Jump to content

  • Welcome to Celiac.com!

    You have found your celiac tribe! Join us and ask questions in our forum, share your story, and connect with others.



  • Celiac.com Sponsor (A1):

    Celiac.com Sponsor (A1-M):

  • Get Celiac.com Updates:
    Support Our Content
    eNewsletter
    Donate

Need Help

Hungrylady

By Hungrylady
in Coping with Celiac Disease

Recommended Posts

Hungrylady Rookie
Hungrylady
Posted

Hello everyone,

I have contacted many people concerning this issue. First a rabbit expert to find out if hay is really needed, yes it is. Then I was told Meadow hay would be ok by the rabbit expert. Before buying I asked the meadow hay people about any wheat contamination. Now I completely understand about the law aspect of them needing to cover themselves so no one can really give me a proper answer. This is a copy of them email I got in response to that (see below).

We have not gotten the bunny yet. He will be able to leave his mom by this monday. I must figure this out soon because I probably need to order any special hay over the net and have it in time.

I love animals and have chickens which I found out I need to mix their own feed so I don't have wheat in it. I really want this bunny but I really don't want to be glutened. The rabbit will be out of his cage most of the time, but his cage will be in my room.

Anyone know about what hay I can give this bunny and be ok with?

Email from company below:

Thank you for your e-mail. Honestly I have never been asked this question or know much about gluten in hay.

I did some quick research though by calling some hay people and using the internet.

I somewhat cautiously say that there is no gluten in Timothy hay or Alfalfa hay, but I don't think I or anyone else could 100% guarantee that there could be trace amounts of another type of grass in a timothy or alfalfa hay field. So for this reason I would say you might still want to be careful, maybe by wearing a dust mask while around the hay? At least until you hear a more definite answer from an expert.

The Meadow hay also probably does not have gluten but since it is made up of mostly wild grasses, it is more likely than Timothy or alfalfa to have gluten.

I hope that helps and I am sorry I do not have a definite answer.

and the one before this one (from bunny expert):

You can use other hays such as Orchard hay. You would have to buy it online.

www.bunnybytes.com

www.sweetmeadowhay.com

Hay is the most important part of a rabbit's diet.

Are allergic to just touching the hay? You can where gloves and wear a mask when giving it out or cleaning it. I am allergic to timothy hay, but not mixed grass hay in bales sold locally. I wear gloves and a mask if I have to touch timothy hay.

==<>==<>=

Jan Rebmann

co-Chapter Manager

HRS Chicago

just did a google search and hay is not made from wheat. Rye may be in the baled local hay, but Timothy, Orchard and meadow hay are not wheat.

So the stuff you buy in bags at the pet supply store (timothy) does not contain wheat or rye. It's a mountainous grass.

Open Original Shared Link

Celiac.com Sponsor (A8):
Celiac.com Sponsor (A8):

Celiac.com Sponsor (A8-M):


Takala Enthusiast
Takala
Posted

Good grief, you are making this more complicated than it needs to be - just where are you located ?

Google "feed store name of your town" or "farm and feed supplies name of your town" or "hay and feed name of your town" or "pet food dealers name of your town." or "horse feed name of your town." "goat feed name of your town." Find a store.

A farm feed supply store will have hay. You can buy an entire year's worth of hay by purchasing two or three full size bales, for what you would pay for mail ordering those tiny ones over and over again. Keep the hay DRY, covered, and up on a pallet or plywood set up on some scrap wood 2x4 in a building or shed, and it keeps for a year or two.

Second, if you don't have hay, the thing CAN eat grass as long as it is not sprayed with chemicals. Either hand pick or hand cut fresh daily, or put the cage outside on the lawn, in the shade with some water, so it can eat it.

Third, hay DOES come in pellets! Pelletized hay can be purchased at feed stores in big bags. There is alfalfa pellets, cubes, and sometimes grass hay pellets or cubes. Store in a metal trash can in a DRY place and it will not get vermin in it. Some feed stores here will sell this in bulk bins.

Breakdown on hays:

Alfalfa is a leafy high protein legume perennial so it is not a gluten product, it's frequently interseeded with other non gluten hays. This is good for rabbit, but not as its entire forage diet.

