Could It Be That Simple?

[Muzz]

OK, here goes....I've had severe fatigue for several years, have the bloating and gassiness, altho not much diarrhea, in fact I was constipated for yrs before having my GB removed last yr. I take Nexium for a amall stomach ulcer. Have run the gamut of blood tests, including autoimmune, RA, thyroid, and several blood counts, all o except a slightly low red count. I have a very prolonged bleeding time, PT is normal, don't take apsirin or such, and am borderline anemic. I contracted mono this fall and have have very frequent upper respitory infections and bouts of flu. I also bruise very easily and have joint pain and burning of the hands and feet and chronic back and neck pain. Now, doesn't t that just all sound lovely

So, my main question is this: can gluten intolerance be aquired or does one have it since birth and it gets worse with age? I am 53 and other-wise healthy, no diabetes or heart disease. My Mom was diagnosed with CFS yrs ago and has since died at age 69 of leukemia. She had chronic diarrhea and alot of stomach problems.

I would be tickled pink to find out that a gluten-free diet could relieve my symptoms. I don't have alot of faith in docs, they seem to only look at blood results and not the whole patient. I'd appreciate any feedback on my question.

[mushroom]

OK, here goes....I've had severe fatigue for several years, have the bloating and gassiness, altho not much diarrhea, in fact I was constipated for yrs before having my GB removed last yr. I take Nexium for a amall stomach ulcer. Have run the gamut of blood tests, including autoimmune, RA, thyroid, and several blood counts, all o except a slightly low red count. I have a very prolonged bleeding time, PT is normal, don't take apsirin or such, and am borderline anemic. I contracted mono this fall and have have very frequent upper respitory infections and bouts of flu. I also bruise very easily and have joint pain and burning of the hands and feet and chronic back and neck pain. Now, doesn't t that just all sound lovely

So, my main question is this: can gluten intolerance be aquired or does one have it since birth and it gets worse with age? I am 53 and other-wise healthy, no diabetes or heart disease. My Mom was diagnosed with CFS yrs ago and has since died at age 69 of leukemia. She had chronic diarrhea and alot of stomach problems.

I would be tickled pink to find out that a gluten-free diet could relieve my symptoms. I don't have alot of faith in docs, they seem to only look at blood results and not the whole patient. I'd appreciate any feedback on my question.

Muzz:

The only way to find out is to go gluten free. Do not rely on doctors to help you with this question. You just need to do it and see if it helps.

As for the born with or acquired question, I think most of us here on the forum can trace the onset of their symptoms waay back before they were recognized even by them. I always knew I had digestive problems. My earliest recollection is at the breakfast table trying to force myself to eat porridge or Weatbix, or Vimax or other horrible cereal tortures my mother imposed on me before I went to school. Then when I got to school, the stomach cramps, gas, diarrhoea, etc. would set in.

Fastforward, after I left home things went pretty smoothly until I arrived in the USA and began eating Mexican food--corn and flour tortillas, gassy beans, etc. I was tested and showed allergic to corn and soy so gave them up, but still had the terrible bloating and gas and diarrhoea, sometimes so bad I would pass out (I was then 29).

Fastforward back to New Zealand in 2002 (age 62) and I developed RA (always tested RA negative) and then psoriatic arthritis. Of course, not a soul suggested that these autoimmune problems could be in any way related to diet or gluten (I have always been a great bread lover--San Francisco sourdough, mmmm!) There followed a litany of horrible arthritis drugs with their side effects.

In the meantime all those intervening years I had been "diagnosed" with IBS (irritable bowel syndrome) and plenty of other erroneous things, and had been a constant consumer of Gas-Ex.

Now, I did not have some of your symptoms, like the fatigue and anemia and slow blood clotting, so I can't comment on those, but do have easy bruising, live skin peels off my arms at the slightest excuse , and I have constant upper respiratory infections too. My mom had digestive problems, my dad was diagnosed with polymyalgia rheumatica but I believe he had RA, my sister has gone gluten free without being tested because her daughter is a diagnosed celiac and CFS, and she feels better because of it.

I am now gluten free for 2-3 months, medication free, arthritis free, mostly psoriasis free, and bloat-free except when I get glutened (that's how I know).

So I would certainly encourage you to try gluten free right away, and if it doesn't work then you can always explore other avenues. You have nothing to lose but your ill health

Good luck, and I am sure you will receive lots of other better advice from other members.

