Specific Carbohydrate Diet (SCD)

[AliB]

Whatever takes my fancy. Some say not to mix fruit and veg but I do and seem to be ok with it.

I tend to favour a banana, couple apples - cored, but only peeled if they are not organic or the peel is a bit tough, 2 carrots peeled, a good handful of grapes, a good chunk of cucumber, a good handful of washed salad leaves and I top up the blender jug with enough water to come about 3/4 the way up the fruit and veg. Then I give it a good whizz and drink.

Sometimes, if it is a bit too 'bitty' I sieve it and if I just want juice I pour it into a nylon bag laid over a sieve for support and give it a good old squeeze. I have a juicer but it is such a pain to clear up I find the blender/nylon bag thing a lot easier. Wish I hadn't bothered to buy the juicer now. Waste of money.

I prefer it as a smoothie though as the fiber not only slows down the sugar absorption but it also makes me feel fuller. I usually share the smoothie between breakfast and lunch, then have a meal in the evening.

Sometimes I add celery or beetroot. 'Crapple' is nice (Jason Vale's name for it, not mine!) - Carrot and apple - you can add celery to that. Sometimes combinations haven't exactly turned out too well so it is definitely trial and error.

Avocado makes a good thickener if you don't want to use banana. All veg can be a bit yukky so the addition of a couple apples can make all the difference. You can add yogurt too if you want a probio smoothie. It needs to be drunk within a couple hours or it will start to lose enzymes and some nutrients although refrigerating it can preserve it a bit longer.

If you Google smoothies I am sure you will be rewarded with hundreds of ideas! If you want a laugh, put 'green smoothie Rio' into Youtube and watch the baby! (there's loads of different kinds of green smoothie demos on there too).

[julirama723]

Ali--I've made avocado smoothies before, and they're delicious! I'm also a fan of all-fruit smoothies, but I've not had a fruit/veggie smoothie. I can't stomach the thought of doing an all-veggie smoothie, so I guess I'll have to hold off on smoothies for a few months until this fructose thing settles down a bit. I loved strawberry smoothies, those were the best!

I used to add cream (before I realized I had problems with dairy) and tofu (before I realized I had problems with soy) and most recently, coconut milk. I think the coconut milk was by far the tastiest!

[Ms Jan]

Hi there

- sorry if I have overlooked something already said - I haven't read up on the entire string, so I don't know if you can have grape fruits, but if you can, they're delicious in a smoothie. Also lime or lemon can be used. These days I blend a cup of water with a peeled cucumber and one peeled grapefruit as my base, then add one or two things of whatever I feel like/have at home, such as spinach, cellery (I can't do carrots due to the sugar or something), green peppers and kale. For more taste, I use fresh parsley, ginger or mint. I had to get used to the lack of sugar in the beginning, but now I can't wait to drink it ... habit speaks for so much. What for me works best taste wise is just to stick to a limited number of ingredients - too many things make it yukki somehow.

Wanted to ask something else:

--- I've never had problems of D, but for years of throwing up coupled with headaches, whenever I was glutened (which I didn't know at the time was the reason). Strangely my actual intestinal digestion worked perfectly, whenever I could keep the food down. Since I went on the SCD, like 3 weeks ago, I'm much better, but the last few days I've suddenly got D. Have a feeling it's linked to my beginning a supplement of liquid magnesium. Does anyone know of such a reaction ?

Or is it simply a reaction to the diet?

And is there anyone on this string, who have also had mainly poisoning symptomes with vomiting/head aches/bodyaches, and have any experiences from an SCD healing process ?

--- The only Dr. I ever had who diagnosed something useful, ie candida/leaky gut 3 years ago, adviced me to always begin all meals with eating raw or steamed unseasoned greens for 10 minutes. I did it for long period of times, and it really did help my ability to digest foods I otherwise couldn't keep down. Unfortunately, he missed the gluten connection, so never getting totally well, I left the '10 minutes of greens' at some point. Apparently, it's something about which enzymes that get activated in the first ten minutes of the meal being the important ones. But does anyone here know of this process ? It's tedious, but I remember it as worth doing, so perhaps I shall pick it up again ...

