Very Low Positive For Enterolab?

[ar8]

I had a fecal antigliadin antibody level of 11, where 10 or up is positive. I know they say that positive is positive, like being pregnant, but...REALLY, is 11 the same as having a score of 45 or 200?

I also had an anticasein score of 9, where (same thing) 10 or up is positive. Does that mean I am probably casein sensitive too, or can I trust their "negative" ? I am asking because of coruse these two sensitivities are related, and having "positive" gluten test...means this casein test level might be deceivingly low?

I didn't get any genetic testing or any other testing done.

has anybody had luck getting them to retest with results like that? They are annoyingly iffy, and for a lifestyle change like this I want something definitive, especially since I paid 20o dollars, too.

I was wondering if anybody on here also had a similar score, and noticed big changes in health after gluten free?

[Nancym]

Why not try the diet yourself and see? I always think that a positive response to a diet should be the ultimate diagnostic tool.

[ar8]

Why not try the diet yourself and see? I always think that a positive response to a diet should be the ultimate diagnostic tool.

I know, I have tried it, though nothing momentous happens soon enough to be able to tell. I would like to know rather than wait it out 6 months. So far it's been 2 and a half weeks and there are minor improvements, by my digestive system is still out of whack

[scotty]

I know, I have tried it, though nothing momentous happens soon enough to be able to tell. I would like to know rather than wait it out 6 months. So far it's been 2 and a half weeks and there are minor improvements, by my digestive system is still out of whack

11 MONTHS HERE....my digestive system is still out of whack. i hate tests. i hate meds of any sort. nothing is working....

Enterolab stool test scores:

gluten----------8

milk------------8

chicken/egg---8

...save for gluten free (well everything free as it is actually), which has opened Pandora's box of other issues for me; which were probably already there; but now i have a cushy job, the ability to talk with employees at the organic store (to get how i want it), and now i can let go of my bowels!!!--instead of fighting them, forcing them to accept that which i have given them.

welcome

[ar8]

Hi scotty-

I am glad you are in a position now to be able to "unravel" your complications. I am beginning to think that everything in this line of thinking can become a pandora's box, especially if one isn't healing well. You start to wonder, What else is wrong with me? Where did it all begin? What is my trigger?

For me, I was hoping going gluten free alone would be it, but I can't say I fully believe that anymore. Especially since my casein was a high negative, and I'm not feeling much better JUST gluten free. I am hoping the casein sensitivity will wither away once my intestines heal from all the gluten? I am talking to the folks at enterolab today and will ask them about all this!

i hope, I hope I hope.

[scotty]

Hi scotty-

I am glad you are in a position now to be able to "unravel" your complications. I am beginning to think that everything in this line of thinking can become a pandora's box, especially if one isn't healing well. You start to wonder, What else is wrong with me? Where did it all begin? What is my trigger?

For me, I was hoping going gluten free alone would be it, but I can't say I fully believe that anymore. Especially since my casein was a high negative, and I'm not feeling much better JUST gluten free. I am hoping the casein sensitivity will wither away once my intestines heal from all the gluten? I am talking to the folks at enterolab today and will ask them about all this!

i hope, I hope I hope.

well you know what they say.....'hope in one hand and.....'

lets just say there is a 'handful' of us that fall into the regular Celiac category....stick with it

[ar8]

I hope beyond hope that gluten free cures me-- I just spoke with a woman from enterolab and she suggested to remove both gluten AND casein as a trial to see if that helps me feel better than just gluten free, but that gluten is definitely not being digested by my body, because my antibodies are elevated, so gluten free is a must for optimal health. I guess I'm going for the soy or rice milk now, and then I will reintroduce milk and dairy possibly at a later date.

[scotty]

I hope beyond hope that gluten free cures me-- I just spoke with a woman from enterolab and she suggested to remove both gluten AND casein as a trial to see if that helps me feel better than just gluten free, but that gluten is definitely not being digested by my body, because my antibodies are elevated, so gluten free is a must for optimal health. I guess I'm going for the soy or rice milk now, and then I will reintroduce milk and dairy possibly at a later date.

watch out for soy and watch out for Rice Dream brand....

