Has Anyone Had Low Vitamin B12 ?

[Charliexxx]

Dear All, 

Just a quick question. Has anyone had vitamin B12 deficiency as a consequence or Pernicious Anaemia diagnosed (alongside) ? 
Please note, this illness is often poorly recognised, misdiagnosed, mistreated and under treated. 

All the best, 

C x

[Nick Cheruka]

2 hours ago, Charliexxx said:

Dear All, 

Just a quick question. Has anyone had vitamin B12 deficiency as a consequence or Pernicious Anaemia diagnosed (alongside) ? 
Please note, this illness is often poorly recognised, misdiagnosed, mistreated and under treated. 

All the best, 

C x

Hi Charliexxx, I just had recent bloodwork done to try to determine why I’m feeling fatigued half way through the day usually just after lunch for approx. 3hrs this lasts sometimes. I will fall a sleep while trying to eat lunch without even knowing it numerous times even though I would try to stay awake I was out! My bloodwork showed low vitamin B12 so my doctor recommended taking 1000mcg of B12 to add to what little I was getting from a multivitamin which was only 90mcg so for the last month I’ve been taking 1090mcg of B12 and it has helped some but not how I may have hoped! I still have the issue just not as bad but non the less it’s still an issue as far as that goes! I am do for bloodwork to see if the 1000mcg has increased the B12 on the new bloodwork compared to last months and then I’ll know if my body is getting the amount I need! Celiac of 20+yrs never had B12 deficiencies in the past! Are you taking B12 supplements? Hopefully this helps!☘️

[JB23]

6 hours ago, Charliexxx said:

Dear All, 

Just a quick question. Has anyone had vitamin B12 deficiency as a consequence or Pernicious Anaemia diagnosed (alongside) ? 
Please note, this illness is often poorly recognised, misdiagnosed, mistreated and under treated. 

All the best, 

C x

I had a very significant B12 deficiency last year. Turned out my body was just not absorbing it at all. My doctor had me take oral B12 and I got another blood test 3 months later and there was no change. Then they had me come in the office for 3 months to receive B12 injections so it could go right into my bloodstream. Not only did it work quickly but I felt SO much better!   My endocrinologist suggested I take Sublingual B12 (discovers under tongue and also goes directly into bloodstream—avoiding the absorption issue via my GI tract). This has worked extremely well. Every blood test has been excellent since adding that to my daily intake. Those sublingual pills are available at drug stores, but I now order mine on auto subcribe on Amazon. Hope this helps. This was super frustrating for me until we got it all figured out!

JB

[Nick Cheruka]

43 minutes ago, JB23 said:

I had a very significant B12 deficiency last year. Turned out my body was just not absorbing it at all. My doctor had me take oral B12 and I got another blood test 3 months later and there was no change. Then they had me come in the office for 3 months to receive B12 injections so it could go right into my bloodstream. Not only did it work quickly but I felt SO much better!   My endocrinologist suggested I take Sublingual B12 (discovers under tongue and also goes directly into bloodstream—avoiding the absorption issue via my GI tract). This has worked extremely well. Every blood test has been excellent since adding that to my daily intake. Those sublingual pills are available at drug stores, but I now order mine on auto subcribe on Amazon. Hope this helps. This was super frustrating for me until we got it all figured out!

JB

Thank you! I’m do for bloodwork to recheck the B12 since adding the other 1000mcg’s to see if that upped my values! How much mcg’s of the sublingual do you take daily if you don’t mind me asking? Thank you Nick

[Charliexxx]

5 hours ago, Nick Cheruka said:

Hi Charliexxx, I just had recent bloodwork done to try to determine why I’m feeling fatigued half way through the day usually just after lunch for approx. 3hrs this lasts sometimes. I will fall a sleep while trying to eat lunch without even knowing it numerous times even though I would try to stay awake I was out! My bloodwork showed low vitamin B12 so my doctor recommended taking 1000mcg of B12 to add to what little I was getting from a multivitamin which was only 90mcg so for the last month I’ve been taking 1090mcg of B12 and it has helped some but not how I may have hoped! I still have the issue just not as bad but non the less it’s still an issue as far as that goes! I am do for bloodwork to see if the 1000mcg has increased the B12 on the new bloodwork compared to last months and then I’ll know if my body is getting the amount I need! Celiac of 20+yrs never had B12 deficiencies in the past! Are you taking B12 supplements? Hopefully this helps!☘️