Just curious if anyone here had tried it ...?

I used to consider myself so terribly sick, and felt so alone in my struggling over the years with all these undiagnosable symptoms. And being like debilitated half the time for the last five years I also in between felt rather sorry for myself. But reading this forum, I see how many similar stories there are - and compared to what some of you have gone/ are going through I've even realized that I belong among the 'light weight' cases here. Thanks a lot for sharing all your stories, it sure does give a lot of hope and encouragement Hope I can be of some use to some of you as well ...

Jan

[rinne]

Hi Jan.

I am always glad for more company on this journey.

[DMarie]

Does anyone here have any personal experience with homeopathy? Or do you know someone who has been successful using homeopathic remedies?

I am just exploring this topic. Still having trouble with excessive mucus (throat clearing), so trying to figure out what else I might need to be looking at, since obviously diet isn't going to resolve the issue.

[Ms Jan]

Hi DMarie,

I tried homeopathy years ago for my joint pains. No effect at all. However, my ex boyfriend took it extensively for liver problems and swore to the positive effects. Also, I have a close friend who says it helped her a lot with candida.

As to the mucus, have you tried echinacea or oil of oregano? Must be extracted without alcohol, and make sure the oregano is wild (expensive but the only thing that works, and it can last a long time. I presently use one from the Vitamin Shoppe, but I'm sure there are others too). Also I have good experiences with raw garlic for a variety of ills: chop a few cloves morning and evening and swallow them with water without chewing. It strangely clears my head.

If the mucuos is a continuous problem, have you thought about candida?

Good luck.

Jan

[AliB]

--- I've never had problems of D, but for years of throwing up coupled with headaches, whenever I was glutened (which I didn't know at the time was the reason). Strangely my actual intestinal digestion worked perfectly, whenever I could keep the food down. Since I went on the SCD, like 3 weeks ago, I'm much better, but the last few days I've suddenly got D. Have a feeling it's linked to my beginning a supplement of liquid magnesium. Does anyone know of such a reaction ?

Or is it simply a reaction to the diet?

And is there anyone on this string, who have also had mainly poisoning symptoms with vomiting/head aches/bodyaches, and have any experiences from an SCD healing process ?

Jan

Magnesium definitely can give you diarrhea - I have a friend who takes it for the C problem and I would suspect that liquid magnesium may well be more concentrated or easily assimilated and so be more likely to cause the problem. Can you cut down the amount?

Usually vitamin C will cause the same thing to happen - that is one way of telling what your optimum need is - take enough just to start to cause the D then cut back slightly and apparently that will tell you how much your body needs at the time.

I find I always need more vit C when I am ill. A maintenance dose of half a gram (500mg) is usually ok and any more than that will give me D, but when I am ill I can take 3 grams or more and still have no D. Interesting.

There is a possibility that the diet could be responsible as your digestion will be going through a state of flux until it eventually settles down, but the magnesium link is too much of a coincidence.

Why are you taking the magnesium?

Most of us go through some kind of reaction after starting the diet during the first 2 - 4 weeks. It will be different for everyone as we all react differently to the changes. Some suggest it is a kind of 'Herxheimer' reaction as Candida and/or other pathogens start to die back and release toxins. It could also be organs or other parts of the body releasing toxins that they were unable to get rid of before.

I had a headache for a few days which was pretty unusual for me as that is one thing I don't get much of. I also had my liver release a load of crud about 10 days after going gluten-free/Diary free. Some mention feeling as though they have had the 'flu, very achey and horrible. Headaches are very common. I have not vomited but if that is an issue with you anyway then that is certainly likely. The vomiting may well be your body's reaction and an opportunity to expel a load of toxins.

The fact that you have vomited for years suggests that your body was trying to tell you it didn't want that food - whatever it was. It may have been different things at different times depending on what your body was going through at the time. So many food products, particularly, gluten and dairy, soy and corn-based are very detrimental to the body it is no wonder that people get reactions of one kind or another when they eat them. The damage they cause can then also create problems with other, quite innocuous natural foods.