[Ursa Major]

You got a good answer from Enterolab. Usually people with damaged villi can't digest dairy, at least for a while. It will be a good idea to eliminate all dairy for a few months, and then reintroduce it to see what happens.

Soy isn't a healthy alternative to dairy, and many of us can't tolerate it, either. Rice or almond milk are better choices. But Scotty is right, Rice Dream contains barley malt, and isn't 100% gluten-free. Some people with celiac disease seem okay with it, and others react. Personally, I don't take the chance, since there are other rice milks out there that don't have barley malt.

I hope you feel better soon.

[ar8]

You got a good answer from Enterolab. Usually people with damaged villi can't digest dairy, at least for a while. It will be a good idea to eliminate all dairy for a few months, and then reintroduce it to see what happens.

Soy isn't a healthy alternative to dairy, and many of us can't tolerate it, either. Rice or almond milk are better choices. But Scotty is right, Rice Dream contains barley malt, and isn't 100% gluten-free. Some people with celiac disease seem okay with it, and others react. Personally, I don't take the chance, since there are other rice milks out there that don't have barley malt.

I hope you feel better soon.

Thanks Ursa Major. I did see that barley was in the rice dream before i almost bought it! (whew)

Unfortunately I did just buy a gallon of soymilk and some soy yogurts (you say this can be hard to digest). Is soy like milk, where it's easier to digest once you heal or what?

When you say that it is hard for people with celiac to digest dairy, do you mean the whole genre of foods, or just things high in lactose or what? Also I am not Celiac, I am gluten sensitive, and didn't have villi damage in a biopsy this past fall. I know that casein is in all dairy, not just milk.

the woman at enterolab seemed to suggest that casein sensitivity was it's own entity, and would NOT go away, though she did say "some practitioners have that theory" (that it goes away later).

[Nancym]

I know, I have tried it, though nothing momentous happens soon enough to be able to tell. I would like to know rather than wait it out 6 months. So far it's been 2 and a half weeks and there are minor improvements, by my digestive system is still out of whack

I have digestive issues too when I eat dairy or gluten. I'm finding the best diet for my gut is one where I eat pretty much nothing but meat and veggies, avoiding all grains. Sometimes I can't handle nuts either, sometimes I can. Fruits are ok too.

[ar8]

I have digestive issues too when I eat dairy or gluten. I'm finding the best diet for my gut is one where I eat pretty much nothing but meat and veggies, avoiding all grains. Sometimes I can't handle nuts either, sometimes I can. Fruits are ok too.

I am scared to death of having to follow a diet such as that-- though it would be clearly very healthy for some, I am active (and want to remain so for the rest of my life) and such a diet doesn't give me nearly enough carbs/energy and is extremely unappetizing to me. yikes. But I am glad you have found what works best for you.

[gfpaperdoll]

I follow pretty much the same diet as NancyM, we all have our little variances...

It is the healthiest way to eat. Have you read "Good calories bad calories"? I have read this book & Nancy recommened it ... & it is awesome & explains what your body does with the food that you eat & how the U.S. governement got into the deep rutted tracks that it is in with the erroneous food recommendations that it is making.

Carbs are not necessary, your body will turn protein & fruit/veggies into any carb that it needs...

very good book, as an athelete you should find out how your body really works, not what the prevailing governmental dogma is, which the medical industry has also adopted as fact...

[mftnchn]

I think one think that many of us have had to learn is patience with this process. A couple of weeks would give you a lot of information about food allergies, when you totally avoid and then challenge them.

However, celiac is very different and is a different type of process in the body all together. Healing of the gut takes an adult 1-2 years. That said, many people do experience immediate improvement. But many of us don't. I got worse rather than better initially.

