Roux en' y surgery, Celiac and Me

[Georgia Dan T]

The title would make a dang good country tune.

I'm Dan.  Post Bari Surgery since 1998 with all of the other bari surgery aftermath complaints.  

However a few new wrinkles started to appear in the last few years.  I'm now at the age that my dad passed away in 1987 and his lifestyle, obesity and appetite that kept him lower tract digestively challenged for many years.  As I grew older, I had started to equate the same issues just as a result of the bariatric surgery (stapling rather than removal).  It just seemed like a reasonable alternative to the weight being carried by me and my then very active lifestyle in construction.  Most of the issues in digestion, iron malabsorption, B-12 subcue each month, sugar dumping and always a guessing game when it came to breads or greasy foods.

Breads were never mentioned as a DO NOT food with the exception to limit the amount when it came to maintenance.  However...since Bari surgery, bread has gone into the Do Not column as well as a favorite yeast rolls.  The yeast rolls were rough for lack of a genteel description.  However....I took note that my old man had also suffered with various issues dealing with bread, yeast rolls or pretty much anything good.

I started into Gluten Free products after checking into a few sources that had good people sharing their experiences with Bari and gluten and found too many parallels to not investigate further.  By investigate....I went cold turkey on many things that are wheat, rye or barley driven and within a week...symptoms were pretty much gone.

"Yeah...well you SHOULD not have stopped gluten until you had your bloodwork run through the lab."

Why yes...I know that now....two days ago.<G  Don't really care to go back to something scared the bejeezus out of me a couple of times as I was doing good on avoiding most everything but decided that I needed to dump a few pounds and made a nice big glass of "Whey Protein Supplement Mix - Chocolate) by Gold Standard."  Something I used nearly every day to help speed weight loss...which was controlling itself for the most part, but also to build up muscle that required the additional protein to put back into place.  Back then....from surgery to about 2011, I had a very usual routine at the gym and upon getting back home, a usual Protein Shake by any number of Whey source providers.  Two scoops of the whey mix; 4 oz water to mix; 8 oz of ice to chop and blend and then.....just to make it seem like a malt shop malted....2 tblspns of Carnation Malt Powder at just the right time so that it made the PERFECT way to finish up an exercise routine.

Imagine my chagrin at the middle of last week when I made myself a protein whey shake "Chocolate Malt" only to wind up bloated; distended; Grouchstipated; exhausted, tired, sleepy, lethargic and so laid back in spirit that I had to check around the house to make sure my body wasn't stretched out dead and I was going to haunt this place for eternity.  I mean...I could do worse than home, but if I'm bereft of Life...I'd rather haunt Hawaii.  Just short of a 911 call because it was such an unusual thing, I looked around to see what I had done to myself....including my Food Diary for each item; but scanning through things not on the approved list....there it was under the "Don't Do Dis Food No More" list....Carnations Malt Powder.

After YEARS of being a favorite candy (chocolate covered malt balls), the only thing I'd order in an ice cream shoppe and would tell the gal mixing my Baskin & Robbins Chocolate Malted...."don't be stingy on the malt."  A whole lifetime of being a faithful malt connoisseur....to have my favorite powder turn on me at my tender age?!!  What a pisser!!

I can't say it was sudden as I think back over the past decade of things that weren't the best food item to partake in and there was always something else that I may have mistakenly blamed in lieu of the Malt Powder infusion.

IN any regard....I'm grateful for this site and vast amount of experienced opinions and grateful for the hard work to organize and maintain such a project.  I look forward to finally getting some ideas that will help in the long run.  As much as I enjoy the MDs I work with....I need to give them some credible input so that they can weigh which direction to take for testing or restrictions.    Thanks Scott Adams for this great little place....it's a wealth of relatable knowledge.

Dan

[trents]

28 minutes ago, Georgia Dan T said:

The title would make a dang good country tune.

I'm Dan.  Post Bari Surgery since 1998 with all of the other bari surgery aftermath complaints.  

However a few new wrinkles started to appear in the last few years.  I'm now at the age that my dad passed away in 1987 and his lifestyle, obesity and appetite that kept him lower tract digestively challenged for many years.  As I grew older, I had started to equate the same issues just as a result of the bariatric surgery (stapling rather than removal).  It just seemed like a reasonable alternative to the weight being carried by me and my then very active lifestyle in construction.  Most of the issues in digestion, iron malabsorption, B-12 subcue each month, sugar dumping and always a guessing game when it came to breads or greasy foods.