Hi Nick, 

I am sorry to read how this impacts your life. The falling asleep is not good. 
I have P.A/B12 deficiency and I have injections. I am U.K. based and on several other websites. I am a qualified health professional but haven’t been able to work for years due to my own health. Anyway, I take a keen interest in this so in 20 minutes BST will be on a course for it. 
There’s absolutely no point checking your levels once supplementation has started. Yes it will tell you what’s in your blood which will  be high but it won’t tell you what’s going on a cell level. It’s a waste of money having that test. 
My family are medical too. We’d say right I’ve got your blood results but they are just figures. Let me have a good look at you under the lights. Do you mind if I have a feel of your hands. Oh they’re a bit cold and pale and your nails are a bit flaky (usually iron deficiency). Most importantly, tell me how you feel and let’s try and work this out together. 😃

[JB23]

2 hours ago, Nick Cheruka said:

Thank you! I’m do for bloodwork to recheck the B12 since adding the other 1000mcg’s to see if that upped my values! How much mcg’s of the sublingual do you take daily if you don’t mind me asking? Thank you Nick

Of course—I started at 1000 mcg per day for a few months and now I take it every other day since my levels have stabilized. I did t begin the sublingual until the injections got me up to a level that was healthy. Hope this is helpful. It was super frustrating until I got to the bottom of it!

[shadycharacter]

9 hours ago, Nick Cheruka said:

Hi Charliexxx, I just had recent bloodwork done to try to determine why I’m feeling fatigued half way through the day usually just after lunch for approx. 3hrs this lasts sometimes. I will fall a sleep while trying to eat lunch without even knowing it numerous times even though I would try to stay awake I was out! My bloodwork showed low vitamin B12 so my doctor recommended taking 1000mcg of B12 to add to what little I was getting from a multivitamin which was only 90mcg so for the last month I’ve been taking 1090mcg of B12 and it has helped some but not how I may have hoped! I still have the issue just not as bad but non the less it’s still an issue as far as that goes! I am do for bloodwork to see if the 1000mcg has increased the B12 on the new bloodwork compared to last months and then I’ll know if my body is getting the amount I need! Celiac of 20+yrs never had B12 deficiencies in the past! Are you taking B12 supplements? Hopefully this helps!☘️

You only absorb around 1 % of strong b12 tablet like 1000 mcg, so one such tablet a day may be to little to raise levels quickly if your levels are low.

The body can store up to around 5 mg (5000 mcg). Adding 10 mcg a day (1 % of 1000 mcg) means it'll take a while to fill up.  I've seen recommendations of 4 tablets a day (2x2) the first month, with 1 tablet a day as maintenance dose after that.

It sounds like a lot with 1000 mcg a day, but you have to consider of uptake, not just intake, ie how much (or rather how little) is actually absorbed from large doses. People who can absorb b12 well absorb around 50 % of smaller amounts found naturally in food, typically a few mcg. But people who can't absorb b12 well need strong tablets or injections.

[knitty kitty]

These might be of interest to you...

Oral vitamin B12 versus intramuscular vitamin B12 for vitamin B12 deficiency

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5112015/

And...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6494183/

[Charliexxx]

2 hours ago, knitty kitty said:

These might be of interest to you...

Oral vitamin B12 versus intramuscular vitamin B12 for vitamin B12 deficiency

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5112015/

And...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6494183/

Thanks knittykitty, 

I hope you are well. I have bookmarked the articles for my dissertation. Hence my reason for asking the question. Information gathering is also part of research too 😉 

[knitty kitty]

Here, @Charliexxx, 

I have some good studies to share with you!  

Thiamine is needed to make and secrete the Intrinsic factor needed for B12 absorption....

Ultrastructure of the rat gastric mucosal parietal cells in thiamine deficiency

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/483730/

And Thiamine is needed here...

Concomitant Vitamin B1 and Vitamin B12 Deficiency Mimicking Thrombotic Thrombocytopenic Purpura

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36726764/

And...