Soy and casein proteins are structurally rather similar to gluten, as I understand it. Soy has been shown to cause villi flattening as well in some people. So there seems to be a good number of us that don't do well on either.

Many people have lactose issues due to villi damage, and if they wait 6 months or so, can do fine on milk.

My allergist told me about the casein to go 1 month without and then try it. If I have symptoms, go 3 months without and then try it. Eventually, you may be able to tolerate it. At that point you have to figure out how much and how often. I am 11 months gluten-free, and just recently started introducing dairy. I can use butter (very low in casein), and have some milk once every 4 days. I can also use goat milk and cheese. I'm just starting this but seem okay so far.

Soy is still an issue for me so I am not trying to reintroduce it. It is hard to avoid minute amounts of it anyway. I've been corn lite, but need to be more corn free.

With all of this, I still have absorption issues, and am realizing that I just need to stick with the process another year to see if things stabilize.

Once you get a group of recipes that you like and adjust to cooking within those guidelines, you can do it! It does get easier.

[ar8]

I think one think that many of us have had to learn is patience with this process. A couple of weeks would give you a lot of information about food allergies, when you totally avoid and then challenge them.

However, celiac is very different and is a different type of process in the body all together. Healing of the gut takes an adult 1-2 years. That said, many people do experience immediate improvement. But many of us don't. I got worse rather than better initially.

Soy and casein proteins are structurally rather similar to gluten, as I understand it. Soy has been shown to cause villi flattening as well in some people. So there seems to be a good number of us that don't do well on either.

Many people have lactose issues due to villi damage, and if they wait 6 months or so, can do fine on milk.

My allergist told me about the casein to go 1 month without and then try it. If I have symptoms, go 3 months without and then try it. Eventually, you may be able to tolerate it. At that point you have to figure out how much and how often. I am 11 months gluten-free, and just recently started introducing dairy. I can use butter (very low in casein), and have some milk once every 4 days. I can also use goat milk and cheese. I'm just starting this but seem okay so far.

Soy is still an issue for me so I am not trying to reintroduce it. It is hard to avoid minute amounts of it anyway. I've been corn lite, but need to be more corn free.

With all of this, I still have absorption issues, and am realizing that I just need to stick with the process another year to see if things stabilize.

Once you get a group of recipes that you like and adjust to cooking within those guidelines, you can do it! It does get easier.

Thanks for the encouragement!!! Really helps me-- that's a good way to look at it, just find a group of recipes you like and can tolerate, and it gets easier. Sometimes I feel like every day I wake up and wonder what on earth I "can" eat. Almost everything in the fridge "could be bad for me" in some way. I need to simplify. Sometimes you feel like you are swimming in a whirlwind of information of what i CAN'T eat. And going out to eat or to dinner parties just makes you feel deprived. I think I might boycott until I get better.

I am beginning to think that the best diet for me might include rice, sweet potatoes, rice milk, fruits, juices, meat and veggies. corn might be an issue, and the best thing for me to do is just boycott it. I guess I could take multis for calcium and other nutrients I normally get in dairy/cereals.

Unfortunately dairy was a major source of protein for me and something about meat/eggs for breakfast isn't appealing. Maybe I need to revamp my attitude towards it...

Does anybody know of any allergen free protein powders that I could miix into rice milk? (since rice milk has like no protein....) I need plenty of protein, around 70 grams a day since I am a runner, and not getting any at breakfast isn't really an option for me, it's hard to cram in that much protein in lunch/dinner.

in response to gluten-free paperdoll, yes, I have read that book good calories bad calories. I am not an unthinking follower of the american government. Otherwise I wouldn't have looked into enterolab. Otherwise I wouldn't be avoiding gluten, since I am not celiac. I simply don't function well without some starchy carbohydrates, and I need more than what sugar is in fruit. I can't eat enough fruit (unless I really liked bananas and tons of dried fruits, but right now dried fruits mess me up inside) to get the calories i need in the form of carb.

