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Help With Cd Link To Schizophrenia

PsyDbound

By PsyDbound
in Related Issues & Disorders

Recommended Posts

PsyDbound Newbie
PsyDbound
Posted

I am currently doing reserch on gut permibility and shizophrenia.I don't quite understand the celular process after penetration of the mucosa. I would appriciate any help in getting a clear picture of the transition from anti-gliden to abnormality of the t-cell and the brain connection. Please keep in mind that I am Psych trained and not medical.

Thanks for you time,

Christina

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MySuicidalTurtle Enthusiast
MySuicidalTurtle
Posted

I hate to seem daft, but I think you would get more help by explaining what you need in other words.

PsyDbound Newbie
PsyDbound
Posted
  • Author

Sorry, my bad. Im just having a hard time with the physiology of celiac disease after it has damaged the villi. I know that malabsorbtion is a problem but I don't understand what is being tranfered past the gut wall to the t-cells and what they have to do with schizophrenia. I am sorry if this isn't clear but I really dont understand it myself. Also, if I have misunderstood the whole villi breaking part please correct me.

Thanks,

Christina

Carriefaith Enthusiast
Carriefaith
Posted

I have read in the book Wheat Free Worry free: The Art of Happy, Healthy Gluten-Free Living by Danna Korn that celiac and schizophrenia may be related. I believe that there is a section in the book on this topic.

MySuicidalTurtle Enthusiast
MySuicidalTurtle
Posted

I never thought about the two being connected but I can see how they could be, along with other disorders. Very interesting stuff.

FaithInScienceToo Contributor
FaithInScienceToo
Posted

Quick reply...

Here is a link for a the discussion of this topic - There are numerous references contained in it - perhaps there is something there for you?

Open Original Shared Link

Good luck,

Gina

PsyDbound Newbie
PsyDbound
Posted
  • Author

Thanks for the info, its great and coincides with what I have been researching. I think I may need to confer with a physiologist because I still don't understand what happens on a cellular level. Is seems quite confusing.

Thanks again,

Christina

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Maggie1956 Rookie
Maggie1956
Posted

Hmmmm, very interesting. <_< My sister is a schizophrenic, and she also has trouble in her gut. She recently tested negative to celiac, but I still think she may be gluten intolerant. I'm not sure how accurate the test was either.

Give us an update when you find out more.

mommida Enthusiast
mommida
Posted

Have you looked into the studies that show calcifications of the brain in Celiac patients?

  • 2 weeks later...
Guest BellyTimber
Guest BellyTimber
Posted

As a parallel to this may I suggest Paul Shattock, Paul Whiteley and Dawn Savery who have published the following titles about their work at the Autism Research Unit, School of Health Sciences, University of Sunderland, Sunderland, SR2 7EE, U.K.:

- Autism as a metabolic disorder: guidelines for gluten and casein free dietary intervention

- Autism as a metabolic disorder

- Guidelines for the implementation of a gluten and/or casein free diet with people with autism or associated spectrum disorders

I would be surprised if you didn't find the biochemistry mentioned in these of some interest.

Let us know how you get on - we'll try to follow your terminology!

Michael

Ruth UK Newbie
Ruth UK
Posted

Michael,

I am honestly NOT stalking you. It's just that it's great to have someone from the UK here who is obviously very well read! May I be cheeky enough to enquire what your profession is? (Obviously, don't reply to this if you don't wish to.)

I may have already mentioned this in another post to you, but my lad has ADHD, Asperger's Syndrome and dyspraxia, and in connection with this I would agree with you that the work taking place at the ARU is VERY interesting. My son tested +ve on their tests for 'gluten and casein insensitivity'.

No doubt will speak to you again:)

LUAP Newbie
LUAP
Posted

THE ANSWER FOR THE GUT PERMEABILITY IS GIVEN BY DOUG KAUFMANN IN THE FUNGUS LINK.

I HAVE'NT READ ANYWHERE THAT THERE WAS ABNORMALITY WITH T CELLS...T CELLS ARE PRESENT WHEN SOMETHING DANGEROUS IS PRESENT...

LET TALK ABOUT GLIADIN (MEMBER OF THE GLUTEN GROUP).