Neroli

[Lisa]

Welcome Muzz,

Here are the tests you can ask you doctor to order:

Anti-gliadin antibodies (AGA) both IgA and IgG

Anti-endomysial antibodies (EMA) - IgA

Anti-tissue transglutaminase antibodies (tTG) - IgA

Total IgA level

There are three methods of testing: the Celiac Panel (as the above), endoscopy/biopsy and positive dietary response.

[Guest j_mommy]

There are a few ways to find out as Lisa mentioned....Dietary response is not the only way!

My word of "advise" is if you think that you will ever what to be actually tested for it, do it now! Otherwise you have to do a gluten challenge(4 slices of bread a day for 2-4 months and then get tested) if you want to be tested after going gluten-free. I couldn't imagine doing that, if I get CC'd(cross contaminated) now my systoms are WAY worse than before I went gluten-free.

Good luck to you in whichever you choose!!!

[Worriedtodeath]

OK, here goes....I've had severe fatigue for several years, have the bloating and gassiness, altho not much diarrhea, in fact I was constipated for yrs before having my GB removed last yr. I take Nexium for a amall stomach ulcer. Have run the gamut of blood tests, including autoimmune, RA, thyroid, and several blood counts, all o except a slightly low red count. I have a very prolonged bleeding time, PT is normal, don't take apsirin or such, and am borderline anemic. I contracted mono this fall and have have very frequent upper respitory infections and bouts of flu. I also bruise very easily and have joint pain and burning of the hands and feet and chronic back and neck pain. Now, doesn't t that just all sound lovely

Take out the gb problems and constipation and that's me in a nut shell. I gave up at the young age of 23 of ever knowing what was wrong with me when I was dx with fibromyalge (sp?) and given a handful of pills to take. Now 3 weeks gluten-free , the joint pain is gone. My hands aren't swollen and I even sat down and crocheted a little without dying in pain. My time was last week and it lasted 2 days!!! Too soon to say if htat will stay that way but I was very excited. THe back ache is now at least from time to time instead of everytime I move, and I haven't been sick in 3 weeks even with 2 kids sick. We are cutting out dairy/soy to see if that makes what little symptoms we have left go away for good. I didn't get tested because they have yet been able to dx my very sick baby with anything and I thought what was the point of more tests only to be told once again that I was perfectly healthly and normal when they can't even figure out what is wrong with such an obviously sick child.

HTH

Stacie

[Guest j_mommy]

From what I understand it is MUCH harder for them to DX a child. THe blood tests are not that reliable in childern.

Adults are a different story.

[RiceGuy]

Like others have said, I too would highly recommend trying the gluten-free diet. It really isn't something to fear or dread, and though it may seem near impossible at first, anyone who has been gluten-free for awhile can tell you it gets progressively easier as you go about it. When I first contemplated the gluten-free diet, I thought "no way", but that was because I was eating a pound of pasta and more than half a loaf of bread every day. It is truly amazing how easily we get hooked on the very things that harm us.

Anyway, I'm sure I speak for everyone here that you will have the full support of all the fine members of this board. Plus the celiac.com site itself has a wealth of information to help you start off right.

But as was previously stated, if you really want a doctor's diagnosis (can't imagine why), it would probably be easier to get it over with immediately. Thing is, given the inaccuracy in the tests, it would be a terrible tragedy to continue suffering just because of a false negative. With the prospect of regaining your health within reach - with something you can do yourself, without doctors, drugs, etc - trying the gluten-free diet seems like the thing to do no matter what the tests say. After all, what's to lose?

Hope you get the answers you need!

[Muzz]

Oh gosh, TY all for your wonderful replies! Sorry so late in replying but I assumed that I would get email notification and have been checking it frequently since my original post, I must need to look at my profile and see if there is a place for email notification. (ok, I see it now, right below the posting box....duh... )

Anywaaaaay I am so bouyed by the positive responses. Trust me, I have no desire to be put through the testing, I'm more than willing to try the diet....and herein lies the problem : Hi, I'm Muzz and I'm a bread-aholic When I can't eat anything else I can always eat bread.. lol And pasta, and...well, u all know. I nibble Saltine crackers when I need to eat and don't feel like it. On the up-side, food is not one of the main pleasures of my life (altho I do love my bread). I eat to live rather than the other way around(unlike my DH...lol ) I'm not a big eater and going gluten-free may not be as big a challenge as it would be for some ppl. I'm a Pediatriac Home Care nurse and wk p/t nights and that's the only time that snacking is a problem. I'm heading off to do some research on a gluten-free diet! At this point, I'm willing to try anything, esp with all of the great feedback I've gotten here. Just knowing that it COULD be the whole problem will make it easier to get used to the way of eating. The thought of feeling better in a few weeks is mind-boggling! I had begun to resign myself to the idea that I would spend the remainder of my life half-living.

