacturers just take what their suppliers source.

One more reason to add to the list of why I want to visit my ancestral home. I don't suppose you could get his recipe? I am so glad for you that you found this place and I am sure you will visit it often.

If not I use 60/40 buckwheat flour and rice flour .. works really well but I have to remember not to have it too often.

Susan, this might not be a practical suggestion at all, and I wouldn't be offended if someone wants to flame me for saying so - but how about having ONE drink on the 4th? But I really mean ONE only!

My personal belief is, that an addiction isn't really over until you can choose to have something in moderation, and stop when you decide to. I know it's hard, and I know for a lot of people just to stay alive and healthy it's better to just avoid alcohol or whatever they were addicted to altogether. But I think it's possible to decide "I'm going to have one drink tonight, and then I'm going to stop". The key is to make a concious decision, and be honest with yourself about how badly you want to go on drinking after that, and not make any excuses to do it. A bit like staying gluten free in fact...

I'm rooting for all of you! You can do it!!!

Pauliina

This is what I tend to think although excepting the word 'addiction'. If you replace that with dependance ...

I think a true addiction is when you can no longer do it in moderation and it becomes all or nothing ....

In these cases then its basically sometihng for life... you do or you don't....

This is why I was so prickly about the definitions.... earlier in the thread.

The AA method is pretty poor ... it doesn't address addiction per-se and out oif everything I ever read on the subject I find the writings of Alan Carr (the quit smoking guy) the most real... his method is keep smoking while you read the book, and if you don't you miss the whole point... because through this you realise that the addiction is an addiction and doesn't give you ANYTHING except try and return you to a normal state...

If you quit and you regret you will spend your whole life looking back and wondering and feeling like you missed out... and he points out that the founder of AA died from emphyscemia while still being unable to quit smoking. He has people who have come to him after quiting heronine or crack on their own but unable to quit smoking...

What dingogirl is drinking isn't in itself dangerous.. what is dangerous is her going past that no-return point.

Once you pass that point then its practically impossible to have an odd drink... and odd cigarette or whatever your poision is....

Unlike smoking the pleasure of a nice wine is a genuine pleasure... its not something to give up if you can control it but presently with the interference of the meds dingogirl is stuck between a rock and hard place ... I rather beleive what is really giving her cravings is the combination because they both heighten the effects of each other and are both addictive.

The problem being if she just drinks she will miss that feeling because it won't be the same and if she takes the tablet alone she will equally miss the 'feeling'...

I guess Im just weird but I almost never bruise, I can fall down stairs and not show a bruise ...?

Ive been like this forever ... and even when I break bones the bruising is so minimal Dr's just dismiss it and i have to play along just to get xray'd ...

If anyone has an explanation I'm open to any suggestions?

Yup, I know all that already....fortunately or unfortunately I come from a long line of Southern drunks with a VERY high tolerance for drugs/alcohol. And, Norwegian on my mother's side (geographical predisposition). Klonepin I use for emergencies, maybe twice a month but when the boyfriend broke up with me A-G-A-I-N - - that's when I took three or four with the bottle of wine (barfed it up, by the way, on purpose as I got kind of scared). I am hoping to not need Klonepin at all, sometime in the future.

but seriously Klonepin OR alcohol no wonder you are craving .... the physchotropics so weird things with alcohol... like it catches you all at once... and incombination with any Klonepin its a recipee for addiction... I mean klonepin by itself is addictive enough but combined with the alcohol already amplified by physchotropics is pretty scary ....

Also the Klonepin is a very long acting drug and there are similar ones with much shorter half-lives ...so if you drank the next day it wouldn't be so bad but with Klonepin, as I remember its 50 hrs or so....

Sorry I gotta go... as it happens I didn't drink anything tonight but my girlfriend is home from work and needs some attention!

Oh boy...is this a timely topic. I am going through the same stuggle myself and have decided I'm an alcoholic already. My drinking has seriously increased and becoming at minimum a four-day-a-week habit. Every single person on my dad's side is or was alcoholic/addict.....they're either dead now or just not

DingoGirl, now I see the post.... since I know a bit of your medical history I can guess a few of the drugs.... seriously physchotropic drugs and alcohol are pretty much a sure fire recipee for disaster...

Klonopin and alcohol is a pretty effective way to screw up your liver nor should it be used in anyone with a history of .. heck, im just repeating the product advisories PLEASE READ THIS

Open Original Shared Link

Sorry its describing a lot of your symptoms ... please just read it!