"Meadow grass" is an anonymous term for "whatever mixture" and typically can be anything, but out here in CA I've seen it be anything from fine bladed lawn type grasses to fescue or fescue mixes. This is fine for your rabbit. Fescue is okay as long as it's not for a pregnant cow or horse in the last part of pregnancy, because it can have an endophyte fungus which causes birthing problems and photosensitivity from affecting the liver for some cows/horses during the summer. This is not your rabbit situation as your rabbit is not a cow, a horse, nor pregnant.

Timothy. very high quality hay.

Orchardgrass. very high quality hay, may not be as palatable as others.

Hay baling equipment typically not run over wheat fields, which are combined.

______________

Hays that may have gluten:

Bermuda grass family - this is in the rye grass family. Surprise ! I sure was.

Rye grass- yes, this is in the same family as "wheat rye barley."

"Oat hay or oat straw" - from cross contamination from being rotated with other wheat/barley/ rye crops.

Hungrylady Rookie
Hungrylady
Posted
  • Author

wow, I don't think that was necessary! If you didn't want to respond you could have just not responded. Not everyone "knows" that hay comes in pellet form. I don't think being cautious is going overboard.

celiac-mommy Collaborator
celiac-mommy
Posted

wow, I don't think that was necessary! If you didn't want to respond you could have just not responded. Not everyone "knows" that hay comes in pellet form. I don't think being cautious is going overboard.

I agree with you....

Anyway, we have a bunny. He's house trained and all. We feed him Timothy hay from the pet store and a mixture of oats (gluten-free) and pellets. We have an amazing breeder who has walked me thru everything. The problem is--and this is VERY important!!! When you get the bunny, you CANNOT start feeding him something completely different!!! You MUST wean him off his current food with a mixture of the gluten-free stuff until he's acclimated enough. If you change the diet drastically, you can acutally kill the bunny. Verrrry sensitive digestive tracts! For the first week or so, until ours was weaned, I handled the food and the hutch cleaning. We didn't start the pottly training until he was completely on gluten-free food and I had sanitized the hutch thoroughly. There is 1 brand of gluten-free pellets that I've found and I will try to find the name of it for you (I'm at work today and don't have the bag in front of me ;) )

celiac-mommy Collaborator
celiac-mommy
Posted

I found it!

Open Original Shared Link

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing

  • Get Celiac.com Updates:
    Support Celiac.com:
    Join eNewsletter
    Donate
  • Celiac.com Sponsor (A17):
    Celiac.com Sponsor (A17):



    Celiac.com Sponsors (A17-M):



  • Recent Activity

    1. Scott Adams
      0

      New Research Reveals Why the Gut May Stay Sensitive Even After a Gluten-Free Diet

    2. cristiana
      - cristiana replied to Scatterbrain's topic in Sports and Fitness
      5

      Feel like I’m starting over

      Hi @Scatterbrain Thank you for your reply. Some of these things could be weaknesses, also triggered by stress, which perhaps have come about as the result of long-term deficiencies which can take a long time to correct. Some could be completely unrelated. If it is of help, I'll tell you some of the things that started in the first year or two...
    3. knitty kitty
      - knitty kitty replied to Jmartes71's topic in Related Issues & Disorders
      8

      My only proof

      @NanceK, I do have Hypersensitivity Type Four reaction to Sulfa drugs, a sulfa allergy. Benfotiamine and other forms of Thiamine do not bother me at all. There's sulfur in all kinds of Thiamine, yet our bodies must have it as an essential nutrient to make life sustaining enzymes. The sulfur in thiamine is in a ring which does not trigger sulfa allergy...
    4. Wheatwacked
      - Wheatwacked replied to Jmartes71's topic in Coping with Celiac Disease
      8

      Related issues

      Your goal is not to be a good puppet, there is no gain in that. You might want to restart the ones that helped. It sounds more like you are suffering from malnutrition. Gluten free foods are not fortified with things like Thiamine (B1), vitamin D, Iodine, B1,2,3,5,6 and 12 as non-gluten free products are required to be. There is a Catch-22 here. Malnutrition...
    5. NanceK
      - NanceK replied to Jmartes71's topic in Related Issues & Disorders
      8

      My only proof

      Hi…Just a note that if you have an allergy to sulfa it’s best not to take Benfotiamine. I bought a bottle and tried one without looking into it first and didn’t feel well. I checked with my pharmacist and he said not to take it with a known sulfa allergy. I was really bummed because I thought it would help my energy level, but I was thankful I was given...
  • Celiac.com Sponsor (A19):


