gfp

I'd recommend reading the whole article though

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Embarassingly stupid post, of no value whatsoever.... So I deleted it... sorry.

Soccer (football for the rest of the world) has grown in popularity over the years in the US. It will never reach American Football ratings or following, but then again, nothing will.

Look you just took one of our English guys... please don't stop... take them all you ar more than welcome...

If by any chance you could get him and his wife to drop British nationality this would also be greatly appreciated.

I find it quite embarrasing that someone with so little education and intellegence can represent Britain in any shape or form and find the association of the Beckhams with my nationality rather embarassing so....

Take our Beckham....

No really take em....

You stole our Henny Youngman now please take our Beckhams....

(I'm also willing to do a bulk purchase deal if you take Princess Ann, the Queen and the young Princes)

Dying here!!

Welcome to town, Steve! It's been kind of quiet here lately--probably because we had no sewer

Now that we can avail ourselves of the facilities again......

Well the first order of business has to be standardising the loo roll.

I just checked out the compost and we have over 40 types... some with flowers and some with perforations and someone who seems to be using greaseproof paper... is someone posting from a school? (least wise that was the type of looroll we got at school)

I just finished sorting it into piles by color (as best as I can guess) and I'm looking into a recycling plan... I just give it a rince and re-roll it right?

The sewer is progressing nicely though... I haven't finished training the team of moles yet... and they keep making tunnels in all directions but I'm printing out some handbooks for them (In large letters obviously)

Once the moles are up to scratch I will be forming them into teams. Issueing hard hats and protective clothing etc. but so far I just found orange jump suits so if you find a mole in an orange jumpsuit coming up through your floor he probably messed up the map and its not an escaped convict... please keep your dogs under control...

I would launch into a long diatribe about the HLA markers being indicators for one subset of symptoms of "gluten poisoning" followed by a lecture on the decline of the "one-gene:one-protein" theory and the complex interactions of differing genotypes and the ability of one polymorphism to "rescue" an animal from the detrimental effects of a different polymorphism.

Just as you were nodding off I'd start pounding my fist on the table saying that to only accept villi damage or DH as indicators of Celiac disease when it's clear that gluten causes measurable damage in multiple other systems is ludicrous and the medical definitions need to be updated so that people can stop undergoing needless medical procedures.

And my take-home message would be: It doesn't matter, it damages your body. Stop eating it.

Well that top part is over my head.... whoooooshhhh

The rest of it .... I have been hammering on about that forever.... (Well quite a while now)...

Combining two of your recent posts....

Getting Dr's to think scientifically and remain practicing MD's is hard enough in itself when we need to take the illness to them to steer their diagnosis... but the whole differentiation on celiac, gluten intolerant, biopsy proven or not is just massively counter productive....

In most cases we are dealing with a person who "wants to fit the person to the disease" ... yet while they make diagnostics based on what they assume is as good a definition as any other getitng them to think scientifically and diagnostically is approaching the impossible...

So much good research is simply disguarded if the subjects were not biopsy controlled.

Regarding genetics and inheretance, of course you find familes have it when you screen the whole family .. not to say genetics doesn't play a role but direct family is massively overplayed because they are comparing that control of x biopsy diagnosed celiacs with a 1:5000 diangosed incidence. Every time they find a cluster its big news... when your control is asumed to be 1:5000 anyone will find a cluster in a caucasian population because the screening incidence is <1:200.... its not hard to test people randomly and get a cluster of >1:5000

and it doesn't stop.... I did a whole thread a while ago on why Italians have such a high rate.... they don't and their is no such thing as a genetic Italian.. if any link it is Scandanavian which is the most direct bloodline between Southern and Northern Italians but heyho... off the doctors go...

Actually, attitude toward drinking including the lower drinking age might be why there aren't as many problems with drinking in Europe. From what I can tell, people LEARN how to drink as they're growing up because wine is often part of a meal.

I have to say I agree although its becoming a bigger problem now in the UK.