Breads were never mentioned as a DO NOT food with the exception to limit the amount when it came to maintenance.  However...since Bari surgery, bread has gone into the Do Not column as well as a favorite yeast rolls.  The yeast rolls were rough for lack of a genteel description.  However....I took note that my old man had also suffered with various issues dealing with bread, yeast rolls or pretty much anything good.

I started into Gluten Free products after checking into a few sources that had good people sharing their experiences with Bari and gluten and found too many parallels to not investigate further.  By investigate....I went cold turkey on many things that are wheat, rye or barley driven and within a week...symptoms were pretty much gone.

"Yeah...well you SHOULD not have stopped gluten until you had your bloodwork run through the lab."

Why yes...I know that now....two days ago.<G  Don't really care to go back to something scared the bejeezus out of me a couple of times as I was doing good on avoiding most everything but decided that I needed to dump a few pounds and made a nice big glass of "Whey Protein Supplement Mix - Chocolate) by Gold Standard."  Something I used nearly every day to help speed weight loss...which was controlling itself for the most part, but also to build up muscle that required the additional protein to put back into place.  Back then....from surgery to about 2011, I had a very usual routine at the gym and upon getting back home, a usual Protein Shake by any number of Whey source providers.  Two scoops of the whey mix; 4 oz water to mix; 8 oz of ice to chop and blend and then.....just to make it seem like a malt shop malted....2 tblspns of Carnation Malt Powder at just the right time so that it made the PERFECT way to finish up an exercise routine.

Imagine my chagrin at the middle of last week when I made myself a protein whey shake "Chocolate Malt" only to wind up bloated; distended; Grouchstipated; exhausted, tired, sleepy, lethargic and so laid back in spirit that I had to check around the house to make sure my body wasn't stretched out dead and I was going to haunt this place for eternity.  I mean...I could do worse than home, but if I'm bereft of Life...I'd rather haunt Hawaii.  Just short of a 911 call because it was such an unusual thing, I looked around to see what I had done to myself....including my Food Diary for each item; but scanning through things not on the approved list....there it was under the "Don't Do Dis Food No More" list....Carnations Malt Powder.

After YEARS of being a favorite candy (chocolate covered malt balls), the only thing I'd order in an ice cream shoppe and would tell the gal mixing my Baskin & Robbins Chocolate Malted...."don't be stingy on the malt."  A whole lifetime of being a faithful malt connoisseur....to have my favorite powder turn on me at my tender age?!!  What a pisser!!

I can't say it was sudden as I think back over the past decade of things that weren't the best food item to partake in and there was always something else that I may have mistakenly blamed in lieu of the Malt Powder infusion.

IN any regard....I'm grateful for this site and vast amount of experienced opinions and grateful for the hard work to organize and maintain such a project.  I look forward to finally getting some ideas that will help in the long run.  As much as I enjoy the MDs I work with....I need to give them some credible input so that they can weigh which direction to take for testing or restrictions.    Thanks Scott Adams for this great little place....it's a wealth of relatable knowledge.

Dan

A classic example, Dan, of the multitude of ways gluten is hidden in the processed food supply and through terminology.

[Georgia Dan T]

1 hour ago, trents said:

A classic example, Dan, of the multitude of ways gluten is hidden in the processed food supply and through terminology.

Thanks Trent.  Some of it is going to be NOT keeping gluten free as the top of the list of things everyday.  I'm one of those types that....it only took me once or twice with a Sugar Dump early on after surgery to put it off of the list of approved products everyday forever.  Mostly with a hot coffee and a sweet roll sitting on the basket at a restaurant would catch me with a "I can handle dis."  No way around that.  And now....whether it's inherited from my dad, a result of disturbing that area of the gut for surgery as well as healing internally...or a combination factored with age.

I thought I had seen a few comments within the forum about blood work indicating increased liver enzymes as well as anemia and low levels of B12.  I understand having skipped past the part of the system and intrinsic factor on the B12; and my real first bout with anemia post surgery was a year or so afterwards where I stopped in to a Red Cross set up in a local mall for blood donors....where it was apparent.  As for the liver enzymes...I've never known any of the results of such a malady or condition, but on my list of things to compare to.

I do have to read about more about peanuts.  One of my all time favorites.  However there have been occasions in the past where I took ill and digestive tract in turmoil and assumed that perhaps I had consumed too many.  But some studies appear to show that some peanut processing works against the fact of the nut itself being Gluten Free.

Again...it's a great location here in order to find a lot of answers and compare comparable complaints.  Truthfully....I never thought Gluten Free ever had anything that was a medical necessity for me...until I started reading and see comparable issues with non-surgery and surgerized (bari) alike.

The struggle continues.

