Ankle And Hip Pop Out Of Joint

[YoloGx]

I am wondering if other people here have had ankle and hip joint problems recur after they thought they had healed from an accident years previous?

I thought I had healed from the effects on my ankle and hip from a car accident years ago. The car accident was at the end of 2000. In it I sprained my right ankle and my hip went out of joint. It seemed like it healed up fairly fast, unlike my neck and elbows which only recently really healed after I finally began to go off all trace glutens last November.

However I now live in the hills, much of them steep. I love to go walking. The thing is is that my old ankle and hip injury has sprung back to life.

Since I moved here two and a half years ago my right ankle became swollen even though it didn't hurt. I thought maybe it was just old scar tissue and didn't pay too much attention, though I showed it to my chiropractor. Last summer it did hurt after running up and down some steep uneven stairs at the front of the house. I laid off my ankle for a while and it seemed to heal up though the swelling around the ankle remained.

Fairly recently my chiropractor found a way to adjust the foot so the swelling would disappear. She basically popped the ankle back in place. Ditto with my hip. However it keeps going out of joint. She suggested alphabet exercises, however they are obviously not adequate. I do yoga regularly and frequently rotate my ankles, and even stand on one foot or on my toes with no pain at all.

Just last week I got mens boots that go over my ankles to give me more support and started wearing a pair of women's lace up ankle boots when I go out. My chiropractor thought that I could walk on the flat but not in the hills. She also thought I could go dancing. Which latter I did, though I did not stomp around, just moved my hips and mostly slid. After that however I discovered just walking on flat ground messed me up. I am thus going to have to see her again. No doubt I need to start doing a whole physical therapy exercise program to strengthen the ankle and hip joints.

Like many with celiac, I have long had difficulty absorbing minerals. I used to be able to peel my fingernails and my hair always stuck to my comb and hairbrush. I used to think this was normal since I was diagnosed as having celiac when I was a very young infant, and then was put back onto gluten at age four. Unfortuantley I was not told about this until recently at age 58 and 3/4. My teeth did not harden until after I had gone off all gluten (not realizing I also had to go off trace glutens) 13 years ago or so. Taking E-zorb calcium helps as does magnesium, zinc and liquid sea minerals however this feels like more of the same old problems...

As said, my neck and elbows have healed amazingly well. But this ankle and hip problem has reasserted itself. It is puzzling. I wonder if anyone else has had recurrences of old injuries like this or not and what they have done to improve their situation.

As for now, I plan to swim and use the weight machines at the Y, while avoiding stressing my ankles. I also found a bunch of ankle exercises on the web. I plan to find some for my hip as well. Plus of course see my chiropractor and ask for her advice. But additional advice and resources from you guys would be of great help. It seems to have become some kind of insidious chronic condition... And of course I don't have health insurance anymore given all the health problems I have had over the years it kind of canned my ability to make lots of money...I get by as many of us do and recently have benefited from my own ability to figure out and research what all has gone on plus this site has been a godsend.

[ravenwoodglass]

I am so sorry you are going through this. I unfortunately have been there myself ankle wise until recently. I do agree with you that a visit to a physical therapist might be in order. You have had the injury and when it flares you change the way you walk which can stress other parts and throw them out of alignment. I didn't realize that after I injured my ankle a couple years ago I stopped bending it normally. I compensated by never straightening my knees when I walked and going down stairs slowly and sideways just became the way I did it. The PT was able to figure it out and pinpoint the areas that needed stretching and strengthening. I haven't had hip issues in a long time, thank goodness. That could be related to the posture your using to compense for the ankle problems.

You can get supports, I get mine in the athletic supply store, that can be very helpful in supporting the joints when you go for walks. They usually have everything from elastic stocking things to ones that have straps to support around the arch as well as the sides of the ankle. Make sure you check with a PT or your chiro before you use one very often though. In some instances they might not be the right thing to do.

Something the PT clued me in on the last time I was there was Merrell shoes. I love them. They have a special support system in the foodbed that really does help me be more stable. I got a pair of sandals first and was really surprised at the difference they made. I use a glider and with my regular sneaks I would still need some support or have to stop because of discomfort in the tendons and ligaments in my knee. When I stepped on the thing for the first time with those shoes on I was amazed. No discomfort and I was able to go farther faster. I also find that I can 'feel' the ground under my feet better and it makes it easier to keep my balance in the yard or walking in the grass with my little dog. You might want to check them out. I got a couple pairs at a store near me but after I was sure of my size I ordered over the internet. I found that for me they do run true to size. They have turned in to a bit of an addiction for me though, I have gotten 5 pairs in last 2 months.