In Paris I know lots of barstaff from international bars and they pretty much have the same opinion about French students..

"The joke is basically we had 12 French students in earlier, I couldn't get 12 straws in the same bottle so I had to pour it into a glass"

I won't say you never see anyone drunk... but I can also say 9/10 times they end up not being French... we do have our share of wino's and hobo's like any other major city but most French kids at 18-25 don't really get drunk very often.

French students doing shots is almost unheard of...

Same goes for Italy as well....

I think a large part is as you say that kids learn to drink responsibly from parents...

On the other hand, when I lived in Norway it was completely the opposite... I found it actually disturbing to see 40-something business men puking in the gutter .. I don't mean 1-2 but hundreds on Friday/Sat nights...

Alcohol is strictly controlled, you can only buy wine/liquor in govt run shops... beer at certain times in supermarkets

Which came first, the control or the abuse... its a chicken/egg thing?

Having lived in Norway for 2 yrs I really don't think removing restrictions would help.... I think its too late because they picked up their habits earlier?

The funny thing was, working for a French company in Norway the Norwegians would always confide how the French were alcoholics because they liked a glass of wine everyday... this from someone who would be drunk from Friday night through Sunday night... (but always in work at 07:30) Northern Scotland is quite similar...

The real difference is people who go out for a drink and people who go out to get drunk....

I never have shots, well never is not quite correct ... but very rarely and actually celiac disease is a decent excuse as often as not.

I do remember aged 12 or so sipping a beer shandy (50% lemonade)and my father and a friend discussing all this in front of me...

For all my joking I never was a big one for getting drunk as a skunk... which is not to say there were not more than a few nights as a student I was unable to get wholy inside the house without passing out with key in the lock...

I might share a poem about this...? but its not a very good one as I wrote it while drunk

Eric is my alter-ego,

he gets me home at night.

When I'm to drunk to even stand,he'll stress with all his might....

The importance of getitng home,

and back to my own bed.

Without my schitzophrenic friend

By now I would be dead.

His character takes over,

when Im to drunk to have my own

When Im far to drunk to remember even just how he got me home

But none remembers Eric,

My savior and my guide,

They just see me pissed up* again

Without Eric by my side.

*pissed up = british euphenism for really drunk... sozzled...

"That's how we feel about soccer, LOL. The whole world watches soccer, except for us! "

Not me I detest soccer, when the word cup comes I seal my doors and stay home until its all over...

Really really scares me...

I rarely watch it anymore for just this reason. Plus... there's not a hospital on earth that would let him get away w/ the stuff he does.

I wouldn't be so sure.... I've been to a few countries where I have met practicing MD's that don't believe in viri or bacteria...

but on the counterside there are plenty of hospitals it seems where tellig the patient they are suffering from hypochonria and they are making up the whole thing is the norm if you have celiac disease and I would guess any number of similar "unpopular diseases" like Lymes...

I'm not sure which is worse, the fantasy of House or the reality?

WITNESS!!!!!...Grain alcohol in a trash cans in Red Square. How I survived?

LOL

Anyway, the whole frat thing is prety incomprehensible to us Europeans?

I won't pretend we don't have a few drinks at Uni or even on occaision more than a few... but I could never understand the reason frat's were allowed to even exist? Try looking at it from outside, its really quite a weird concept ... vis-a-vis lovegrov's explanation??

So instead of this British Universities have a rugby club .... something I found almost as weird... I got dragged in cos I'm actually quite good as a fly-half (the person who gets crushed usually) ... but the sticking potatos in weird places and drinking games were not really for me... I took drinking far too seriously to consider it a game but of course the big difference is that drinking is completely legal at 18... another weird thing we Europeans have problems understanding about the US?

That, combined with stubborness!! (meant in good-hearted fun! )

I refuse to acknowledge my stubborness!

Other than the article you posted I would defer all expertise on genetics to Jegstar

LOL...

Yeah...I think maybe he needs to "de-stress" a little??

Whomever they are they are trying

Laughter is good medicine...I hope it will help.