Physiology, Gastric Intrinsic Factor

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK546655/

And...

Mechanisms of action of vitamin B1 (thiamine), B6 (pyridoxine), and B12 (cobalamin) in pain: a narrative review

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35156556/

And...

B Vitamins in the nervous system: Current knowledge of the biochemical modes of action and synergies of thiamine, pyridoxine, and cobalamin

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6930825/

It's better to supplement all the B vitamins if one is deficient in B12.

Keep us posted on your dissertation progress! 

P. S.  There's no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.  

Edited August 24, 2023 by knitty kitty
Added post script

[Charliexxx]

7 minutes ago, knitty kitty said:

Here, @Charliexxx, 

I have some good studies to share with you!  

Thiamine is needed to make and secrete the Intrinsic factor needed for B12 absorption....

Ultrastructure of the rat gastric mucosal parietal cells in thiamine deficiency

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/483730/

And Thiamine is needed here...

Concomitant Vitamin B1 and Vitamin B12 Deficiency Mimicking Thrombotic Thrombocytopenic Purpura

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36726764/

And...

Physiology, Gastric Intrinsic Factor

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK546655/

And...

Mechanisms of action of vitamin B1 (thiamine), B6 (pyridoxine), and B12 (cobalamin) in pain: a narrative review

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35156556/

And...

B Vitamins in the nervous system: Current knowledge of the biochemical modes of action and synergies of thiamine, pyridoxine, and cobalamin

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6930825/

It's better to supplement all the B vitamins if one is deficient in B12.

Keep us posted on your dissertation progress! 

P. S.  There's no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.  

Fab thank you. 
Yes, it’s all there. If a person looks properly at the Kreb’s cycle (Tricyclic Acid cycle), a person can see where the co-factors come in. It’s like a beautiful complex mathematical algorithm or even better an orchestra. Every single instrument knows how loud or soft, how quick or fast, how brief or long they need to play. 

knowledge is power 😉

[knitty kitty]

@Charliexxx,

What a beautiful way to put it! Like an orchestra! 

You go, girl!

[Wheatwacked]

On 8/23/2023 at 9:49 AM, JB23 said:

I take Sublingual B12 (discovers under tongue and also goes directly into bloodstream—avoiding the absorption issue via my GI tract).

If you are not absorbing B12 through your GI tract it is a symptom that something is wrong.  The shots and sublinqual are a good workaround for B12, but what is causing poor absorbtion?  Some meds can do it. Low Thiamine, vitamin D and low stomach acid (PPIs?)

 

[JB23]

42 minutes ago, Wheatwacked said:

If you are not absorbing B12 through your GI tract it is a symptom that something is wrong.  The shots and sublinqual are a good workaround for B12, but what is causing poor absorbtion?  Some meds can do it. Low Thiamine, vitamin D and low stomach acid (PPIs?)

 

Yes, there was an issue and it’s been addressed, but the workaround of the injections and sublingual got me on the road to recovery. 

[Wheatwacked]

Absolutely.

 

[Jane07]

On 8/23/2023 at 3:34 AM, Charliexxx said:

Hi charliexxx

I take b12 vitamin are you low in iron or just b12. 

Dear All, 

Just a quick question. Has anyone had vitamin B12 deficiency as a consequence or Pernicious Anaemia diagnosed (alongside) ? 
Please note, this illness is often poorly recognised, misdiagnosed, mistreated and under treated. 

All the best, 

C x

 

[Nick Cheruka]

On 8/23/2023 at 3:24 PM, shadycharacter said:

You only absorb around 1 % of strong b12 tablet like 1000 mcg, so one such tablet a day may be to little to raise levels quickly if your levels are low.

The body can store up to around 5 mg (5000 mcg). Adding 10 mcg a day (1 % of 1000 mcg) means it'll take a while to fill up.  I've seen recommendations of 4 tablets a day (2x2) the first month, with 1 tablet a day as maintenance dose after that.

It sounds like a lot with 1000 mcg a day, but you have to consider of uptake, not just intake, ie how much (or rather how little) is actually absorbed from large doses. People who can absorb b12 well absorb around 50 % of smaller amounts found naturally in food, typically a few mcg. But people who can't absorb b12 well need strong tablets or injections.