  • Member Statistics

    • Total Members
      132,298
    • Most Online (within 30 mins)
      7,748
    drewbee2294
    Newest Member
    drewbee2294
    Joined
  • Celiac.com Sponsor (A20):

  • Forum Statistics

    • Total Topics
      121.5k
    • Total Posts
      1m
  • Celiac.com Sponsor (A22):



  • Celiac.com Sponsor (A21):


  • Upcoming Events

  • Posts

    • cristiana
      Feel like I’m starting over

      By cristiana · Posted

      Hi @Scatterbrain Thank you for your reply.   Some of these things could be weaknesses, also triggered by stress, which perhaps have come about as the result of long-term deficiencies which can take a long time to correct.   Some could be completely unrelated. If it is of help, I'll tell you some of the things that started in the first year or two, following my diagnosis - I pinned everything on coeliac disease, but it turns out I wasn't always right!  Dizziness, lightheaded - I was eventually diagnosed with cervical dizziness (worth googling, could be your issue too, also if you have neck pain?)  A few months after diagnosis I put my neck out slightly carrying my seven-year-old above my head, and never assigned any relevance to it as the pain at the time was severe but so short-lived that I'd forgotten the connection. Jaw pain - stress. Tinnitus - I think stress, but perhaps exacerbated by iron/vitamin deficiencies. Painful ribs and sacroiliac joints - no idea, bloating made the pain worse. It got really bad but then got better. Irregular heart rate - could be a coincidence but my sister (not a coeliac) and I both developed this temporarily after our second Astra Zeneca covid jabs.   Subsequent Pfizer jabs didn't affect us. Brain fog - a big thing for people with certain autoimmune issues but in my case I think possibly worse when my iron or B12 are low, but I have no proof of this. Insomnia - stress, menopause. So basically, it isn't always gluten.  It might be worth having your vitamins and mineral levels checked, and if you have deficiencies speak to your Dr about how better to address them?    
    • knitty kitty
      My only proof

      By knitty kitty · Posted

      @NanceK, I do have Hypersensitivity Type Four reaction to Sulfa drugs, a sulfa allergy.  Benfotiamine and other forms of Thiamine do not bother me at all.  There's sulfur in all kinds of Thiamine, yet our bodies must have it as an essential nutrient to make life sustaining enzymes.  The sulfur in thiamine is in a ring which does not trigger sulfa allergy like sulfites in a chain found in pharmaceuticals.  Doctors are not given sufficient education in nutrition (nor chemistry in this case).  I studied Nutrition before earning a degree in Microbiology.  I wanted to know what vitamins were doing inside the body.   Thiamine is safe and nontoxic even in high doses.   Not feeling well after starting Benfotiamine is normal.  It's called the "thiamine paradox" and is equivalent to an engine backfiring if it's not been cranked up for a while.  Mine went away in about three days.  I took a B Complex, magnesium and added molybdenum for a few weeks. It's important to add a B Complex with all eight essential B vitamins. Supplementing just one B vitamin can cause lows in some of the others and result in feeling worse, too.  Celiac Disease causes malabsorption of all the B vitamins, not just thiamine.  You need all eight.  Thiamine forms including Benfotiamine interact with each of the other B vitamins in some way.  It's important to add a magnesium glycinate or chelate supplement as well.  Forms of Thiamine including Benfotiamine need magnesium to make those life sustaining enzymes.  (Don't use magnesium oxide.  It's not absorbed well.  It pulls water into the intestines and is used to relieve constipation.)   Molybdenum is a trace mineral that helps the body utilize forms of Thiamine.   Molybdenum supplements are available over the counter.  It's not unusual to be low in molybdenum if low in thiamine.   I do hope you will add the necessary supplements and try Benfotiamine again. Science-y Explanation of Thiamine Paradox: https://hormonesmatter.com/paradoxical-reactions-with-ttfd-the-glutathione-connection/#google_vignette
    • Wheatwacked
      Related issues