Oh, I forgot, just exactly HOW important is the dairy restriction? I depend on my Instant Breakfast every day to start the day and to have something on my tummy for meds. I cannot cannot eat breakfast. I see on the side panel a great display of gluten-free foods( pizza, yeaaaaaaa!! )

If it's ok, I'll update my progress and try not to be a PITB... lol Again, TY all for your responses!

[mushroom]

Oh gosh, TY all for your wonderful replies! ...

Anywaaaaay I am so bouyed by the positive responses. Trust me, I have no desire to be put through the testing, I'm more than willing to try the diet....and herein lies the problem : Hi, I'm Muzz and I'm a bread-aholic ...

If it's ok, I'll update my progress and try not to be a PITB... lol Again, TY all for your responses!

Hi, my name is Mushroom and I was a bread-aholic... Funny, after you stop it for a while you really don't want it that much any more. I go days without eating what are some pretty good non-gluten breads here in New Zealand (fermented buckwheat based), such that they sometimes mold in my fridge. I gave up pasta a long time ago because of the diarrhoea (my first inkling of gluten problems) and that wasn't much of a problem either except as a vehicle for the parmesan cheese, but eggplant is a good substitute. Today I found out I might have to suspend dairy too--oh well, there are plenty of other yummy foods to eat. Hummus dips and Sakata crackers, lots of nuts and seeds, olives (but alas no bread and butter pickles--just checked the label today and the caramel coloring comes from wheat--why do they do that???!!!) That has probably accounted for some of my glutening.

Please do keep us updated with what you decide to do and what the outcome is. The very best of British/American luck in whatever you decide. We are all interested in everyone's outcomes--you will never be a PITB.

Neroli

[AliB]

I have just posted the following on the 'Related Diseases' section but I will post it here again as it fits this thread perfectly. I too have been discovering the bliss of going Gluten-free and I believe it is the key behind so many illnesses and diseases. I am so convinced, I want to shout it from the rooftops!!!! Here goes............

Now here's a thing.

I am an analyst. Not by vocation, by nature. I have a questioning nature. I have always needed to have answers. I read, I absorb, I filter, and I cogitate.

Diabetics get neuropathy. Amongst other things. Undiagnosed Celiacs get neuropathy. Amongst other things. The neuropathy experienced by Celiacs is due to malabsorption. Namely, Vitamin B12 but may also be compounded by a deficiency in other things.

Neuropathy in Diabetics is shrugged off as a 'symptom of Diabetes, particularly uncontrolled'. Very rarely (particularly here in the UK) is any blood testing done to look for deficiencies, and in any case, what is considered 'normal' levels is still, sadly, probably due to a lack of research, a very inexact science. The level my body functions happiest at is not necessarily the same as yours and because (I believe) Gluten Intolerance is so widespread, whether low-level or higher, even so-called 'healthy' individuals who are used as controls in any research, may even themselves not be displaying optimum nutritional levels!

I do not believe that we can separate Glucose Intolerance from Celiac Disease. Celiac is a progression of GI. Some individuals have a genetic leaning toward Celiac and that is what they, if the GI is not addressed early enough, at some point will develop. Some will have genetic vulnerability to other diseases. Some people's GI will eventually trigger other ailments/diseases, depending on their risk factors - their vulnerability, and degree and range of malabsorption deficiency, such as Chronic Fatigue, Fibromyalgia, Rheumatoid Arthritis, Multiple Sclerosis, possibly even Cancer.

Why do I see over again, when I read the experiences on this and other forums, people saying, "I am Gluten Intolerant and have started eating Gluten-Free and amazingly, my CFS, FM, RA, Psoriasis, Migraines, Diverticulitis, IBS, Chocolate Addiction, etc., etc., has gone away, cleared up, disappeared. I am so much better". The key is Gluten.