While it is true that your body will convert protein and fat to sugars, the process is more expensive calorically and takes your body much longer. They are nature's backup source, not the preferred source of energy. and if you've ever tried to run a mile on a low carb diet, you would know the difference in how that energy conversion feels- you bonk out really soon. it's great for weight loss! That kind of diet is also fine for somebody without a large demand for carbs (sedentary or light exercisers, which is many americans), or for certain people who don't metabolize sugars well (diabetics, people with blood sugar problems, also many americans! GO US).

Everybody is unique, please don't accuse me of being unthinking without knowing my reasons for thinking that starches DO have a place in a healthy diet for many of us. While eating a banana or a cookie alone on an empty stomach isn't a good idea for ANYBODY'S pancreas, there is nothing wrong with including it as part of your diet.

thanks for the ideas and advice and ever onward.

[Nancym]

I am scared to death of having to follow a diet such as that-- though it would be clearly very healthy for some, I am active (and want to remain so for the rest of my life) and such a diet doesn't give me nearly enough carbs/energy and is extremely unappetizing to me. yikes. But I am glad you have found what works best for you.

Pardon me if I bristle a bit a bit at that comment. I haven't ever had anyone complain my food is unappetizing. I know I often lick my plate when no one is looking, but then again, I'm a pretty good cook. Lamb stew, roasted duck, Pad Thai (made with cauliflower rice), green veggies seasoned with various things and recently I made Goose Confit, which I will be eating today with a wheel of roasted cabbage seasoned with goose fat (flavored with garlic, thyme and marjoram). These are all things I've enjoyed recently. I enjoy my food more now than I ever did when I was eating grains.

As far as carbs are concerned, you can always eat beets, sweet potatoes, bananas, raisins, dates, figs. I avoid those for weight loss reasons but if you're active you'd probably want to include them. I once made a pork roast on a bed root veggies (beets, rutabagas, turnips, yams) and people absolutely raved over it. Then I served a Thai curry with squash and chicken at a party recently and got the rave reviews again. People who had never even had Thai food before loved it.

Anyway, I don't post these things expecting people will adopt it. But I do hope it opens a few eyes into how the human race used to eat before the invention of fast, convenience foods, and all the packaged garbage that passes for food in stores these days.

[gfpaperdoll]

I did not mean to accuse you of anything, just giving some ideas, for you & whoever else reads this thread. I might not be typing at a happy tone because the only reason I am sitting here is that I am so sick with a cold that I cannot do anything else. (between flying with germy people & 5 days with the grandkids I was doomed!)

I used to be a runner & a dancer, precision exhibition clogging team. I was just allergic to beef, dairy, citrus, potatoes, corn, tomatoes, all citrus, peaches, cod fish, mushrooms, green peas, coffee, tea, soda, oats, barley & wheat in those days. So I spent many years not eating the typical carbs. Also, many years carrying my own food. Now that I have been completely gluten-free almost 4 years, I can eat most of the foods that I used to be allergic to - except for the grains & dairy & potatoes.

everyone is different. But for me these days, I do not eat each day until 11:00a.m. that meal always includes protein. Mid afternoon snack with protein & protein for dinner, along with the veggies & fruits & nuts.

anyone that is having a problem with foods, can also put what they eat into a database for the calculation of carbs, proteins, vitamins etc & see how their diet is measuring up.

I am not "celiac" either, I have double DQ1 genes, as does all the sick people in my family. Gluten intolerance is a lot worse than "celiac" because the gluten can attack your brain & all your other organs before it starts in on your gut. & having a double copy of the same gene is worse than having two different ones.

It is good to make a list of all the food that you can eat & post it on the refrig. Whenever I would feel lousy about not being able to eat a burger & fries, I would just remind myself that I could eat Lobster & crab & shrimp - thank goodness I can eat seafood!!!

[ar8]

I did not mean to accuse you of anything, just giving some ideas, for you & whoever else reads this thread. I might not be typing at a happy tone because the only reason I am sitting here is that I am so sick with a cold that I cannot do anything else. (between flying with germy people & 5 days with the grandkids I was doomed!)