THE PEPTID THEORY SAYS THAT THE PROBLEM WITH GLUTEN IS THE SIZE OF THE PROTEIN. THE VERY LONG AMINO ACID CHAIN. RESEARCH ARE CONDUCT ON ENZYMES THAT COULD HELP BREAK THAT HEAVY AMINO ACID CHAIN.

THE PROBLEM WITH THE LONG CHAIN...THE LONGEST IT IS, THE MORE THERE IS GLUTAMIC ACID.

GLUTAMINE, MSG, GLUTAMIC ACID...NATURALY PRESENT IN FOOD. GRAINS CONTAINS ALOT OF IT, ALONG WITH TOMATOES, BEETS, AND OTHERS.

REFERS TO THE BOOK: EXCITOTOXINS, THE TASTE THAT KILLS.

IN THOSES 2 BOOKS, YOU HAVE ALL THE ANSWER YOU NEED...IN MY OPINION.

PAUL

PsyDbound Newbie
PsyDbound
Posted
  • Author

Thank you so much for all of your help and support. I am now completing my research and will post a link to my findings. Again, you have all been so helpful.

FYI I have a Mom, 3 sisters and a brother all with celiac disease (thats out of 12 kids and not all have been tested yet). After writing this research I am convinced testing for celiac disease should be universially accepted and preformed before age five.

Thanks,

Christina

PsyDbound Newbie
PsyDbound
Posted
  • Author

I finished my research and would be happy to e-mail my findings and refrences. Below is a link to a very significant study by William Eaton for the British Medical Journal.

Thanks again for all the great ideas!

Christina

Open Original Shared Link

Guest BellyTimber
Guest BellyTimber
Posted

Ruth

Didn't think you were.

Not working in any related field.

Over the decades my body has talked to me bit by bit about neurology and metabolism leading me to other sources of information. The spirit leading through the body. Making better sense of my life history (so far).

I get little pieces or batches of thoughts together & can express them all in one but the general skill of information organising comes very difficult to me, a kind of dyslexia I think. My having hyperfocussed on words since an early age and excellent spelling and handwriting masked that to "experts"!

Despite so much of my life being behind me fortunately I still have my life ahead of me in some tantalisingly unknown ways...

Michael

:P

Guest BellyTimber
Guest BellyTimber
Posted

Paul,

The various causes and effects of diseases are like one of those gangs that put forward a different "suspect" every time one goes to pursue ones "enquiries" among them.

(probably not a good metaphor)

Regards

Michael

judy05 Apprentice
judy05
Posted

Michael,

When you mentioned "dyslexia" a little "bell" went off in my head. In preparing for

my thyroidectomy my endo doc gave me a book to read about endocrine diseases in which the author, a doctor from New York City, explained about a syndrome, group of diseases, which seem to occur in many individuals. It seems when one organ fails, such as the pancreas, diabetes occur. This in turn leads to another endocrine failure, such as thyroiditis or Grave's disease. His point was that these diseases are all related. Some other related diseases were Celiac, Dyslexia, and

prematurely gray hair?? I wish I could remember the title or the author, I lent it to

someone and never got it back. It seems to be true because my family has each

examples of each one of these.

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    • trents
      how much gluten do I need to eat before blood tests?

      By trents · Posted

      So, essentially all of the nutrition in the food we eat is absorbed through the villous lining of the small bowel. This is the section of the intestinal track that is damaged by celiac disease. This villous lining is composed of billions of finger-like projections that create a huge amount of surface area for absorbing nutrients. For the celiac person, when gluten is consumed, it triggers an autoimmune reaction in this area which, of course, generates inflammation. The antibodies connected with this inflammation is what the celiac blood tests are designed to detect but this inflammation, over time, wears down the finger-like projections of the villous lining. Of course, when this proceeds for an extended period of time, greatly reduces the absorption efficiency of the villous lining and often results in many and various nutrient deficiency-related health issues. Classic examples would be osteoporosis and iron deficiency. But there are many more. Low D3 levels is a well-known celiac-caused nutritional deficiency. So is low B12. All the B vitamins in fact. Magnesium, zinc, etc.  Celiac disease can also cause liver inflammation. You mention elevated ALP levels. Elevated liver enzymes over a period of 13 years was what led to my celiac diagnosis. Within three months of going gluten free my liver enzymes normalized. I had elevated AST and ALT. The development of sensitivities to other food proteins is very common in the celiac population. Most common cross reactive foods are dairy and oats but eggs, soy and corn are also relatively common offenders. Lactose intolerance is also common in the celiac population because of damage to the SB lining.  Eggs when they are scrambled or fried give me a gut ache. But when I poach them, they do not. The steam and heat of poaching causes a hydrolysis process that alters the protein in the egg. They don't bother me in baked goods either so I assume the same process is at work. I bought a plastic poacher on Amazon to make poaching very easy. All this to say that many of the issues you describe could be caused by celiac disease. 
    • catnapt
      how much gluten do I need to eat before blood tests?