Why am I not surprised? I do not look for complicated answers. I look for simple ones. The answer to this is so blatantly simple it has completely been ignored. If plain, ordinary, bog-standard Gluten Intolerance was taken far more seriously then maybe there would be an awful lot of people out there who would never end up developing the dreadful diseases that they find themselves having to cope with, costly drug treatments would be unnecessary and people would have a far better degree of health, maybe not perfect, but definitely better.

Am I the only one who can see this...............?

[RiceGuy]

Yes, AliB, I do see that, and as you said, I also think it is blatantly obvious.

However, I would also toss in the fact that wheat is not what nature intended. Man has tinkered with the genetic makeup, to the point where there are over 20,000 different varieties of wheat in commercial production, and yet not a single one of them is natural. They are ALL hybrids! It used to be that wheat had either two or four sets of chromosomes, but today's wheat typically has 8, 12, or even as much as 16 or more sets. The designers of these thigs are continuously pushing for more, and it has primarily been done to increase the percentage of gluten. Some of the first efforts were to create hybrids which could grow in regions of the planet where they otherwise couldn't. So wheat wasn't grown in nearly as many parts of the world as it is today. These changes began roughly 200-300 years ago, from the reading I've done, though I'm sure other hybrids had been created before that time. It's just that there wasn't much if any understanding of how to go about it, until some monk (I forget the name) did a bunch of experiments, to unravel the mystery of how specific characteristics could be added to a given plant.

Just the other day, I read an article that said new research suggests that some of the original wheat varieties may actually be safe for Celiacs, as they do not contain the offending protein sequence. My question though, is if a Celiac would ever become Celiac, if they only had exposure to those original varieties. I believe it may be too late once the immune system has identified gluten as an enemy. It's similar to developing an immunity to chicken pox. Once the body knows what the enemy looks like, it designs a defense, and never forgets.

Also, from what I've read, it is estimated that about 40% of the population has a natural immunity to the adenovirus. This is the virus which causes such conditions as pink eye, mono, croup, and various other things. But the relationship to gluten intolerance is in the fact that an amino acid sequence within the virus closely resembles one within the offending gluten protein fraction!

The following paragraph is my extrapolation of the facts, and may not represent reality.

So to me this means that when man tweaked the genetics of wheat, they inadvertently created a sequence which our immune systems would take to indicate the presence of the virus. Of course, the antibodies created to destroy the virus aren't designed to destroy gluten, so the immune system remains on alert, continuously trying to find and destroy the enemy. Because of the immune system's amazing ability to adapt, it may eventually create an antibody that can destroy the lining of the small intestine. Once this occurs, that person becomes Celiac. This may not be what is actually happening, but that's how I see it.

While I don't think that gluten intolerance wouldn't exist at all without man's doing, it sure seems to me that it would be far less of a problem.

[ravenwoodglass]

I have just posted the following on the 'Related Diseases' section but I will post it here again as it fits this thread perfectly. I too have been discovering the bliss of going Gluten-free and I believe it is the key behind so many illnesses and diseases. I am so convinced, I want to shout it from the rooftops!!!! Here goes............

Now here's a thing.

I am an analyst. Not by vocation, by nature. I have a questioning nature. I have always needed to have answers. I read, I absorb, I filter, and I cogitate.

Diabetics get neuropathy. Amongst other things. Undiagnosed Celiacs get neuropathy. Amongst other things. The neuropathy experienced by Celiacs is due to malabsorption. Namely, Vitamin B12 but may also be compounded by a deficiency in other things.

Neuropathy in Diabetics is shrugged off as a 'symptom of Diabetes, particularly uncontrolled'. Very rarely (particularly here in the UK) is any blood testing done to look for deficiencies, and in any case, what is considered 'normal' levels is still, sadly, probably due to a lack of research, a very inexact science. The level my body functions happiest at is not necessarily the same as yours and because (I believe) Gluten Intolerance is so widespread, whether low-level or higher, even so-called 'healthy' individuals who are used as controls in any research, may even themselves not be displaying optimum nutritional levels!