Although after reading some posts on a more recent thread....I'm thinking he might need another dose of the funny pages.

Erm, OK I followed your advice last time...

I dunno....this is the second time I've been attacked by the same poster in a weeks time.

I think maybe it all stems from the fact that I have an offensive science-hating thread which pollutes the board with its unsubstantiated fantasies and beliefs???

Erm, the post didn't say that.. though it was a bit rambling and long ...and you might take that impression ... but as per my impresion of your thread its not the intended impression... and I didn't say it polluted the board... I said if it was what I mistakenly assumed it was then it stopped silly unscientific stuff polluting the rest of the board ... which might be poor choice of language but what I meant is for instance on the occaisions we have had MD's on the board they have been somewhat frightended off by a few posters who decide to use thier thread for having a general go at the medical profession... At the same time many of us here geninely have grievances against the medical profession and its probably a good thing to let them out... just not on the serious thread where a MD is giving a qualified opinion....

I think this could be the reason behind the attacks.....

(see....I'm going into detective mode again )

ROFLMAO

"Rachelville....a place to express disdain for fact and truth". The anti-science thread.

All I was saying is that would be the impression the thread title gives me?

Yeah....maybe I've had too much ice-cream today but I'm still finding this hilarious.

Oh...I went back on ice cream.

Mainly due to the fact that I was experiencing excrutiating head pain from all the "healthy" foods.

Oh go on, give me another chance and reread the thread without extrutiating pain in your head ....

I might not have said it the "best way", heck I rarely do... I'd have thought you would have worked that out by now but I didn't mean to give a fence... or offence.

I actually found another person who seems to go through the same issues with the produce dept. feeling somewhat like a minefield. The culprit is FUNGUS.

I did post some stuff on fungus in fruit though... which might hopefully help you out... I probably didn't say that all that well either but .... that's what happens when you spend most of your life writing scientific reports and papers... (really)... and have a somewhat overdeveloped regard for fact ...

Yeah, but it's always HIM. How about some brilliance out of some other people once in a while?

Ah, see what you mean... but I don't actually like HIM.... I just think the show is funny

and educational.... I'm not paranoid but I think I better get checked for Africa Sleeping sickness its a hypochondiacs dream

Private Clubs, yes. I used to drink wine with my parents at the country club. Again, that was Ohio and I could drink with my parents in private places, just not public. I could not, however, order alcohol there without my parents being present.

As far as fraternities and sororities legally serving alcohol, I just don't think that's true. I certainly have never heard of one doing it legally ... even the previous example you gave does not allow it. MOST of the members of a fraternity/sorority will not be over the age of 21 since it's undergraduates who belong to the chapters.

Carla, look back at my first post when I said the university assumed the role of a legal guardian.

I know a know a lot of weird stuff but the reason I wrote this and knew where to look is because it was explained to me by an American Law student. I wasn't just stabbing in the dark... I pretty much knew what to google... and the law student (who was here last year doing his Masters) explained this to me when I asked specifically about how frat houses get away with it and if its just a TV thing.

I could not, however, order alcohol there without my parents being present.

Is I think the key here ... read the whole link ... the federal prohibition only covers SELLING alcohol... and not every state even signed up for it, some took a hit instead on Federal funding for highways and others made specific exclusions..

The one I believe used by frat's is the private property ... and no members of the public present... only members (fraternity brothers) of the fraternity are present and they cannot be charged directly for drinks or serve themselves.

In the same way, drugs are illegal, especially in prisons... but it would be niaeve to think they do not exist!

Perhaps we can wait for anyone currently in a frat or sorority to comment on the original question as to if alchopops are popular?

(regardless of legality or not)

However many of the state exceptions are actually over "beer" and "liquor" so Lovegroves tax reason also applies if an exception applies for "beer" since as larry mac initially pointed out it is essentailly a "beer"

dlp252, he took 4 pcs. of tissues from my duodenum and 4 pcs. from the antrum.

shannon, i insisted on the biopsy because i have no signifant improvement in the gluten free and dairy free diet. my symptoms of bloating, belching, flatulence and borborygmi are still present.