Bien, mais vous habitez EN FRANCE et c'est la.....j'ai oublier (sp?) la mot....that's what everyone does! Vraiment la belle cuisine....ah, to be a Celiac in France, je pense que c'est plus facile?

Ooops - still don't quite know how to do those quotes in between like you all do..... don't bother explaining, my brain is feeble......

Ahh go-on its not hard you just wrap the word "quote" in square brackets at the front and "/quote" at the end of each quoted bit (can''t write it else it will quote ...) you can be fancier but that will get you off to a good start.

Some things are easier and others harder. Fresh produce is easier I think, unless you live in the sticks in the US and even in Paris I have lots of markets to choose from but awareness is nearly non-existant ....

Haven't read your alcohol post yet... I did notice you had posted on it but if I look I will end up commenting again!

Saw the girlfriend of my bipolar friend last night btw... he has a morbid fear of death and is working in the graveyard .. although not nights... and apparently he's coping really well, given up weed and down to 2 sixpacks a day (and non export at that) although the Dr's keep telling hoim he needs to stop drinking for the medication to work properly ...its still a massive step for him!

When I'm alone and my girlfriend is away I tend to invite friends over .... it helps to have the incentive. Strangely I rarely drink when I cook.... ?? dunno why?

Yup, gorgeous cat....I miss my fat, healthy, Cookster kitty....17 pounds, tortie-point Himalayan (not purebred).....quite the huntress and lived an amazing life, only sick the last two weeks of her 14 years (liver failure)..... When one of my dogs dies I am getting a kitty....so much easier than dogs.

I disagree GFP, I'd rather open a can (for dogs), go to a drive-thru, order up, tear a bag open (for dogs also) ANY day than have to do all this cooking I do now.....I absolutely LOATHE the acquisition and preparation of food, always have, always will....what a terrible and cruel irony Celiac is! Having to CONSTANTLY worry about food and COOK FOOD....the horror......no more just driving through El Pollo or running anywhere to pick up food.....aghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!! if and when I win the lottery (I guess I have to buy tickets to win ) I am getting a part-time chef......what joy!

Of course the flip side of this diet is I haven't eaten this way in years....VERY healthy and almost no processed food but how freakin' tedious to steam vegetables every day!!

How long have you been gluten-free?

I'm asking because I think cooking is something you get used to.... I mean I would die without my dishwasher but its an aquired perspective. When you base your life around running to El Pollo then you obviously don't stock up but I actually really enjoy food shopping now.

Im not saying it wouldn't be useful sometimes but if you can make it a leisure activity it can be quite fun it just takes planning and attitude.

When i buy food I walk round the market and start thinking what I can make and cooking can be quite rewarding but it helps to have someone to share ... and chat with as Im cooking, when Im alone its much harder....but I rtend to cook 3-4 portions and freeze 2 and put one in the fridge.

The thing is i can whip anything up pretty much from memory so when Im shopping recipees come to mind and I only really buy fresh fruit and vegetables but only because i have done it so long. When I was first diagnosed it was a horror and I would go to supermarkets and practically break down but once i got the knack and stopped trying to find gluten-free substitutes everywhere I started to enjoy it.

What really annoys me is inverse shopping as i call it where I go to find somethig inparticular so now i let the market decide and buy what looks good/fresh instead.

Are you in the military?

and citizen of what country?

Yup, definitely quite a life for that cat....but oh, the poor budgie. That must have been an elusive and tasty treat.

As for that Libyan German Shepherd....wow, what a diet....it's just SO much easier to scoop the food out of a bag, isn't it?

I dunno... its like some people find it easier to carry home tins than make something themself for human food as well.

I never found it easier ... when you have the ingredients a pound of minced beef can be whatever you want whereas if you have tins of spagetti sauce or chilli sauce then its pretty much fixed and either way I can make the sauce while i stick the rice/gluten-free pasta pan on and wait for it to boil....

I can never understand people who say its easier .. its just practice and I find it easier picking up a few fresh veg and meat than lugging heavy cans!

Same goes fo the cat ... it was just easier to give it scraps than keep buying packets/tins and have it refuse to eat "real" cat food.

anyway if your interested found some photo's unfortunately earlier ones are with my ex-wife ....

edited to comply with board rules.

GFP, what a life your cat had. That's fantastic.

You don't know the half of it ...

He was born in Africa and lived in a few African countries then his first flight to Vienna where he had to stop with his aunty, best pal and her other cat who he never did get on with while I got a job anywhere not the UK.... (because of the quarantine at the time) then he lived In Norway through 2 winters and saw his first snow... quite a shock as he ran out through the balcony window into 4 feet of snow ... and finally quarantine restrictions lifted and I was able to go back to the UK....

