Omg...i Might Be On To Something

[dlp252]

Hey, I didnt even know there was one on Bascom! I thought the only one in the area was the one on Stevens Creek...thats where I go.

I'll have to see if the Stevens Creek store is bigger. The one I go to on Bascom is at the corner of Hamilton and Bascom. I think there's another one on Bascom in Los Gatos too.

Dani, I was just explaining how sick I used to be and what my symtoms were. I havent lost any weight and am actually still gaining a little...I'm only about 4 lbs. away from what I used to be before I got sick.

I guess I've gained about 15 lbs. the past few weeks.

I'm not so sure corn is my main problem now since I've gotten my typical reactions a couple times with no possibility of corn or gluten. My symptoms match that of MSG sensitivity *exactly*. From the very beginning I felt like I was being poisoned...I thought I had mercury toxicity but it seems it could have been MSG toxicity all this time. It just so happens that msg is in cornstarch, corn syrup, supplements, medications and almost all the other stuff related to corn and gluten processed stuff. I get severe reactions to gum and thought it was just aspartame but now I'm finding out that its more likely MSG. Aspartame causes the same reaction as msg would and they are both found in chewing gum.

Wow, I think it's fantastic you're almost at your "normal" weight!!! Your whole post really made me angry, lol. Not at you, but at the food industry. It just sucks that we can't trust what they say on their labels. I've never understood why so MANY things are put in our food.

[Green12]

Dani, I was just explaining how sick I used to be and what my symtoms were. I havent lost any weight and am actually still gaining a little...I'm only about 4 lbs. away from what I used to be before I got sick.

I guess I've gained about 15 lbs. the past few weeks.

I'm not so sure corn is my main problem now since I've gotten my typical reactions a couple times with no possibility of corn or gluten. My symptoms match that of MSG sensitivity *exactly*. From the very beginning I felt like I was being poisoned...I thought I had mercury toxicity but it seems it could have been MSG toxicity all this time. It just so happens that msg is in cornstarch, corn syrup, supplements, medications and almost all the other stuff related to corn and gluten processed stuff. I get severe reactions to gum and thought it was just aspartame but now I'm finding out that its more likely MSG. Aspartame causes the same reaction as msg would and they are both found in chewing gum.

My symptoms are different in alot of ways than a typical Celiac. I know I dont have celiac. I could have gluten intolerance, corn intolerance, MSG sensitivity or a combination of stuff. I'm following a trial msg free diet for the next couple weeks. I need to figure out exactly what the trigger is for these symptoms.

I tested out some MSG last night and this is what happened. Some stomach growling, intense pressure in my face like my head could explode, burning sensations, this morning had massive loose stools. Went to work feeling disoriented, irritable, couldnt focus and kept forgetting what I was trying to do, very blurred vision, felt drugged and uncoordinated. This is a completely different person from yesterday...yesterday I was happy, focused, my mind was sharp and I was very fast moving and productive and had normal bowels.

I'm used to these "attacks" by now and I'm always able to get through the day and have learned to live with these symptoms. Today, after doing this test, I'm realizing this could have been msg all along. I'm feeling really angry at having had to live with these symptoms and never being able to find a link....just knowing that its something in the food and supplements. I'm angry that they "disguise" MSG on the food labels....if it wasn't hidden under other names I would have been able to figure this out 3 years ago. If it is truelly not harmful to us then why do they feel the need to hide it in the ingredients?

I just found out last night what MSG is (I never knew anything about it) and I found out that they've *never* been able to *prove* that it is safe for humans but in the meantime its in all of our food. If MSG is the reason I've been sick....I am very angry.

I have always been positive about the gluten free diet and any other possible food intolerances or diets I've followed over the past year. Anyone who's read my posts knows this....I never cried about giving up gluten, possibly having celiac, going corn-free or anything else. Today I cried because MSG is something I dont have as much control over....its not something that will be easy to identify or that companies will be honest about. It doesnt matter how many people are negatively affected by it because the FDA is never going to acknowledge it. Its big money for the food and drug industries. MSG is a drug and it doesnt serve any purpose in our food....except to make money for the food industry.

Thats basically what I got out of my research last night anyway. I never found anything good about MSG...nothing about it being healthy or serving a "good" purpose....only that it harms some people and they dont know why. Yeah....so lets just make sure its in ALL of our food.