I hope this improves and you are able to jog up those hills soon.

[babysteps]

not exactly the same, but perhaps related in a broad celiac way...

As a kid I could, at will, make either my right or left leg thigh bone pop out of joint with my hip. Then a doctor responded in horror to this (when I was 18 or so?) and I stopped doing it on purpose. But I can still get out of alignment easily if I walk too long on hard pavement, or walk too long in high heels. Not out of joint like my old parlor trick, but definitely pain and not-quite-fitting. I can hike all day and be fine if it's on earth in flat shoes.

So...it could be that your ankles and hips are already prone to stress or simply weaker than typical due to celiac. Which makes recovery tougher and relapses easier. The good news: at least now that we're both gluten-free we shouldn't be doing much more damage to our joints! But some of our history may make it easier for re-injury and/or may slow down healing from accidents.

Don't know if that helps too much, but you (and your hips) are not alone!

[YoloGx]

Thank you guys for your info and commiseration. It does really suck to have this going on after everything I have already gone through. I thought I was doing right but apparently not. So still one more area to patiently work through. Arrgh! No doubt of course there will be others... so I need to look at this philosophically. I just got to thinking now I am free of all that...ho ho ho! goes the old celiac etc.

Well I must say I do have a history of sprung out joints; its true my left hip was one inch out of joint after a bad accident I had at age 6. It stayed that way until I was 36 and reinjured my low back carrying too much clay. How I dealt with it back then was to be mostly out of my body during the day; I only returned when I went to bed, and then had to hypnotize myself to sleep due to my legs and feet aching so bad. Part of this was also due to being low on B-1 as it turns out as well as minerals. But the popped out joints did take their toll. It took 3 years after I re-injured myself at age 36 before it was discovered that the prongs of my L-5 vertebrae were completely knocked off in the back. It wasn't obvious since I don't have scoliosis; I was always into balancing after my sister taught me to walk with a book on my head. Unconsciously I was always lifting my left heel and balancing on my right foot when I would just stand.

After many years of chiro treatments, massage and yoga (and even a bout of rolfing) and then finally going off all trace glutens last November plus taking nattokinase and bromelain/papain regularly on an empty stomach to get rid of excess scar tissue these last two years, my left ankle stopped being crunchy (I used to crunch my ankle like some crunch their knuckles -- but no longer) and my left hip mostly stopped going out of joint.

Now this right ankle and right hip thing has flared up from the accident in late 2000. Go figure. The weird thing is that it took so long to actually hurt. And when it does hurt it doesn't hurt in the ankle, it hurts in the far top right of the foot. Plus it will give my neck a little twark but not awful like in the past with the other ankle/hip problem. And of course when the right is out it does stress my left hip too.

I am just realizing I have to take this much more seriously. I just thought oh, its part of celiac to have inflammation on one's ankles, even if its just one ankle...since my sister the nurse has this problem too and I have read its not that uncommon. Of course with my sister she just takes pain medication and/or gets some kind of shot that fills the joint with some kind of fluid...and avoids dealing with the whole celiac thing entirely. I don't want to do that. I believe somehow now I can beat this but it does appear walking on these very steep hills for now is very much out.

I don't know about braces, I used them last summer and they seem to make it much more painful. I will talk with my chiropractor about it and look into getting a physical therapist. If I don't walk a lot it doesn't seem to bother me, but by not walking much it makes my muscles weaker which makes the whole thing worse. So therefore I want to uses the Y etc. The heavy duty shoes do help.

I definitely will look into these Merrell shoes you mentioned. They sound wonderful. Where do you get them?

Further note--as far as popping out of joint thing--I used to copy my brother with Down's who was/is double jointed and thus did the splits as a kid and would lift my one leg way up high when I was standing. I stopped being able to do it however after the wall fell on me at age 6. I also do have an actual double jointed thumb that has been bothering me. I am wondering what is going on with that too so will also mention it to the chiro. I keep thinking this also has to be some kind of mineral thing...

Bea

[Nancym]

I think a friend of mine is going through this with her SI joint and she has been in terrible pain from it. For some reason those ligaments are too loose. Anyway, her options are:

Wear a special belt to keep everything in place.

Xray guided cortisone shots

Metal plates and screws to hold things in place until the ligaments tighten

And if none of those work...

Fusing the joint entirely.