 

[trents]

Elevated liver enzymes was what led to my celiac diagnosis. Soon as I went gluten free, those enzymes were back in the normal range. 18% of celiacs experience elevated liver enzymes. Most doctors are ignorant of this. Took me 13 years to get that run down and get a celiac diagnosis. 

I have developed partial intolerances to peanuts and eggs. I can eat eggs occasionally and in limited amounts without issue. Peanuts sometimes give me an upset tummy and sometimes not but they can also trigger migraines for me. I believe I also suffer from histamine intolerance so that is part of it.

[Georgia Dan T]

27 minutes ago, trents said:

Elevated liver enzymes was what led to my celiac diagnosis. Soon as I went gluten free, those enzymes were back in the normal range. 18% of celiacs experience elevated liver enzymes. Most doctors are ignorant of this. Took me 13 years to get that run down and get a celiac diagnosis. 

I have developed partial intolerances to peanuts and eggs. I can eat eggs occasionally and in limited amounts without issue. Peanuts sometimes give me an upset tummy and sometimes not but they can also trigger migraines for me. I believe I also suffer from histamine intolerance so that is part of it.

Woof.  I'm a big fan of the egg.  It's my go to breakfast and pretty much the same ingredients each day (a Jacque Pepin omelet) just to stay on caloric track.  Sometimes a bit of "toast" via Schar Artisan Bakers and a variety of fruit.  My MD referred me over the in-house nutritionist for their large practice who in turn turned me on to the online food diary and bottomless database of all foods; store products and regionally popular items from Kroger, Publix or Fresh Market.  She gave constraints as to how many calories per day; grams of everything else and very detailed diaries...one of eating and the other for exercising (My Fitness Pal).  Lifesaver for me.  I spend a good deal of time in front of it multiple times a day (I think I may have mentioned it...but I retired after 50 years as  homebuilder in April) while working at the best balances on nutrients as well as an easy to defeat limit on caloric intake which...it's rare for me to get close to my allowed cap on calories.

With all of this in the works and doing well with weight loss as well a keeping within and under limits on carbs, fats, sugars, proteins and fiber (I never thought fiber was very important...HAH!) my program is pretty much always in progress....and I'm never hungry.  Once I was without sugar in my system I was over the withdrawals.

Again...all was going really well until the episode with the Whey shake and Malt Powder.  I do have a physical on sched for the first week of June...so we get in long talk about why it's important that he pays close attention as I'm happy for him to help me....or find someone willing to listen to the patient's experiences and needs.

I feel bad that I'm paying about the cost of a gallon of gas for a "loaf" of Schar gluten free bread.  Glute Free isn't free.

Dan

[Wheatwacked]

When you next get blood drawn ask for homocysteine, vitamin D, B12 and folate. The bariatric surgery in itself can cause malnutrition. There is a pattern that high homocysteine and liver issues is an indication of low choline. The good news the minimum RDA for choline is four large eggs, or 15 ounces of steak or 10 cups of cooked broccoli every day. The maximum tolerated safe upper limit of choline is the equivalent of 25 eggs a day. (Or 77 cups of cooked broccoli 🥦)

7 hours ago, Georgia Dan T said:

Woof.  I'm a big fan of the egg. 

Vitamin D Is Not as Toxic as Was Once Thought: A Historical and an Up-to-Date Perspective

Vitamin D and the Immune System - PMC (nih.gov)

Quote

In a recent systematic review of 51 observational studies assessing 25(OH)D status in obese patients undergoing bariatric surgery (follow up range: 3 months to 11 years post-operatively), mean 25-hydroxyvitamin D (25(OH)D) level was less than 30 ng/ml, before and after bariatric surgery, despite various vitamin D supplementation regimens [7]. Furthermore, 25(OH)D level was less than 20 ng/ml in half of the studies that were identified [7].   https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4792722/

 

.

 

Edited May 22, 2022 by Wheatwacked

[Georgia Dan T]

2 hours ago, Wheatwacked said:

When you next get blood drawn ask for homocysteine, vitamin D, B12 and folate. The bariatric surgery in itself can cause malnutrition. There is a pattern that high homocysteine and liver issues is an indication of low choline. The good news the minimum RDA for choline is four large eggs, or 15 ounces of steak or 10 cups of cooked broccoli every day. The maximum tolerated safe upper limit of choline is the equivalent of 25 eggs a day. (Or 77 cups of cooked broccoli 🥦)

Vitamin D Is Not as Toxic as Was Once Thought: A Historical and an Up-to-Date Perspective

Vitamin D and the Immune System - PMC (nih.gov)

 

.

 

Thanks Whacked!!

I may just paste your thoughts to the MD/patient portal to give him a heads up of what he wants to order for taking blood.