Rachel, I feel I'm kind of in the same boat as you so I am following with interest your path. I don't really know if I have celiac but I know wheat and gluten is not something I can eat on a regular basis. I've taken out almost everything at one time or another and still haven't gotten well, or even at least stable. I really don't know what kind of diet to follow because I am confused about all of the information. It's like I am to the point of being scared to eat anything so I just eat whatever and then that creates a negative outcome. I am beginning to think maybe all of the supplements I take or have taken have caused some problems because the ingredients are questionable (even thought they are suppose to be from the 'helath' or an allergy conscious industry) and that makes me angry. So I completely understand your anger.

I try to stay positive and just keep investigating everything and try different food combinations, but it gets draining and frustrating. At times I feel sorry for myself and then guilty about feeling sorry for myself. I feel really let down by the food industry, the health industry, the medical community......I know nobody but me can figure this out because nobody seems to really have any answers.

Well, anyway, I wish you luck with your search for health. I wish everybody good luck with their search for health!

[Nancym]

I've heard that sometimes they'll use some ingredient like ... remembering... hydrogolized yeast extract, which is basically MSG but it sounds less threatening.

From wikipedia

Under current FDA regulations, when MSG is added to a food, it must be identified as "monosodium glutamate" in the label's ingredient list. Each ingredient used to make a food must be declared by its name in this list.

While technically MSG is only one of several forms of free glutamate used in foods, consumers frequently use the term MSG to mean all free glutamate. The free glutamic acid component of MSG may also be present in a wide variety of other additives, including hydrolyzed vegetable proteins, hydrolyzed yeast, soy extracts, and "natural flavorings".

For this reason, FDA considers foods whose labels say "No MSG" or "No Added MSG" to be misleading if the food contains ingredients that are sources of free glutamates, such as hydrolyzed protein.

In 1993, FDA proposed adding the phrase "(contains glutamate)" to the common or usual names of certain protein hydrolysates that contain substantial amounts of glutamate. For example, if the proposal were adopted, hydrolyzed soy protein would have to be declared on food labels as "hydrolyzed soy protein (contains glutamate)." However, if FDA issues a new proposal, it would probably supersede this 1993 one.

In 1994, FDA received a citizen's petition requesting changes in labeling requirements for foods that contain MSG or related substances. The petition asks for mandatory listing of MSG as an ingredient on labels of manufactured and processed foods that contain manufactured free glutamic acid. It further asks that the amount of free glutamic acid or MSG in such products be stated on the label, along with a warning that MSG may be harmful to certain groups of people. FDA has not yet taken action on the petition.

Interesting article in Slate about MSG: Open Original Shared Link

[Rachel--24]

I've heard that sometimes they'll use some ingredient like ... remembering... hydrogolized yeast extract, which is basically MSG but it sounds less threatening.

Yeah...they generally dont put Monosodium Glutamate on the labeling....they wanna sell their product so they use innocent sounding ingredients. I've been looking into this and frankly even if its not whats making me sick (although I think it is) I'm appalled by the fact that its legal for them to do this.

Apparantly if they dont actually add MSG by itself into the product they dont have to label it....they get away with this because if its "processed" into one of the ingredients rather then "added" it doesnt have to be labeled.....so this is what they do. These are some of the ingredients which almost always means MSG.

Barley Malt

Natural flavors

Maltodextrin

Modified Food Starch

Caramel

Carageenan

Whey

Pectin

Citric Acid

Cornstarch

Corn Syrup

Brown Rice Syrup

Thats just some of them....the list is pretty extensive. I can pick up one item in the store and find several of these ingredients so how much MSG are we really unknowingly consuming??

These ingredients ALWAYS mean MSG

Gelatin

Calcium Caseinate

Sodium Caseinate

Hydrolyzed Vegetable Protien or Hydroloyzed "anything" protein

Yeast extract

Yeast nutrients

Autolyzed yeast

Well if I'm reacting to MSG...no wonder I cant eat anything.

I had probably some of my worst reactions while chewing gum everyday...eventually linked it to the aspartame in the gum but since I never ate any other foods with Aspartame I didnt think it could be related to everything I've gone through.

Now that I'm reading about MSG I found out those who are sensitive to MSG will react the same to aspartame but if the 2 are present together the reaction will be ten-fold. Well both MSG and Aspartame were in the gum so now I have to wonder if MSG wasnt my biggest problem this whole time but I just never caught on because its never freakin labeled!! I think its very misleading and downright cruel. Dont we have the right to know what we're buying and eating??