I do not believe that we can separate Glucose Intolerance from Celiac Disease. Celiac is a progression of GI. Some individuals have a genetic leaning toward Celiac and that is what they, if the GI is not addressed early enough, at some point will develop. Some will have genetic vulnerability to other diseases. Some people's GI will eventually trigger other ailments/diseases, depending on their risk factors - their vulnerability, and degree and range of malabsorption deficiency, such as Chronic Fatigue, Fibromyalgia, Rheumatoid Arthritis, Multiple Sclerosis, possibly even Cancer.

Why do I see over again, when I read the experiences on this and other forums, people saying, "I am Gluten Intolerant and have started eating Gluten-Free and amazingly, my CFS, FM, RA, Psoriasis, Migraines, Diverticulitis, IBS, Chocolate Addiction, etc., etc., has gone away, cleared up, disappeared. I am so much better". The key is Gluten.

Why am I not surprised? I do not look for complicated answers. I look for simple ones. The answer to this is so blatantly simple it has completely been ignored. If plain, ordinary, bog-standard Gluten Intolerance was taken far more seriously then maybe there would be an awful lot of people out there who would never end up developing the dreadful diseases that they find themselves having to cope with, costly drug treatments would be unnecessary and people would have a far better degree of health, maybe not perfect, but definitely better.

Am I the only one who can see this...............?

No your not alone in recognizing this. Just imagine how many dollars could be saved in health care and how many lives could be saved if only doctors would get their heads out of the PDR and actually put two and two together. Unfortunately our medical proffesion has gotten so specialized that doctors fail to look at the whole picture. Everyone takes his little bit and makes his diagnosis based on only the systems he specializes in. Even if they do eventually think of celiac, after you are half-dead, heaven help you if you don't show up in their blood work.

[AliB]

Hi RiceGuy and RavenWoodGlass.

Phew. What a relief to know I'm not the only one who has drawn this perfectly logical conclusion! You are so right about wheat being the catalyst. Gluten Intolerance can start right from in the womb with the baby picking up from its Mothers' bloodstream. The poor little thing will then be bombarded with Lactose in Baby Milk and also end up with lactose intolerance and so the stage is set for problems for the rest of its life.

Years ago, if a mother could not feed her baby, a wet-nurse would be found. The baby would then continue to receive breast milk albeit not its own Mothers'. Allergies were virtually unheard of. Now it is absolutely widespread. The Medical Profession just cannot see what is staring them in the face. As you say, they are so so blinkered they can only see in one direction at a time and are absolutely incapable of looking at the whole picture.

I have already started telling my friends about this and encouraging them to at least try Gluten-free for a few weeks to see if it makes any difference.

I am really beginning to see the benefit. Just now, for the first time in a long, long time, I actually RAN up the stairs!!!!! In many ways, I am glad for this attack I have had - it has made me wake-up and smell the gluten-free!

[Muzz]

Of course, the drug co. and the medical community is going to be slow to recognize or to admit to recognizing anthing that they will have no control over and make no money on.

I read these posts and sit here with my mouth haning open....so many of the ailments and symptoms described fit me to a T. I don't remember ever feeling really well but I did eat "better" when I was younger and raising a family. In recent yrs with just hubby and me hre, I've been a gluten-glutton, I guess, alot more bread, etc and fewer veggies and fruit. Perhaps this has worsened a condition I've had all of my life? No matter, I now know what may be the cultprit behind the misery. I was recently dx with mono, have had neuropathy of feet and legs for several yrs, have very low iron saturations altho my iron level is normal,(doc says that for some reason, my body is unable to use the iron it has in store....uh, hello???) have Reynaud's,tae meds for depression, and oh, shoot just feel like mud! Most of you know, you've been there. I am so anxious to give this a shot! I would give up just about anything to feel good and be healthy .....

[AliB]

Of course, the drug co. and the medical community is going to be slow to recognize or to admit to recognizing anthing that they will have no control over and make no money on.

I read these posts and sit here with my mouth haning open....so many of the ailments and symptoms described fit me to a T. I don't remember ever feeling really well but I did eat "better" when I was younger and raising a family. In recent yrs with just hubby and me hre, I've been a gluten-glutton, I guess, alot more bread, etc and fewer veggies and fruit. Perhaps this has worsened a condition I've had all of my life? No matter, I now know what may be the cultprit behind the misery. I was recently dx with mono, have had neuropathy of feet and legs for several yrs, have very low iron saturations altho my iron level is normal,(doc says that for some reason, my body is unable to use the iron it has in store....uh, hello???) have Reynaud's,tae meds for depression, and oh, shoot just feel like mud! Most of you know, you've been there. I am so anxious to give this a shot! I would give up just about anything to feel good and be healthy .....