I know you can feed dogs the same way, but they must eat this way exclusively or they will get pancreatitis (another thing my Tika had).

Yep dogs are far more adaptive to diet which is good and bad.... once they do get used to it they really need to stick with it. I had a friend in Libya with a huge German Shepard (the largest I have ever seen) and was an ex-East German military dog. He fed her exclusively on meats and would take a whole grilled chicken and take out the two bones from the back of the thighs and she would just crunch the whole thing down in 2-3 bites but she could only do that because he had adopted her very young and trained her digestive system The only dog that ever scared my cat... who at one point in kittenhood decided the best food on earth was the budgie he kept in a huge cage in his garden....

If you have to ask the question, the answer is "Yes." You felt the need to ask someone if you have a problem with alcohol, that means you do. It is weighing on your mind and conscious. I am glad you have decided to quit.

Quite the opposite I think, most alcoholics are in denial .. while you are still asking the question then shai76's advice seems pertinent....

If you don't keep asking the question how would you ever realise there is a problem or even try quiting and realise it is a problem at least until it is too late and by that time its all or nothing. Neither did she decide to quit ... if she tries to quit and fails then she needs help but if she quits and has no problem then exersizing a little self control is probably perfectly adequate.

If you try to quit and fail then you have a problem and you should seek help for quitting. There are lots of great support groups, and it is nothing to be ashamed of. Congratulations on realizing you might have a problem. Most people who have addictions don't make it that far. smile.gif

worth repeating a second time

Do you cook it? He never really cared for people food but lately he will eat a little bite usually from something grilled. I heard not to give a cat garlic-have you? I put garlic on alot. Thanks, LLee

Cooking: It depends what it is.... cheap non free range chicken yes... but free range beef no.

Raw chicken we used to chop up and stick in a little chicken broth ... and cook... by gentle boiling

Seasonings ... nope except when he was a kitten he would try anything ?? chips, bread ... the weirdest things.

Once he was matured he wasn't interested in anything with seasoning, be it garlic or herbs but usually even with a roast chicken we would just wash off the carcass and give it to him whole after we had picked off the human food.

At some point we figured with him eating so much wild stuff there was little point cooking most of it..

I'm sure the good cat food is OK but at least in the UK it was more expensive than offcuts .... and it kinda forces me into the kind of shops I try and avoid like supermarkets... ( I don't not use them I just prefer to buy my fresh produce from a butcher or farmer...)

I always bought my meat direct and butchered it myself (being a country boy) and basically I just saved the bits with gristle running through .. the cat didn't seem to care ... you could give him a poor cut of meat in a big lump and he would just leave the strings of gristle ... etc. in a neat little pile.

I usually found this pretty simple, its just something to get used to... for instance when filleting a chicken breast I would just run the knife a bit deeper down the ligament and that would be the cat pile. Throw it in a chicken broth and boil it gently ...

We were lucky in that our neighbour had two cats and she fed them the same ... so when we went away for a weekend she would just pop in and pop down the same as we did ...

Our next but one neighbour the other side of the cat one was a vet (though large farm animals) and he always said we were crazy but everytime he had to go in for shots he would remark how healthy he was... and comparing our cat and those of our immediate neighbour with his you could see why.

My cat was 14 lbs and no extra fat ... and both the direct neighbours cats were the same ... they used to fight like cats and dogs ... but all three more or less ignored the scrawny vets cat passing through their territory ...like it wasn't a threat at all.

Like you I was a dog person and totally unprapred for cattyness. A dog will always eat if only because YOU have it to them whereas a cat will mostly only eat when it wants.

The cheap cat food contains lots of addictive things (including gluten which cats are just completely unequiped to deal with) so this is why they always pounce on it.

Our cat died of cancer (actually we had to put him down) but I am really glad we let him be a cat.

We had sleepless nights and worries about him getting run over .. we chose our house because it was cat friendly and all but in the end he had what I hope was a good life as close to being a "real cat" as we could.

I'm glad your going to stop drinking.. it would be the view of most involved with alcoholics that if you drink every day and often up to a bottle of wine.. yet are still functioning (hold a job, not falling over, no memory loss) that you are a functioning alcoholic. In my book anyone who drinks every single day has an issue with alcohol at the very least.

Best to you! Susan

Almost every Italian and French person over the age of 10-14 drinks alcohol nearly everyday. Yet you rarely see them drunk.

In contrast, most Norwegains only drink 2 days a week, however you often see them drink until they vomit and then continue drinking...and this is grown up people in business suits.