I read that *everyone* will react to MSG but at different doses. Everyones tolerance is different. They say its safe to consume 3 grams of MSG....how much is that really....and if I'm eating the "all american" diet everyday and theres "hidden" MSG in everything I eat....wouldnt I be well over 3 grams??

In case you cant tell....I'm really ticked off about this....it also says MSG is proven to disrupt the Endocrine system. Is this why I got Graves Disease too?? We'll see if I get better now that I'm free of MSG (as far as I know).

Oh yeah...I have all these supplements and foods that I've had horrible reactions to over the last year. I could never find a common link between all the different things. None have gluten, some have corn, some have dairy, some have no suspicious ingredients. Now that I've checked them for possible MSG.....every single one of them have it. Everything that has ever caused me a BAD reaction has MSG in it. Barbaras Bakery Brown Crisp Rice cereal was one of the many I could never figure out but lo and behold its got Brown Rice Syrup.

[Rachel--24]

From wikipedia

Interesting article in Slate about MSG: Open Original Shared Link

I read the article..."The best mayonaise in the world beacause it has MSG"

Yeah....thats its sole purpose. Anything with MSG is gonna taste good. They use low quality "cheap" ingredients in the food and load it up with MSG so it tastes good. From what I read MSG doesnt even have much of a taste to it but it affects the part of your brain that controls your appetite. It makes you *think* the food is good and it makes you *think* you want more....even though you've eaten enough. MSG is cheap but its basically a drug and well....hey...the food tastes good so we get addicted. No wonder I always ordered 2 big macs, a cheeseburger, large fries, 6 piece nuggets and a soda.

Its all making sense to me now. If it wasnt for the Graves Disease I'd probably have been overweight from eating like that everyday.

[miamia]

I read the article..."The best mayonaise in the world beacause it has MSG"

Yeah....thats its sole purpose. Anything with MSG is gonna taste good. They use low quality "cheap" ingredients in the food and load it up with MSG so it tastes good. From what I read MSG doesnt even have much of a taste to it but it affects the part of your brain that controls your appetite. It makes you *think* the food is good and it makes you *think* you want more....even though you've eaten enough. MSG is cheap but its basically a drug and well....hey...the food tastes good so we get addicted. No wonder I always ordered 2 big macs, a cheeseburger, large fries, 6 piece nuggets and a soda.

Its all making sense to me now. If it wasnt for the Graves Disease I'd probably have been overweight from eating like that everyday.

I have been doing some msg research as well- and the frustration you've expressed - well I more then second it!!! It is so overwhelming how many things have msg in them. I have like other people tried every diet and every combination and have not gotten better, still feeel like I am allergic to most everything- the msg thing could be the key but the idea of tryoing to figure out everywhere I could by getting is so daunting. It almost seems impossible because of negligent labeling.

Miamia

[Rachel--24]

I have been doing some msg research as well- and the frustration you've expressed - well I more then second it!!! It is so overwhelming how many things have msg in them. I have like other people tried every diet and every combination and have not gotten better, still feeel like I am allergic to most everything- the msg thing could be the key but the idea of tryoing to figure out everywhere I could by getting is so daunting. It almost seems impossible because of negligent labeling.

Miamia

I'm basically doing the "caveman" type diet to try and detox. I was eating like this for 4 months last year while I was doing the Candida diet but of course I was taking tons of supplements so wasnt really getting anywhere. I would keep trying new things because I thought I wouldnt get better w/out the supplements but I was reacting to all of them and then reacting to all the foods that were previously ok and I would just keep going up and down like that.

I was reading the posts on the MSG discussion board and its amazing how similar the experiences are to mine. I was starting to think I was the only one with all these bizarre symtoms. I'll be happy to have found an answer (if it turns out to be the key) but at the same time its very scary because we really have little control. They are even spraying the crops with it now so how can it really be avoided? I hope that someday changes are made because this is clearly a serious issue. I was talking to a co-worker today (we were sharing our health troubles) and a customer interrupted and told me that MSG can really mess us up....she said it messes with her mind and she gets severe mood changes. My Mom said someone at her gym told her that she cant have anything with MSG because it makes her feel like she's on acid and the floor starts moving and the room spinning as soon as she eats some.