If we have spent years putting the wrong type of fuel in our car and that has damaged it, putting the right fuel in isn't going to put it right - the car would need a major overhaul first, then the right fuel would support the engine properly. We all know (generally) that to get the best out of a piece of equipment we need to use the right attachments or tools, yet we throw any old rubbish at our bodies and then can't figure out why they aren't working properly.............

[AliB]

Marie, I wonder if you might have a microbe or something in your mouth/throat/gullet/esophagus or trachea/lungs that is causing an inflammation. Mucous is usually the body's way of trying to protect itself.

It has always been a problem for me although it does seem a little better since starting the SCD. Although some things have vastly improved or even gone, that is not one of them. I also suffer with continuous 'dog breath' and 'morning sewage pit' mouth and I am sure it is down to some little beggars living in there. Candida possibly, maybe something else. I have yet to figure out what it is or how to deal with it.

I have started brushing my teeth and having a good swill round for 5 minutes or so with Sodium Bicarb to see if that will help in the long term. If the bugs are growing in my mouth then they are going to be travelling down my digestive tract every time I swallow.

[Ms Jan]

Hi Ali,

Thanks.

I started taking magnesium for anxiety and attention deficit, and it actually seems to have helped calm me and keep me concentrated. Only I think you're right that the dose was too much. So now I've cut down, and it's already helping. What immediate reactions the body has ... quite a marvel actually !

The vomiting was before I started the SCD, and surely it was the body rejecting foods that it couldn't deal with. since I began the diet I have been much better. only one poisoning day, last sunday after we'd had a dinner sat night at home, cooking everything very carefully and SCD/glutenfree, yet I think I simply got too much food all at once. so sunday was out ... but otherwise, I'm so much better day by day ... what I was wondering was how long it might take to heal for someone with my kind of symptoms before beginning the diet ? (went gluten free dec 2008; SCD/candida/no dairy-sugar since three weeks). but I guess it's just wishful thinking to imagine that anyone can tell, since we're all different ...

For bacteria in the mouth, have you tried raw garlic ? keep a chopped clove in the mouth for a little while, maybe even chew a bit if you can manage, then swallow with water- morning and evening or as many times a day you might need to. I do it for a couple of days, whenever I get into a mouth-bacteria situation. to me it seems like I can immediately feel the buggers die ... and for the garlic breath - well, I'm luckily working at home and my man doesn't mind, but fresh parsley should help.

Jan

[DMarie]

Hi Jan and Ali,

The mucus has been a continuous thing for the past 1 to 1-1/2 years. I am currently rotating anti-fungals. I took oil of oregano last month - but don't think it was wild oil of oregano. I am currently taking caprylic acid.

I have no idea if it is candida or not. I have wondered if there was some kind of yeast or fungus causing the problem but have no idea. I just know that many days I want to shoot myself because I am so tired of feeling like I have to constantly clear my throat. On SCD, I would say it has improved a little bit. I do have small periods of time where I am somewhat comfortable (might be a 2 to 3 hour stretch) - and then I have periods of time where it is there - but not as severe as it could be - and then I still have bad times. So yes - some improvement with the diet. But I don't know that diet alone is going to ultimately get rid of it.

So - just trying to plot what my next step should be, aside from rotating anti-fungals.

[DMarie]

Okay, so since going on SCD, I have been able to reduce my Nexium from 2 capsules a day to 1 capsule a day. I thought I would try, once again, to eliminate that last capsule. No go. Burning by the end of the day. My stomach also hurts, reminds me of when I tried the HCL. That would seem to indicate there is an over production of acid. Very confusing. I defintely had low stomach acid about 6 years ago (stomach function test) - but that was 6 years ago. Also, I think the hydrocortisone I am on might be having an effect. Seems I have read that this medication lowers stomach acid and I have read that it increases stomach acid. Have no idea which statement is true (or if both are false).