Thank you for the info, I will ask about the injections! I was attributing to getting older with celiacs but when I saw the low B12 It makes sense! 

Just now, Nick Cheruka said:

Thank you for the info, I will ask about the injections! I was attributing to getting older with celiacs but when I saw the low B12 It makes sense! 

53 year old Celiac!😎

[JB23]

👍😊

[Charliexxx]

On 8/27/2023 at 1:18 AM, Jane07 said:

Thanks Jane, 

Oh I was low in everything. Scott Adams has put a wonderful post regarding which micronutrients we many be low in. Worked with a dietician, 3 functional nutritionists, bed bound for 6 months. Then rushed into hospital.
 

I take a specialist interest in vitamin B12. I’m in the U.K. we have 5 organisations that support us. However, the medical professions do not with lots of myths and fallacies. 
😄

 

[Nick Cheruka]

On 8/23/2023 at 5:47 AM, Nick Cheruka said:

Hi Charliexxx, I just had recent bloodwork done to try to determine why I’m feeling fatigued half way through the day usually just after lunch for approx. 3hrs this lasts sometimes. I will fall a sleep while trying to eat lunch without even knowing it numerous times even though I would try to stay awake I was out! My bloodwork showed low vitamin B12 so my doctor recommended taking 1000mcg of B12 to add to what little I was getting from a multivitamin which was only 90mcg so for the last month I’ve been taking 1090mcg of B12 and it has helped some but not how I may have hoped! I still have the issue just not as bad but non the less it’s still an issue as far as that goes! I am do for bloodwork to see if the 1000mcg has increased the B12 on the new bloodwork compared to last months and then I’ll know if my body is getting the amount I need! Celiac of 20+yrs never had B12 deficiencies in the past! Are you taking B12 supplements? Hopefully this helps!☘️

Just got my bloodwork results and I went from about right at about 200 approximately 2mnths ago I had all bloodwork done and everything was good but my B12 like I said was about 200 so I upped my B12 supplement orally from 90mcg’s a day to 1090mcg’s a day and by the 2nd month I’m now up to a 712 so my GI tract is absorbing B12 I was just not getting enough! The normal range from low to high is 200-1100! I am however still feeling fatigued halfway through the day between 12-3pm! I thought it was the low B12 which is reading much higher but the fatigue is still there! I hope this helps someone with low B12 the oral pills worked well for me but I can see on here thats not the case for some! Good Luck☘️

[knitty kitty]

@Nick Cheruka,

Are you taking a B Complex along with your B12?  

There are eight B vitamins.  Just taking B12 can deplete Folate B9.  Thiamine B1 is needed to provide energy.  So B12 and Folate need energy from Thiamine B1 and Niacin B3 and magnesium.  B12 also needs Pyridoxine B6 which in turn needs Riboflavin B2.  

Try taking a B Complex along with your B12 and see if there's a difference.  Thiamine in the form Benfotiamine will help with the fatigue.  

Hope this helps!

[Nick Cheruka]

8 hours ago, knitty kitty said:

@Nick Cheruka,

Are you taking a B Complex along with your B12?  

There are eight B vitamins.  Just taking B12 can deplete Folate B9.  Thiamine B1 is needed to provide energy.  So B12 and Folate need energy from Thiamine B1 and Niacin B3 and magnesium.  B12 also needs Pyridoxine B6 which in turn needs Riboflavin B2.  

Try taking a B Complex along with your B12 and see if there's a difference.  Thiamine in the form Benfotiamine will help with the fatigue.  

Hope this helps!

Hi Knitty Kitty, no I am not taking a B Complex at the moment but I will look into it after reading your message just now! Thank you! I hope this helps with my energy levels half way through the day! I greatly appreciate the information! I hope you have a great weekend!🙂

[Nick Cheruka]

9 hours ago, Nick Cheruka said:

Hi Knitty Kitty, no I am not taking a B Complex at the moment but I will look into it after reading your message just now! Thank you! I hope this helps with my energy levels half way through the day! I greatly appreciate the information! I hope you have a great weekend!🙂

Started the B-Complex today! Hopefully it helps! Thank you for the info Knitty Kitty☘️