She's just happy to have a diagnosis and have had a few moments of relief (when they pop her joint back into place).

Oh, regular doctors didn't help her at all. She had to see an osteopath and a very good PT to get a real diagnosis.

[Fiddle-Faddle]

Celiacs tend to have a higher-than-usual incidence of loose joints. Physical therapy would be a must for you, I think--strengthen the surrounding muscles to keep the joint in place, without straining tendons (popping out of joint also puts a severe strain on tendons and ligaments).

The comment on shoes is important, too. Don't wear high heels, obviously, and stay away from anything without firm support and really good padding. Merrills are great, as are running shoes.

[ravenwoodglass]

I definitely will look into these Merrell shoes you mentioned. They sound wonderful. Where do you get them?

Bea

I got my first pairs at the outlet center near Waterloo NY at the Hush Puppies store. If you don't live here in Upstate NY you might want to google them. I would post a link but I am not sure that is allowed. I will find the link and PM it to you.

[babysteps]

Bea-

okay, this is getting spooky. I too have double jointed thumbs (I can make them look like 'panda thumbs'). Maybe I should stop doing that, too?

You may also want to consider massage in conjunction with chiro and/or physical therapy - ask around, some massage therapists are great at helping to realign hips. Others look at me like I am speaking gibberish when I ask about it. Keeping my hip flexor muscles (or whatever you call the vertical ones on the outside of your legs over the hips) strong seems to help me.

I have a pair of terra plana "vivo" 'barefoot' shoes that feel great and some claim help regain natural alignment (by the time I bought them I was more or less aligned, so can't testify personally). I think the Merrells could be better for hiking though, as they have more support (although the barefoot advocates might have the view that 'support' is just getting in the way of alignment...)

Good luck on your path to joint happiness!

[YoloGx]

Thanks so much you guys! I will follow most of your suggestions. They all seem good so far.

Wow, another extra thumb joint person. I haven't run in to anyone else with that. For me its just the left one. Yes I suggest you don't stress them even if it is entertaining. My left thumb joint only hurts occasionally now that I am taking extra minerals...

I will look into the various shoes suggested. My chiro says that if I were barefoot all the time I might not have this problem. I have a high arch and very high instep with double A heels and B width in the main part of the foot. Thus now lace up shoes with ankle support seems to be de rigeur plus inserts. They used to make combination lasts but alas no longer; though maybe I could order them?

According to my chiro it seems the immediate culprit is that the bone that goes to the little toe keeps going out of joint of late. Thus I need shoes or shoe supports that support that bone and make my foot roll out a little rather than in. I also have some plantar warts on the bottom next to that small toe. All of this seems to be cascading to bring out the old injury from the car accident in 2000. Am thinking I will need to see a foot doctor.

I also do plan on seeing a physical therapist. I downloaded some exercises from the Internet but it would be helpful to see if I am doing them correctly. Apart from the general pain and discomfort, its been getting in the way of my sleeping again which I am sure hasn't helped anything -- so I want to do whatever I can to overcome this.

My eldest sister has almost identical feet plus celiac and had all kinds of foot and knee problems until she started using clod hopper shoes with special supports. My family laughs at her but now I see why she has done what she has done. I hope I can get the support without so much of the clod-like shoes though for work and tromping around I don't mind.

I used to pride myself on strong feet and ankles --now I realize it was more than likely because I went barefoot until the second half of the 6th grade except for school and church. Maybe I should have kept it up like my youngest brother has. My chiro says the more barefoot I am the better since then the foot is able to use its natural support system rather than rely on shoes not quite constructed right for me given my feet being outside the norm. They are aesthetic but difficult apparently. It amazes me how something so small can have such huge consequences.

Am thinking when I dance I should kick off my shoes!!

Meanwhile I have started taking MSM again to see if that helps as well as a bit extra of the E-zorb calcium and other minerals. I wonder if L-glutamine would be wise or not too since in the past when I took it I noticed it seemed to make me feel more energetic and a little younger. I read its supposed to help re-energize the more youthful hormones. I stopped taking it however this winter/spring when my kidneys etc. got inflamed so I am not yet decided on that course. I think all this bone problem is in part happening now since I am past menopause -- as well as a lifetime of celiac which I dealt without knowing the whole stack of cards (i.e., as an "allergy") for most of my adult life until November of last year.

I think more people who have celiac should be alerted to these kinds of possible problems before they happen so they can circumscribe avoidable grief like this.

Again thanks to you all for all your good suggestions and emotional support!

Bea