I am working slowly to reduce the hydrocortisone (taking it for adrenal fatigue). It has been a life saver, things were getting so bad before I started taking this. It will take awhile to wean off though.

Things were such a mess with my body though. It was like my body just quit making stuff - it was burned out. Hypothyroidism, low cortisol, low iron, low vasopressin (have diabetes insipidus), low DHEA, low vitamin D.

Oh well - I will try again with the nexium later. After I get the hydrocortisone down a bit more.

[GermanMia]

--- I've never had problems of D, but for years of throwing up coupled with headaches, whenever I was glutened (which I didn't know at the time was the reason). Strangely my actual intestinal digestion worked perfectly, whenever I could keep the food down. Since I went on the SCD, like 3 weeks ago, I'm much better, but the last few days I've suddenly got D. Have a feeling it's linked to my beginning a supplement of liquid magnesium. Does anyone know of such a reaction ?

Or is it simply a reaction to the diet?

And is there anyone on this string, who have also had mainly poisoning symptomes with vomiting/head aches/bodyaches, and have any experiences from an SCD healing process ?

--- The only Dr. I ever had who diagnosed something useful, ie candida/leaky gut 3 years ago, adviced me to always begin all meals with eating raw or steamed unseasoned greens for 10 minutes. I did it for long period of times, and it really did help my ability to digest foods I otherwise couldn't keep down. Unfortunately, he missed the gluten connection, so never getting totally well, I left the '10 minutes of greens' at some point. Apparently, it's something about which enzymes that get activated in the first ten minutes of the meal being the important ones. But does anyone here know of this process ? It's tedious, but I remember it as worth doing, so perhaps I shall pick it up again ...

Just curious if anyone here had tried it ...?

I used to consider myself so terribly sick, and felt so alone in my struggling over the years with all these undiagnosable symptoms. And being like debilitated half the time for the last five years I also in between felt rather sorry for myself. But reading this forum, I see how many similar stories there are - and compared to what some of you have gone/ are going through I've even realized that I belong among the 'light weight' cases here. Thanks a lot for sharing all your stories, it sure does give a lot of hope and encouragement Hope I can be of some use to some of you as well ...

Jan

Hi Jan,

like you, I never had C or D problems caused by gluten (maybe that's the reason why no doc ever thought of it). I had nausea after everything I eat except raw fruit and veggies for 30 years, and I also found it helpful to have something raw as a starter to every meal. You're right, it's to do with the enzymes of raw fruit and veggies. They get the production of digestive enzymes started which in consequence makes the stomach starting the production of pepsin so you're able to digest what you eat after the raw things. Well, this is the simple short version of the explanation, but I think I don't start explaining the whole biochemistry...

Anyway, my nausea completely stopped when I stopped eating gluten. Unluckily the long years of poisoning myself with gluten seem to have damaged a lot of other processes, so I'm still struggeling with other problems. But the good thing is that after only two months on SCD the inflammation of the intestine was reduced to nearly invisible via coloscopy, and as long as I stick to what I know for sure I can eat I have no more intestinal problems. No gas, no nausea, neither D nor C.

D can be a reaction to the SCD, it could be a die off of bacteria, but I also think it could be caused by the magnesium. Maybe you try and find another kind of magnesium, e. g. magnesium orotate, which is a form of magnesium the body can work with.

The funny thing is that after four weeks of SCD I had a fit of the worst D I ever had in my life, and I thought it was kind of die off, but then it turned out to be a reaction of all the carrots I had - I have a fructose malabsorption, too, so carrots are a very bad idea... after eliminating the fructose from my diet, too, and now avoiding everything which contains or provokes histamine, too, I have a *very* restricted diet but no intestinal problems at all. And I know for sure that as soon as I have found and "repaired" the underlying problems (which seem to be of endocrine nature) I will be able to return to mostly normal gluten-free and low carb diet.

And so will most others, I suppose - it's just a question of time and patience and research... And for this I love this forum (or this thread) because you learn such a lot by sharing your stories

[rinne]

.......