Me too, I could not believe what I was reading a week or so ago. And I cannot believe what a difference a week has made. A week of gluten-free has changed my life!

As it seems likely that your problems are due to Gluten, avoiding it will help your body heal. It is likely that the neuropathy is due to low B12. Hopefully you may have caught it in time to reverse at least some of the damage.

Although I am diabetic (and annoyed, as, if I had known years ago, and avoided Gluten then, I might not have even developed diabetes!) I have not, so far, apart from just this week feeling a few twinges, had any problem with neuropathy which I am grateful for.

Not only am I avoiding Gluten, I have also stopped dairy, apart from the odd live yogurt, and am trying to really limit my sugar intake too. I thought, well, in for a penny, in for a pound. If I am going to have a radical change to my diet I might as well go the whole hog!

Oh by the way Riceguy, I did a bit of research about wheat. You are on the right track, except for the chromosome bit. Apparently all wheat is derived from an original 14 chromosome wheat. At some point over the last 200 years it was hybridised into a 28 chromosome grain, then finally to 42 chromosomes, which is the modern wheat we have today. It seems that is is probably the complexity of the protein that has rendered it such a problem. Interesting stuff!

[Muzz]

Actually, Ali, my b12 level tested as high but my iron sats are way low, in spite of my actual iron level being normal. that would seem like a malapsorption issue to me

I'm not one that needs to know why, just how to fix it

[AliB]

Actually, Ali, my b12 level tested as high but my iron sats are way low, in spite of my actual iron level being normal. that would seem like a malapsorption issue to me

I'm not one that needs to know why, just how to fix it

It is interesting you said your B12 levels are high. I don't know how accurate it is but someone posted on the forum somewhere that the blood will draw certain elements from the body in order to keep the blood levels up so the blood can be high yet the body level low. I suppose that is possible. Maybe a deficiency doesn't show up until the body is so depleted it can't top the blood up any more. Dunno, but it sounds an interesting theory. After all, you were saying that your blood saturation is low even though your blood levels are high, so there might well be an element of truth in that one.

It is definitely though down to malabsorption. I went to the hospital today for a blood test for B12 /Folate. Whilst there I asked for information on Celiac. Do you know, nobody knew where to find anything on it? If the Doctors don't diagnose it, and people are not informed about it, how the hell is anyone ever going to be picked up and diagnosed properly????

My lovely Mum died of starvation. She was eating food, but I know now that her problems were due to a lack of nutrients. Until 4 weeks before she died when it was too little too late, not one doctor considered Celiac. We were helplessly watching her die and there was nothing we could do because we didn't know! A doctor finally put her on to Gluten-free but the damage was too far gone. This needs a huge amount of awareness and education.

[RiceGuy]

Oh by the way Riceguy, I did a bit of research about wheat. You are on the right track, except for the chromosome bit. Apparently all wheat is derived from an original 14 chromosome wheat. At some point over the last 200 years it was hybridised into a 28 chromosome grain, then finally to 42 chromosomes, which is the modern wheat we have today. It seems that is is probably the complexity of the protein that has rendered it such a problem. Interesting stuff!

I'd like to read that. Can you post a link? I haven't been able to locate the article I got my info from, though I know I had bookmarked it. One thing to note, is that the article I read said 2 and 4 sets of chromosomes, but did not indicate the total number. So it may be that both articles are correct, unless the article you read also said sets?

In any case, one fact remains - the wheat of today is not as it used to be.

And yes AliB, Celiac awareness is all but nil. Horribly frustrating. But you can be sure, if a drug company cooks up a brew for the symptoms, they'll push it on the doctors, and they on their patients. Ever notice they haven't been able to create a drug to actually cure anything? I mean, it's always about treatment - ongoing, never-ending. Has there ever been a single drug, which once administered, resolved the problem, and cured the patient? Of course not, as there's little money it that. Yet people still look to them for their ills! Astonishing. I don't get it.

[AliB]

Hi Riceguy. Hmm I hadn't thought about it in terms of sets so you might actually be right on that one. If each set contains 7 chromosomes then the 2 would equate to the 14 and the four to the 28.

Anyway, here is da link - www.answers.com/topic/the-natural-history-of-wheat

Sorry it didn't link but hopefully you can paste it.