No evidence of celiac disease means very little more than a blindfolded person not hitting a bullseye on a dartboard with 4 shots.

Unless your atrophy is big enough to be seen by the naked eye then the samples are just taken anywhere that looks inflammed or different. Given you are +ve for h. pylori it would be hardly surprising if there was not the primary sites that stuck out ofter 1 1/2months gluten-free to the naked eye.

In summary its proably a good thing you had the biopsy and found h. pylori which is easily treatable.. but your initial diagnosis is also still valid and further the presence of h. pylori explains why... " i have no signifant improvement in the gluten free and dairy free diet. my symptoms of bloating, belching, flatulence and borborygmi are still present."

This was also there ...

Yes but that is specifically bypassed....

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The National Minimum Drinking Age Act of 1984 required all states to raise their minimum purchase and public possession of alcohol age to 21. States that did not comply faced a reduction in highway funds under the Federal Highway Aid Act.... It does not prohibit persons under 21 (also called youth or minors) from drinking. The term "public possession" is strictly defined and does not apply to possession for the following:

* An established religious purpose, when accompanied by a parent, spouse or legal guardian age 21 or older

* Medical purposes when prescribed or administered by a licensed physician, pharmacist, dentist, nurse, hospital or medical institution

* In private clubs or establishments

* In the course of lawful employment by a duly licensed manufacturer, wholesaler or retailer.

I watch it sometimes. I think it's so far from reality that I sometimes find it annoying (the whole only one brilliant person in the whole hospital can figure out what's wrong with these people thing), but it's kind of fun to see the medical situations.

Ah but take a step back

Many of us have been through scores of consultants, GI specialists and such where a single not even exceptional intern who knew about celiac disease because his cousin had it might be the only person in the hospital to make the correct diagnosis

How far fetched is that ?

Carla

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PHI MU ALPHA SINFONIA FRATERNITY POLICY ON CHAPTER HOUSES

.............

Unless the general public is invited to a chapter party, the house or the facility in which the party is

held would probably not be considered a public place. For that reason serving liquor at such a function would

not be considered doing so at a public place and in violation of the law. To be safe, it should be made clear

that members of the general public are not invited to chapter functions. Some safeguards should also be

taken to insure that persons other than chapter members and their guests are barred from events where

alcoholic beverages will be served.

The greatest potential liability occurs when one negligently or otherwise serves liquor to a person

already intoxicated and that intoxicated person then injures himself or a third party. If a reasonable person

would not have served liquor to that individual considering his age, maturity and apparent sobriety, liability

attaches to the server for any damage that an individual might do. That liability may attach not only to the

server but also to the chapter and its members as well.

Anyone else watching House?

I keep waiting for an episode with some celiac disease related disease.... then he prescribes cigarettes to the guy with IBS..?

Are you sure you aren't just asking for this position because you're already used to wading through s**t?

The sinner heard and feign'd not, but towards me

His mind directing and his face, wherein

Was dismal shame depictur'd, thus he spake:

"It grieves me more to have been caught by thee

In this sad plight, which thou beholdest, than

When I was taken from the other life.

I have no power permitted to deny

What thou inquirest." I am doom'd thus low

To dwell, for that the sacristy by me

Was rifled of its goodly ornaments,

And with the guilt another falsely charged.

But that thou mayst not joy to see me thus,

So as thou e'er shalt 'scape this darksome realm

Open thine ears and hear what I forebode.

Reft of the Neri first Pistoia pines,

Not the portion of celiacs that have C rather than D. We go to the bathroom LESS often than everyone!

Not really an issue when they can order you to take any drug they say anyway.... there are far more potent drugs than immodium and since your purpose in the field is kill and be killed when told to do so hardly an issue.

As someone posted pages ago, the military isn't a civilian job... you sign they own.

The key thing is that the military has a purpose and it isn't to give everyone who wants in a job.