As to the mucus, have you tried echinacea or oil of oregano? Must be extracted without alcohol, and make sure the oregano is wild (expensive but the only thing that works, and it can last a long time. I presently use one from the Vitamin Shoppe, but I'm sure there are others too). ....

Hi.

I was just talking with someone today about wild oregano and he emphasized the importance of taking probiotics if you are taking the oregano, the oregano will kill good and bad bacteria and the probiotics are needed to repopulate the good bacteria. He recommended a book by Jeanie Patel called "Listen to Your Gut". Apparently it is very important to use them at separate times, makes sense, basically take the oregano on an empty stomach and two hours later take the probiotics.

[DMarie]

Hi Rinne,

Thanks for the book reference.

I am actually taking a probiotic - and I make sure to take it well away from the anti-fungals I am taking. I didn't think about the anti-fungals killing the good as well in the body - but I did worry about taking the probiotic with the anti-fungal and the anti-fungal killing the probiotic!

Right now this is feeling like such a tangled mess with no answer. A little bit better - but still problems.

[rinne]

I am actually taking a probiotic - and I make sure to take it well away from the anti-fungals I am taking. I didn't think about the anti-fungals killing the good as well in the body - but I did worry about taking the probiotic with the anti-fungal and the anti-fungal killing the probiotic!

Smart.

I'm sorry there are still problems.

I am seeing improvements, not as fast as I would like, but the fact that there are improvements gives me hope.

Check out CROHNSBOY.com for information about not only the SCD but other strategies for healing.

I talked to Jay yesterday and in describing my symptoms to me he said it sounded very much like Crohn's, I have wondered about this. I wonder about diagnosis, is it possible that there are many of us who stop with the Celiac diagnosis when we also have Ulcerative Colitis or Crohn's?

[Ms Jan]

Hi Mia,

Thanks for the explanation as to the enzymes of raw fruit/veggies. Nice to know why it works.

Wow, yes, I almost forgot about the nausea already. but yes, that I've suffered from a lot too, and it's much worse than one imagines. makes you want to run far away ... Really sorry to hear how badly hit by this whole thing you are.

Seems like my symptoms have been a lot like yours, only for a shorter period of time, so I believe the damage is much less. Have only had general blood work done recently, and that showed nothing, but I had already been gluten free for a month then, and there's no way I'm going back ever! not even to do proper testing. so I don't know about my vili.

if two months could make such a difference for you, that's an encouraging time frame ...

D has already subsided totally - think it was the magnesium which I have now cut back to just a small dose. Strangely I can't tolerate carrots either. used to love them, but they make me as sick as gluten now.

wondering if there's a genetic/cultural habit thing as to how people react to celiac, since my parents are also german/austrian - I grew up in denmark though. have you ever come across any theories on that?

Sorry to hear how restricted your diet has to be - also read back at earlier posts. Must be tedious to find something to eat. Then again, as long as you can get better it's all worth it.

After these five years of vomiting all the time, I think I could live on chicken soup and veggies for the rest of my life if only it'll keep me healthy. well, would be glad to be able to expand the diet later, but I think you know what I mean. It's just such a relief being able to function for consecutive days that it's worth almost any price

Hope you'll heal quickly !

Jan

[Ms Jan]

I was just talking with someone today about wild oregano and he emphasized the importance of taking probiotics if you are taking the oregano, the oregano will kill good and bad bacteria and the probiotics are needed to repopulate the good bacteria. He recommended a book by Jeanie Patel called "Listen to Your Gut". Apparently it is very important to use them at separate times, makes sense, basically take the oregano on an empty stomach and two hours later take the probiotics.

[GermanMia]

Hi Jan,

yes, I know exactly, what you mean with eating chicken soup for the rest of your life when it only helps! I just feel the same way. Vomiting is the worst thing I can imagine, so I wouldn't do the gluten challenge either.

It is possible that gluten intolerance can cause fructose malabsorption - it did it in my case - so maybe you should be a bit careful about that for some time, too. The good thing is that it will go away.