I used to be a runner & a dancer, precision exhibition clogging team. I was just allergic to beef, dairy, citrus, potatoes, corn, tomatoes, all citrus, peaches, cod fish, mushrooms, green peas, coffee, tea, soda, oats, barley & wheat in those days. So I spent many years not eating the typical carbs. Also, many years carrying my own food. Now that I have been completely gluten-free almost 4 years, I can eat most of the foods that I used to be allergic to - except for the grains & dairy & potatoes.

everyone is different. But for me these days, I do not eat each day until 11:00a.m. that meal always includes protein. Mid afternoon snack with protein & protein for dinner, along with the veggies & fruits & nuts.

anyone that is having a problem with foods, can also put what they eat into a database for the calculation of carbs, proteins, vitamins etc & see how their diet is measuring up.

I am not "celiac" either, I have double DQ1 genes, as does all the sick people in my family. Gluten intolerance is a lot worse than "celiac" because the gluten can attack your brain & all your other organs before it starts in on your gut. & having a double copy of the same gene is worse than having two different ones.

It is good to make a list of all the food that you can eat & post it on the refrig. Whenever I would feel lousy about not being able to eat a burger & fries, I would just remind myself that I could eat Lobster & crab & shrimp - thank goodness I can eat seafood!!!

Congrats on making it to the other side and being able to eat much more broadly-- good idea about posting things on the fridge. I'm starting to think seriously about not wasting any more time feeling miserable and just to an elimination diet. That way I can figure out what my triggers are and let my gut heal more quickly from gluten. Then maybe i can feel better and eat more broadly sooner rather than later. I can't believe all that stuff you couldn't eat. You have some string willpower!

[gfpaperdoll]

ar8, you will be feeling better soon, I am sure.

& yes, it is really a good idea to write down the things that you can eat. Everyone tends to focus on what they cannot eat & panic. I have been adjusting my diet for so many years that this is really easier for me, plus I just feel so great !! (except when I get a cold)

Also, we "think outside the box" when it comes to food. Some people eat last nights left overs for breakfast or a salad etc. there is a huge database of gluten free recipes now that you can look thru to get ideas of things that you can make.

check out the threads about what to take for lunches & what is for dinner etc.

I was happy to give up the occasional cheat on wheat - thinking it was okay because I was just allergic... & be able to eat tomatoes, corn, & pork (forgot to list that one) - wow, I love bacon!!! & fresh pineapple!!!! & although according to the "eat right for your blood type" book, I am not supposed to eat oranges, I do eat them occasionally - but I do not drink orange juice.

Last year I taught myself to like broccoli. I just kept taking one little taste. then one day I loved it & wanted to eat a whole plateful. Now I try to eat broccoli and kale most every day. There is also jicama. It is really good & healthy for you. I am sure you will also discover new foods and food combinations that you like.

Try an orange & broccoli salad with a olive oil & vinegar & honey dressing & sprinkle on some chopped walnuts...

you might also like the boomi bars - if you google it they have a web site & their bars are very good - they contain organic brown rice & amaranth along with various fruit & nut combinations. I treated myself to one on a recent trip. They contain honey which I like, I did okay with the grains, just wish they had one with no grains. I would not eat a bar with agave syrup in it...

[Nancym]

Why no agave syrup, GFPaperdoll? I know why I don't use it, but curious why you avoid it.

[gfpaperdoll]

Hi Nancy, it makes me nauceous - I tried it only once. My thinking is why use Agave syrup when you can use honey? & the answer to myself is that it is probably cheaper.

I think you already know that I avoid any artificial sugar. Most of which messes with my brain, including mannitol...

I gave up chewing gum many years ago because they started putting artificial sweetner in all chewing gum.

I also avoid all corn syrup sweetners. I stick to two things, regular sugar & honey. & I think sugar is unhealthy, so when I can I use honey.