Much as quite a few people might disagree (those from places where the military is really the only way out) so long as you have bodies available that don't need special needs why should tax payers pay for those special needs?

If it ever gets to a point (and I can't see how this might happen) that you actually need to start taking people with special needs then you have already lost well over 25% of your population, something that hasn't hapened since the civil war...

By this point getting gluten-free rations isn't really an issue since your job is to go out and take a bullet anyway.

If you don't like it don't sign.... (with apologies to anyone who through circumstance signed up for an education or the chance to get out of a dead end town)

Hello

Just popping my head in to say Rachel was correct and I should spend more time on silly threads, even if the title offends me it doesn't mean its not just a silly joke.

In order to try and make pennance and prove to the unbleliving I can be humble and silly I respectfully ask to be put in charge of the sewage plant... somewhere my scientific background and serious nature can be exploited to the full.

I swear to take the best care of everyones poop and to make some great manure once I figure out a way of seperating out the glutened stuff that might drift down to me from time to time.

On the otherhand I can see why some of you might be suspicious of having a scientist in your midst and I would be quite willing to work my way up to head-sewer master from any position that doesn't come past my neck....

pg,

I am under the impression that this is not vodka but beer, malt liquor, same thing. Basically, these various liquor company products that come in 4packs and are in bottles like beer usually are beer. Otherwise they wouldn't be able to sell them in beer & wine stores (that can't sell spirits) here in Texas. These stores can't sell anything with a higher alcohol content than wine or beer.

I personally never liked the flavored malt drinks, but some do, mostly women and young people. It's just beer in disguise. Not only that, it's a fraud, 'cause many people simply don't know any better and think they're buying something they're not. It's misleading at best and dishonest marketing at worst.

If you look closely it should say "flavored malt beverage" right on the label. In any case we can't drink beer so it's a moot point for us.

best regards, lm

LOL ... so true....

However ... I wouldn't be so ready to trust the differences in Canadian vs American ....

It's just beer in disguise. Not only that, it's a fraud, 'cause many people simply don't know any better and think they're buying something they're not. It's misleading at best and dishonest marketing at worst.

I tend to agree, its certainly not a transparently honest marketing plan, indeed it is widely believed in Europe (where you can variously buy "beer" and "spirits" at different ages (You can order beer in a bar at 16 in France in the presence of a responsible adult ... who can be anyone not affiliated with the bar over 18) ...

... that "alchopops" are simply a way to get the younger generation in order to groom them to drink the hard stuff the minute they can buy it!

When I say widely beleived several countires passed legislation against marketing "alchopops" directly at teenagers which was the primary focus of their marketing.

One only has to look at what these companies offer at "promotion nights" where they sponser bars to give it away for free with gifts...

Jameson's Whisky did one and gave away green wollen scarves and umbrellas ... not your typical teen-wear ... for instance (I happen to have both freebies even though I didn't imbibe)

Glenmorangie gave away golf tees and a nice little holder....

Smirnoff give away T shirts wallpaers and ring tones for cell phones....? I wonder what market segment that hits? Oh and a free chance to enter a raffle for a years subscription ot a teen music mag?

So my perception is they are trying to circumvent laws to protect minors ... I agree the advertising is at best misleading... WHY on earth would I trust this company?

All Smirnoff liqours are gluten-free. Even if you don't believe that distilling makes liqours OK, Smirnoff is corn based. The comment about not guaranteeing the flavors is the sound of yet another company going to a CYA statement.

lovegrov.... I just want to acknowledge your compromise on this... and say I respect it. I'm now going to quote you and partially disagree but in complete respect and acknowledging you made a compromise....

As already posted, Smirnoff Ice is gluten-free in Canada but not in the U.S. It's my understanding that Smirnoff Ice in the U.S. does not contain liquor because of 1) the various state liquor laws, and 2) the federal liquor tax would make them too expensive. I can think of one product where I live that does use liquor (Kahlua mixes) and they cost more than $5 for four small bottles.