      By Wheatwacked · Posted

      Your goal is not to be a good puppet, there is no gain in that. You might want to restart the ones that helped.  It sounds more like you are suffering from malnutrition.  Gluten free foods are not fortified with things like Thiamine (B1), vitamin D, Iodine, B1,2,3,5,6 and 12 as non-gluten free products are required to be. There is a Catch-22 here.  Malnutrition can cause SIBO, and SIBO can worsen malnutrition. Another possibility is side effects from any medication that are taking.  I was on Metformin 3 months before it turned me into a zombi.  I had crippling side effects from most of the BP meds tried on me, and Losartan has many of the side effects on me from my pre gluten free days. Because you have been gluten free, you can test and talk until you are blue in the face but all of your tests will be negative.  Without gluten, you will not create the antigen against gluten, no antigens to gluten, so no small intestine damage from the antigens.  You will need to do a gluten challange to test positive if you need an official diagnosis, and even then, no guaranty: 10 g of gluten per day for 6 weeks! Then a full panel of Celiac tests and biopsy. At a minimum consider vitamin D, Liquid Iodine (unless you have dermatitis herpetiformis and iodine exasperates the rash), and Liquid Geritol. Push for vitamin D testing and a consult with a nutritionist experienced with Celiack Disease.  Most blood tests don't indicate nutritional deficiencies.  Your thyroid tests can be perfect, yet not indicate iodine deficiency for example.  Thiamine   test fine, but not pick up on beriberi.  Vegans are often B12 deficient because meat, fish, poultry, eggs, and dairy are the primary souces of B12. Here is what I take daily.  10,000 IU vitamin D3 750 mg g a b a [   ] 200 mg CoQ10 [   ] 100 mg DHEA [   ] 250 mg thiamine B1 [   ] 100 mg of B2 [   ] 500 mg B5 pantothenic acid [   ] 100 mg B6 [   ] 1000 micrograms B12 n [   ] 500 mg vitamin c [   ] 500 mg taurine [   ] 200 mg selenium   
    • NanceK
      My only proof

      By NanceK · Posted

      Hi…Just a note that if you have an allergy to sulfa it’s best not to take Benfotiamine. I bought a bottle and tried one without looking into it first and didn’t feel well.  I checked with my pharmacist and he said not to take it with a known sulfa allergy. I was really bummed because I thought it would help my energy level, but I was thankful I was given this info before taking more of it. 
    • Wheatwacked
      Feel like I’m starting over

      By Wheatwacked · Posted

      Hello @Scatterbrain, Are you getting enough vitamins and minerals.  Gluten free food is not fortified so you may be starting to run low on B vitamins and vitamin D.   By the way you should get your mom checked for celiac disease.  You got it from your mom or dad.  Some studies show that following a gluten-free diet can stabilize or improve symptoms of dementia.  I know that for the 63 years I was eating gluten I got dumber and dumber until I started GFD and vitamin replenishment and it began to reverse.  Thiamine can get used up in a week or two.  Symptoms can come and go with daily diet.  Symptoms of beriberi due to Thiamine deficiency.   Difficulty walking. Loss of feeling (sensation) in hands and feet. Loss of muscle function or paralysis of the lower legs. Mental confusion. Pain. Speech difficulties. Strange eye movements (nystagmus) Tingling. Any change in medications? Last March I had corotid artery surgery (90 % blockage), and I started taking Losartan for blood pressure, added to the Clonidine I was taking already.  I was not recovering well and many of my pre gluten free symptoms were back  I was getting worse.  At first I thought it was caused a reaction to the anesthesia from the surgery, but that should have improved after two weeks.  Doctor thought I was just being a wimp. After three months I talked to my doctor about a break from the Losartan to see if it was causing it. It had not made any difference in my bp.  Except for clonindine, all of the previous bp meds tried had not worked to lower bp and had crippling side effects. One, I could not stand up straight; one wobbly knees, another spayed feet.  Inguinal hernia from the Lisinopril cough.  Had I contiued on those, I was destined for a wheelchair or walker. She said the symptoms were not from Losartan so I continued taking it.  Two weeks later I did not have the strength in hips and thighs to get up from sitting on the floor (Help, I can't get up😨).  I stopped AMA (not recommended).  Without the Losartan, a) bp did not change, after the 72 hour withdrawal from Losartanon, on clonidine only and b) symptoms started going away.  Improvement started in 72 hours.  After six weeks they were gone and I am getting better.  
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

NOTICE: This site places This site places cookies on your device (Cookie settings). on your device. Continued use is acceptance of our Terms of Use, and Privacy Policy.