Why am I just hearing all this stuff now? I seriously hadnt heard one thing about MSG this entire time I've been suffering. I wonder if theres more of it in restaraunt food because whenever I used to eat out I got WAY worse reactions. The last time I got seriously disoriented...couldnt find my boyfriend...left him at the restaraunt and tried to drive to my Mom's. I called her crying because I couldnt find my way even though I was in a very familiar area I just couldnt remember anything. I ended up in the ER that night and havent eaten out since. Everyday was a struggle for me back then and my memory was really bad...I was getting lost all the time while driving and also was running red lights and lots of other scary stuff.

Its not like that when I stay away from processed foods and restaraunts.

[miamia]

I'm basically doing the "caveman" type diet to try and detox. I was eating like this for 4 months last year while I was doing the Candida diet but of course I was taking tons of supplements so wasnt really getting anywhere. I would keep trying new things because I thought I wouldnt get better w/out the supplements but I was reacting to all of them and then reacting to all the foods that were previously ok and I would just keep going up and down like that.

I was reading the posts on the MSG discussion board and its amazing how similar the experiences are to mine. I was starting to think I was the only one with all these bizarre symtoms. I'll be happy to have found an answer (if it turns out to be the key) but at the same time its very scary because we really have little control. They are even spraying the crops with it now so how can it really be avoided? I hope that someday changes are made because this is clearly a serious issue. I was talking to a co-worker today (we were sharing our health troubles) and a customer interrupted and told me that MSG can really mess us up....she said it messes with her mind and she gets severe mood changes. My Mom said someone at her gym told her that she cant have anything with MSG because it makes her feel like she's on acid and the floor starts moving and the room spinning as soon as she eats some.

Why am I just hearing all this stuff now? I seriously hadnt heard one thing about MSG this entire time I've been suffering. I wonder if theres more of it in restaraunt food because whenever I used to eat out I got WAY worse reactions. The last time I got seriously disoriented...couldnt find my boyfriend...left him at the restaraunt and tried to drive to my Mom's. I called her crying because I couldnt find my way even though I was in a very familiar area I just couldnt remember anything. I ended up in the ER that night and havent eaten out since. Everyday was a struggle for me back then and my memory was really bad...I was getting lost all the time while driving and also was running red lights and lots of other scary stuff.

Its not like that when I stay away from processed foods and restaraunts.

God rachel your experiences are so much similar to mine the last time I ordered out and itwas the plainest thing form a restaurant with a gluten free restaurant I ende up having to go to my parents and spent the night on the floor. I am scared to go to hospitals because I always feel like whatever they'll give me will hurt me more than help me. In terms of mind and mood changes mine are so extreme. Food effects me so strongly if i eat the wrong thing I really don';t have the ability to think straght at all- or fiunction it makes it really hard to eat with people because if I ingest the wrong thing I become a different person and that person has no sense of anything.

The msg thing seems so scary because it seems almost impossible to avoid. I have been through so much I just don't know what to do anymore. I don't know wha tot cut out what to put in. Everywhere I turn it seems like someone has a different answer. I just had a new intestenal permiability test done to see if there had been any improvement - the last one I had was last septemeber and I still have bad malabsorbtion and bad leaky gut. It shows that all the supplements and dietary changes I made didn't do anything. Thats why I am even more interested int he corn or msg thing because they are the only two areas I never looked into and at this point I feel like the only things I have left to try.

What is the caveman diet?

Miamia

[Calicat]

Rachel,

I'm so sorry to hear all that you've been through and I really hope that the msg thing is the answer so that you can finally feel normal and healthy again!

I've had a lot of the same symptoms that you've listed, plus hashimoto's thyroid disease(pretty much the opposite of graves), and haven't been able to figure out why I'm not getting better. I've had to quit work and school too because I'm so sick.

You've given me hope with your posts though. I'm always trying to figure out what I'm missing, because I react to all of the substitute foods too, plus pretty much anything packaged, & all supplements and I don't even consider eating at restaurants anymore.

You mentioned face swelling, I think? That's one of the problems that I've had that seems to be a definite allergy symptom, only I can't figure out what it's from (doesn't happen when I eat gluten, even though my gluten antibodies are really high). Have you figured out if the swelling and fluid retention are from msg or corn?

I don't know about beer, but there's a brand of vodka called Chopin that is made from potatoes. It is gluten free and I'm pretty sure it's free of corn too. Not beer, but it's something

[Rachel--24]

Caveman diet is basically to eat like the cave people did.