This makes complete sense ... It's honestly the only sense for a company like Smirnoff and that's financial sense...

Other than this I just don't trust the company.... based on how much it costs them if they get proven wrong?

I think the gluten issue is largely financial, not just for Smirnoff but for any company selling liquor...

Anyway, its largely beleived that 21 is the legal drinking age i the US but this is not entirely true....

Fraternities and sororities operate outside of this as a simple example.

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In response to the developing stereotype of excessive alcohol use in fraternity life, some fraternities today are alcohol-free.

Which taken at face value indicates many of them are not alcohol free and by definition serving alcohol to under 21's...

My understanding is that the Univerity itself acts as a "responsible adult" ... anyway... Never having been in one I can only guess but anyone want to guess how popular alchopops are in frat houses? Any brothers or sisters care to comment?

i drink plenty of different white wines with no problems. from nicer wines on down to cheap. but i also love bacardi "o" which is their orange flavored rum mixed with sprite or 7-up. delicious! just be careful if the bar uses one shot glass to measure out the liquor for all drinks. it is usually not washed between drinks. just ask him to not use it, or use a clean one. i have never had a bartender give me a problem with that request. depending on the type of bar, they may have disposable/plastic shot cups anyway.

Wow that's a good point, its actually a legal requirement here in France for all glasses and they are meant to do it in front of you... so you can definately insist...

From the fact that I don't think even whisky's and grain liquor have "much gluten" even on a bad batch washing a glass for a measure already makes this (if it was ever there) super dilute.... I know from my own experience I can get away with a single shot of top shelf triple distilled stuff once in a while.... but if I drink it all night (I don't mean blathering drunk) then I usually do react... leastwide it seems that way to me....

celiac disease is all about balancing risks, its unfortunate but that's true... we live in a world of potential CC and hidden gluten so all we can do is make our own luck and get on with life.

I personally chose not to extend that risk to grain alcohol because though i used to love s single malt I am happy enough with Rums and Tequila... and its easy to set a rule when your dealing with alcohol because your judgement on what to risk and what isn't tends to decrease as the night wears on... thus I find it easier to set a rule for me.

Some people might not need this but I do or I'd lose my remaining sanity.

I just did some fuzzy math (math is NOT my strong suit, so feel free to double check my numbers). But in the US, we consume an average of 775 grams of food per day per person.

So 20ppm x 775g/1000=15.5mg/day.

Studies show that we should consume less than 50mg of gluten/day. Though one person in the study did get sick off a regular dosing of 10mg/day. So you could say that for most of us, we could double the amount of gluten allowed and still be safe, even if everything we ate maxed out at the 20ppm. I prefer to be more conservative and look at it as "if one person had a clinical relapse at 10mg a day, shouldn't THAT be the threshold??"

In reality I don't eat nearly that much in a day. And most of what I eat is naturally gluten-free (eggs, meat, veggies...). Many days only the spices or sauces come into question of whether or not they have ANY gluten at all. But to be generous, let's say I eat 600g of food/day and 50% of what I eat (gluten-free bread, pasta, crackers, sauces, snacks, etc) would fall into these labeling guidelines and that all of these products max out at 20ppm.

So 20ppm x 600g/1000 x 50% = 6mg/day.

That would put me below the 10mg/day, and I'm comfortable with that. But more importantly, by knowing the threshold, we can take more control of our diets and manage how much "gluten-free" stuff we consume based on the level that makes us feel safe. As it is, we have no idea how much gluten we are getting out of these "gluten-free" products. Yet we don't want to make the guidelines so strict that nothing will qualify as gluten-free and we will be back to eating either 100% naturally gluten-free items or guessing how much we are consuming in a day.

See

https://www.celiac.com/st_prod.html?p_prodid=1411

The math looks OK for me but it still boils down to how much is too much?

Its a toughy ....

My problem is the studies almost always depend on villous damage... not serology as to defining "damage" ...