There are studies which show that people of African origine suffer less often from celiac or gluten intolerance than white people, that's so far all I know.

General bloodwork sadly doesn't say much. You can nearly have anything without the normal tests showing a sign - that's the problem: You actually have to know what you are looking for.

Hope you'll get better soon, too, and find the encouragement you need here

Mia

[pele]

Dawn

I have had good luck with some kinds of homeopathic. I used one last summer when I got stung by a wasp and ended up with a milder than expected reaction to the sting. Also I feel arnica works for me. So I would go for it, but keep in mind many homeopathic pills are made with sugar and therefore not SCD legal.

[pele]

I need to vent. Today I was accused of being anorexic because I am skinny. I eat as much as my system can handle, believe me. Then I was accused, by the same person, of being obsessed with food. And told that being gluten-free works for me because I think it does. Like this is all in my head. And told that people are always trying to blame their problems on something outside of themselves.

Grrr. I felt like asking her to eat some rat poison then tell me that those stomach pains were just coming from her negative emotions.

I hate this "blame the victim" mentality.

Seriously, what can you say to people like this?

[rinne]

I'm sorry that happened to you, I've had it happen to me. One "friend" suggested it was just a food trip!

I don't spend time with people who think like that anymore and as harsh as some of the lessons were..... getting sick really opened my eyes to the people who do care. I understand now that people who make judgements like that are not my friends.

[GermanMia]

Pele, I'm sorry, too.

I'm used to this since I was a teenage girl... Can't count how many people suggested I'd go find a good psychiatrist Twentyfive years ago I was totally unsure and scared thinking that maybe they were right and I was really nuts - but nowadays I just laugh at people and tell them that if I hadn't got this tick about nutrition I was too wonderful to stand... I can do that because I never talk about my problems except with my husband, my naturopath (who happens to be my best friend) and my doc - and here I'm afraid I'm not a very decent person because if I eat in company and people keep hacking at me because of my eating habits despite me telling them not to mind my tick, I just point out that they probably will become diabetic if they continue stuffing themselves with tons of carbs.

Never discuss - either they accept you as you are or you better do what rinne says...

[chatycady]

Unfortunately I may have been one of those people. I don't think I ever told anyone that they should see a shrink, but I may have thought it!

Last night I attended a retirement party. The meal was catered. I took my yogurt along, just in case there wasn't anything to eat. Sure enough, everything had some type of cream soup on it or mixes. So I quietly sat and tried to eat my yogurt. I was asked alot of questions.

I finally said. IT'S ONLY FOOD! I'm FINE! They got the message.

I've been told my eyes are brighter, I'm happier, and fun to be with. That's all I need to hear.

They are the ones obsessed with food. We aren't. We eat healthy. We don't drool over desserts or swoon over cheesey potatoes, or eat till we are stuffed and uncomfortable.

[fig girl]

chatycady,

I totally agree with you! Disease has totally given me purpose. I am so into nutrition and natural living and healing that I am considering going into it for a career. I'm looking into going into Holistic Nutrition. Thank you Disease!

Hi chatycady and Lovey25,

That's great chaty that you've joined your local celiac group and you're thinking about demonstrating making the yogurt! The closest celiac support group near me is about an hour away but one of the nurses at my Dr.'s office is celiac and is looking into starting one here.

Lovey25 - I've always been interested in nutrition but after going gluten free and starting the SCD I've really learned a lot. I would love to go back to school for a career in it but i'm not sure what i would want to do - plus I'm 44 years old! Good luck and i'm sure you'll do well - i think if you can do what you love and what you're passionate for you'll really do well.

[fig girl]

On another topic, I am still starving half the day, and this morning doubled my usual meat serving at breakfast. It made a big difference, but I still wonder: how much meat do you guys eat? My meat/eggs total is around a pound a day--seems like a lot, is it? I wish I had a side of beef cut and wrapped in the freezer--do others feel this way? I weigh a few pounds less than I did when I started this diet last April.