Most Norwegains consider the French and Italians to be alcoholics

However having worked in many dry countries I find that when access to alcohol is found the French and Italians rarely partake unless its good alcohol and most brits, americans and canadians seem ready to drink anything containing alcohol.

IMHO you can label them as functioning alcoholics but its pretty meaningless, the person ready to drink home made hooch has IMHO a problem and the person who will quite happily wait 3 months until they rotate off doesn't.

Terms like "functioning alcoholic" are just terms invented by people who can't control their drinking and it misses the exact point which is the addiction. If someone drinks a bottle of wine a day and doesn't have any problems stopping for 3 months then I fail to see a problem. Conversely if someone binge drinks 1-2 times a week they are more likley to have a problem.

Bringing in terms like functioning alcoholic just clouds the issue which is does someone have symptoms or problems if they are denied alcohol ... if you do then you are a alcoholic and if you don't then you are not.

Glad you figured that out. I suspect my cat has it too. I must find some gluten-free food for him. I've been busy with his litter box. Does anyone know of any gluten-free cat food? I love your photo! LLee

Fresh meat, fish and birds? with fur, feathers and all.

You have a little adjustment over this as the poor cat's digestive system gets back to what it should be which can give a little D ... my cat used to go through this every time he came back from the cattery which fed them dried food and much of the dried food is packed full of addictive stuff ... there is a reason the cat in the ads always chooses the right bowl

It doesn't need to be any more expensive ... we used to give our cat roast chicken or whatever...usually the difficult but fatty parts like wings and the carcass and he would strip it completely leaving all the bones.

Raw beef offcuts etc. etc. his own personal choice was dormice (soft and chewy on the outside but crunchy on the inside) and rabbits ... (we lived in the country) as a backup we used to have tuna in water (but it was a bit expensive so just a backup) ...

If the cat eats fur its by choice... not because they can't seperate it from the meat, they can pretty much pick anything out of anything, like worming pills out of anything you hide them in!

In fact I think fresh meat falls between the cost of the budget (mainly grain and rice) cat food and the expensive meat only cat foods....

I think you've given me the impetus to just stop drinking, which is what I wanted.

I think you obviously took that first step yourself....not knocking the advice given but the most important thing is YOU realise if YOU have a problem.

To be honest I probably drink a similar amount but the difference is I have no probs stoppng whenever. I know I'm a guy and the limits are a little different but if I go away somewhere (and my old job had me in dry countries very often) I don't even think about it...

I don't think the amount is the problem per-se (yet) but

In the last couple of months I've become aware that drinking wine gives me diarrhoea. I've tested this several times and know that I'm much better if I don't drink at all. But I'm still drinking. I gave up gluten without batting an eyelid. Even chocolate, apart from a few pangs was no problem. Despite several determined efforts not to drink wine I haven't managed it, which makes me worry that I've become addicted to alcohol. This must sound completely daft -

No it doesn't sound daft but it does give cause to worry..

If you try and give it up and haven't then this is a worry... its indicating the potential for a problem

I have a friend who drinks way more than either of us...and he stayed with me for a while last summer, indeed this guy is known for his falling asleep in bars and becoming totally incoherent but last summer he quit for 3 months (to the day)... weird but true. I myself used to drink a bottle of vodka per night (15-20 years ago) but never found it hard to stop....

You obviously realise that this is a slippery slope but it sounds like you also would like to enjoy a odd glass... as it happens I had dinner last night with the girlfriend of another friend who is an alcoholic ... he moved back to the US a year ago and his girlfriend (a lecturer in medieval romance languages) is over here for a conference .. and we were discussing this last night over wine

She was blaming herself a little for not being firmer over this ... but as I pointed out "when would you discuss this?" because every true alcoholic I know has more excuses and is inapproachable on the subject....

excuses like "well she drinks a diet coke every morning, its no different to me drinking beer"

"It settles my stomach"

"beer isn't real alcohol"

The list is pretty much endless but your post leads me to believe you are a long way from this....but on the start of the slippery slope non the less. You don't mention timing ... is the time you start creeping forwards each week ?

I rather think you need to take a break and I don't mean a week but perhaps 3 months. Preferably with someone you can REALLY trust to hold you to it... by which I don't mean someone who will let the odd glass go but someone who will give you a hard time ... and you need to be totally honest with them.

It needs to be someone who will take what you said here and not say "oh you are OK" ...

Its summer so if you have vacation coming up why not take the opportunity of going somewhere outside your routine to kick off not drinking?