One thing I know from personal experience is my GI reaction occurs at higher levels than my neurological one.

Secondly villi repair just like aeoli in the lungs do from tar damage but it is the forced cell division at rates they are not meant to divide at that causes increased cancer risk... (in any individual)

It seems to me that even if the villi can keep up and not be destroyed faster than they can be repaired this isn't good.

You can add lots of secondary conditions to the list, adrenal failure etc. happen because of a long drawn out wearing down of the glands, hypothyroid and hashimotos the same not to mention peripheral neuropathy etc.

This makes me believe that long term health in celiacs is not simply related to destroying villi.

Anyway, besides any of this, if it makes 1 celiac in 5000 sick isn't that one to many?

I chose those numbers specifically because those are the old numbers for celaic diagnosis in the US.... at a time when many of those 1:5000 were fighting for recognition.... but the general populace were liable to say "but its only 1 person in 5000 why make special labels"

Its easy to look back now with screening figures of 1:100 and say it was the correct thing to do.

One constant I have learned working in science all my life is a "safe dose"almost always gets adjusted down.

New complications arise and unforseen side effects get confirmed.

Not long ago it was 200ppm ... now its 20, what will it be tomorrow?

Yet we don't want to make the guidelines so strict that nothing will qualify as gluten-free and we will be back to eating either 100% naturally gluten-free items or guessing how much we are consuming in a day.

Yes and I completely see the point ... which is why I say the best thing is the manufactuerers have to test and label...

If they claim 20ppm then they get hit by huge fines if it exceeds a 20% tolerance, noone is forcing them to make any claim ... they could say 200ppm and let the consumer decide...

But what is certain is that their needs to be a mechanism to really hurt the companies that disregard this or make false claims...

One continually amusing post on here is "Kraft are nice and won't willingly hide Gluten" ...

This is almost laughable....

Open Original Shared Link

Even after the spin-off Kraft will be run by the same people and have the same shareholders as its parent group...

It seems to be a little like putting the wolf to guard the sheep to think that Phillip Morris Tobacco has never made false statements about the effect of tobacco or hidden research... indeed its a matter of court record.

What you got to ask is what happens if they do willingly hide gluten because you can be absolutely certain that they have a team of lawyers and accountants weighing up the risks?

There is only one way to prevent them making false claims or deliberatly mis-informing themselves so that it wasn't "deliberate they just didn't ask" ... and that is through fines.

As of last year their revenue was declared at 97.854 billion USD ... so put your numbers to work.

If they can save 1% by deliberatly not asking a supplier if their product contained gluten then how much is that? How much could an individual hope to gain by sueing them?

I'll leave the numbers up to you... I loose track after a billion $....

I don't think Kraft are specifically bad... I think they are just another company maximising profit. they are just an easy example because they are owned by the same people as Phillip Morris ...

Do I trust them? Fraid not....

Their aquisition of Nabisco didn't suddenly put Nabisco into the hands of the big bad big tobacco....

It was previously woned by "RJR Macdonald, Canada

I'm not sure he even took the gluten issue into the equation when writing the RX. However, now that I know that the brand we have IS gluten free, I'm left wondering why in the world she's so sick today. All I can think is... it's GOT to be CC from Wendy's.

I do sincerely appreciate ALL the responses, and the next time we need an rx for anything... I will absolutely make sure that the doctor notate the kids' gluten free status on the actual RX.

If I have to literally drive around, from pharmacy to pharmacy, in order to find a gluten free version of whatever it is we need, I absolutely will do it. I hope that will never be a necessity, however. =)

Its really down to your GP....

When I had a kidney infection mine phoned round the labs to find me one that could give me the results same day.... she's not obligated to but she's a wonderful person and that's why I keep her as my GP.

I am certain if I was really ill and needed gluten-free medication she would phone the pharmacies and ask and tell thrm to put some aside.

Again she doesn't have to.....

OK not everyone can be totally happy with their GP but a reasonable GP should do this or at least have the receptionist help you out when its something as critical as a sick child.