You're right about the drugs thing too. I get it completely. I know exactly why that is. And boy am I looking forward to the solution.

[Darn210]

Oh, I forgot, just exactly HOW important is the dairy restriction? I depend on my Instant Breakfast every day to start the day and to have something on my tummy for meds. I cannot cannot eat breakfast. I see on the side panel a great display of gluten-free foods( pizza, yeaaaaaaa!! )

Muzz, I don't believe you got an answer to this question . . . although my answer will be vague . . .

Some people don't have a problem with the dairy. Some people have a short term problem with the lactose. Some people have a short term problem with the dairy (can go back on after 6mos - couple of years). Some people have a long term/permanent problem with dairy.

If I were you, I would start out gluten-free and lactose free (ensure is both of these). If you still have symptoms or symptoms come back, try removing all dairy.

[Muzz]

Muzz, I don't believe you got an answer to this question . . . although my answer will be vague . . .

Some people don't have a problem with the dairy. Some people have a short term problem with the lactose. Some people have a short term problem with the dairy (can go back on after 6mos - couple of years). Some people have a long term/permanent problem with dairy.

If I were you, I would start out gluten-free and lactose free (ensure is both of these). If you still have symptoms or symptoms come back, try removing all dairy.

TY, I'll consider that.

Of course docs aren't going to cure anything, that would be sorta like the oil companies inventing a gas-free car. Needless to say, I don't have alot of faith in docs anymore, they all have their own aganda, it seems and it doesn't include seeing a pt as a whole person. sigh....

[DingoGirl]

And yes AliB, Celiac awareness is all but nil. Horribly frustrating. But you can be sure, if a drug company cooks up a brew for the symptoms, they'll push it on the doctors, and they on their patients. Ever notice they haven't been able to create a drug to actually cure anything? I mean, it's always about treatment - ongoing, never-ending. Has there ever been a single drug, which once administered, resolved the problem, and cured the patient? Of course not, as there's little money it that. Yet people still look to them for their ills! Astonishing. I don't get it.

hmmmmmm....I think only antibiotics can be a "cure." Other than that, you're probably right...everything else treats symptoms.

And yes, there's no MONEY involved in gluten removal, so doctors/pharmaceutical companies don't really give a crap about it, and most never will. If we're all healthy, how would they stay afloat? They don't want this.....they just want more patients........

[AliB]

Hi Muzz, yes Dairy can be a problem for some, but I think it comes back to how well our bodies process sugar in general.

I would say, if you have a problem with Candida, stay off the Dairy. The more sugar we eat, the more Candida and similar yeasts have to grow in order to cope with it. If the sugar consumption is unchecked, the Candida will eventually overwhelm the other bacteria and cause a huge problem and further devastation within the body.

The only way to control it is to limit sugar to an occasional treat. Honey is better than sugar as it , at least, contains some nutrients whereas sugar is 'empty' calories and of no use nutritionally.

Some may find, particularly if their sugar consumption is limited and eventually the gut flora returns to normal, that they can then cope with Lactose (milk sugar).

We have control over our health. That control is in what we put in our mouth!

Gluten and Sugar are the two worst foods we can eat. Don't consider yourself deprived by not having them. Consider it a blessing.

[Muzz]

Hi Muzz, yes Dairy can be a problem for some, but I think it comes back to how well our bodies process sugar in general.

I would say, if you have a problem with Candida, stay off the Dairy. The more sugar we eat, the more Candida and similar yeasts have to grow in order to cope with it. If the sugar consumption is unchecked, the Candida will eventually overwhelm the other bacteria and cause a huge problem and further devastation within the body.

The only way to control it is to limit sugar to an occasional treat. Honey is better than sugar as it , at least, contains some nutrients whereas sugar is 'empty' calories and of no use nutritionally.

Some may find, particularly if their sugar consumption is limited and eventually the gut flora returns to normal, that they can then cope with Lactose (milk sugar).

We have control over our health. That control is in what we put in our mouth!

Gluten and Sugar are the two worst foods we can eat. Don't consider yourself deprived by not having them. Consider it a blessing.

Dairy has never been a problem for me and no Candida here As far as sweets, I can take or leave, occ a piece of milk choc and then I'm good for awhile. And I agree about control over our own health, if we don't look out for it, who will?