      By catnapt · Posted

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    • trents
      how much gluten do I need to eat before blood tests?

      By trents · Posted

      Welcome, @catnapt! The most recent guidelines are the daily consumption of a minimum of 10g of gluten (about the amount found in 4-6 slices of wheat bread) for a minimum of two weeks. But if possible stretching that out even more would enhance the chances of getting valid test results. These guidelines are for those who have been eating gluten free for a significant amount of time. It's called the "gluten challenge".  Yes, you can develop celiac disease at any stage of life. There is a genetic component but also a stress trigger that is needed to activate the celiac genes. About 30-40% of the general population possesses the genetic potential to develop celiac disease but only about 1% of the general population actually develop celiac disease. For most with the potential, the triggering stress event doesn't happen. It can be many things but often it is a viral infection. Having said that, it is also the case that many, many people who eventually are diagnosed with celiac disease probably experienced the actual onset years before. Many celiacs are of the "silent" type, meaning that symptoms are largely missing or very minor and get overlooked until damage to the small bowel lining becomes advanced or they develop iron deficiency anemia or some other medical problem associated with celiac disease. Many, many are never diagnosed or are diagnosed later in life because they did not experience classic symptoms. And many physicians are only looking for classic symptoms. We now know that there are over 200 symptoms/medical problems associated with celiac disease but many docs are only looking for things like boating, gas, diarrhea. I certainly understand your concerns about not wanting to damage your body by taking on a gluten challenge. Your other option is to totally commit to gluten free eating and see if your symptoms improve. It can take two years or more for complete healing of the small bowel lining once going gluten free but usually people experience significant improvement well before then. If their is significant improvement in your symptoms when going seriously gluten free, then you likely have your answer. You would either have celiac disease or NCGS (Non Celiac Gluten Sensitivity).
    • catnapt
      how much gluten do I need to eat before blood tests?

      By catnapt · Posted

      after several years of issues with a para-gland issue, my endo has decided it's a good idea for me to be tested for celiac disease. I am 70 yrs old and stunned to learn that you can get celiac this late in life. I have just gradually stopped eating most foods that contain gluten over the past several years- they just make me feel ill- although I attributed it to other things like bread spiking blood sugar- or to the things I ate *with* the bread or crackers etc   I went to a party in Nov and ate a LOT of a vegan roast made with vital wheat gluten- as well as stuffing, rolls and pie crust... and OMG I was so sick! the pain, the bloating, the gas, the nausea... I didn't think it would ever end (but it did) and I was ready to go the ER but it finally subsided.   I mentioned this to my endo and now she wants me to be tested for celiac after 2 weeks of being on gluten foods. She has kind of flip flopped on how much gluten I should eat, telling me that if the symptoms are severe I can stop. I am eating 2-3 thin slices of bread per day (or english muffins) and wow- it does make me feel awful. But not as bad as when I ate that massive amnt of vital wheat gluten. so I will continue on if I have to... but what bothers me is - if it IS celiac, it seems stupid for lack of a better word, to intentionally cause more damage to my body... but I am also worried, on the other hand, that this is not a long enough challenge to make the blood work results valid.   can you give me any insight into this please?   thank you
    • trents
      Accuracy of testing concerns

      By trents · Posted

      The biopsy looks for damage to the mucosal lining of the small bowel from the inflammation caused by celiac disease when gluten is ingested. Once you remove gluten from the diet, inflammation subsides and the mucosal lining begins to heal. 
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