You just basically eat fresh meat (nothing processed) veggies and fruit. Nothing processed at all. You just drink water. Cavemen didnt have processed stuff or Starbucks or foods preserved with chemicals. Have you ever done a diet like this?

I did last summer when my doctor put me on an elimination diet....the change was soooo dramatic. I had been depressed and suicidal and just acting nothing like myself...as soon as I got off the processed stuff I acted like myself again...I was actually happy again. But then I started with this vitamin and that probiotic and this herbal supplement and basically all went to h***.....although not as bad as when I was eating all the junk.

Well its been about 10 months since I went off that diet and started eating all the gluten-free processed stuff, got sicker, regrouped, avoided salicylates for awhile, got sicker, regrouped, avoided corn, didnt work...this whole time I've been on supplements and meds too.

Now I'm gonna start over like I did last Summer but WITHOUT the supplements. I eat all organic stuff but I'm not eating potatoes cuz they suppossedely spray those crops, no corn, no tomatoes, no brocolli.....those are foods that I know of that are naturally high in Glutamates. There are more but cant think of them all right now....oh yeah cheese is really high and also most milk products...I'm not eating those right now anyway cuz I'm thinking "caveman".

[jerseyangel]

Hi Rachel--Well, I'm back on the Caveman diet--this time for good! I was doing it for a while, and it made me feel much better. So--what did I do? I tried a probiotic that turned out to have lactose in it. Got sick from that, stopped, and felt better. Then I thought, why not try a little rice again? The gluten-free bread followed--and then the gluten-free goodies. Everytime I feel better, I try to go farther and add too many things back into my diet. I think I have learned the hard way that, for me, this way of eating works. Period. With it, I don't feel the need for any suppliments (except my basic multi), Previcid, or anything else. I'm just gong to keep it simple, and hope that I will finally begin to heal for good. We'll have to compare notes along the way!

[Rachel--24]

Rachel,

I'm so sorry to hear all that you've been through and I really hope that the msg thing is the answer so that you can finally feel normal and healthy again!

I've had a lot of the same symptoms that you've listed, plus hashimoto's thyroid disease(pretty much the opposite of graves), and haven't been able to figure out why I'm not getting better. I've had to quit work and school too because I'm so sick.

You've given me hope with your posts though. I'm always trying to figure out what I'm missing, because I react to all of the substitute foods too, plus pretty much anything packaged, & all supplements and I don't even consider eating at restaurants anymore.

You mentioned face swelling, I think? That's one of the problems that I've had that seems to be a definite allergy symptom, only I can't figure out what it's from (doesn't happen when I eat gluten, even though my gluten antibodies are really high). Have you figured out if the swelling and fluid retention are from msg or corn?

I don't know about beer, but there's a brand of vodka called Chopin that is made from potatoes. It is gluten free and I'm pretty sure it's free of corn too. Not beer, but it's something

Thanks for your post.

I dont know how I could possibly give anyone hope with my ongoing "saga" but I'm happy to hear it.

I never could figure out the face swelling thing either. Its one of my worst symptoms and noone on the Thyroid board had this problem, noone on the candida board, noone on the Celiac board and on and on.

I couldnt figure out what the heck this is all about....surely someone must know what the heck I'm experiencing....along with the burning, numbness, tingling and everything else. Nobody has chemical sensitivities like I do either.

When I found the MSG board I saw that everyone on there has the same symptoms. They have swelling heads too!! The way they describe what their reactions are like is *exactly* my experience. Also swelling of the face hands and feet is frequently listed as a main symptom on all the MSG sites I've looked at. One girl described it like a balloon expanding in her head....thats what it feels like to me....or like something is pushing so hard on my face...it might burst. Not fun at all.

The other big unexplainable symptom I have is fluid retention...and sometimes LOTS of it...but noone can really see it cuz I'm small. I get it everywhere but especially in my face. It actually made me appear healthier when I had lost all my weight cuz it was masking the weight loss. The people with MSG sensitivity experience this as a symptom as well....I know lots of things can cause fluid but no reason has ever been found for mine and its been over 3 years now.

[penguin]

My doctor told me that if everyone would just eat meat and vegetables, nobody would ever get sick.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, my Dr. is a smart woman!

[jerseyangel]

My doctor told me that if everyone would just eat meat and vegetables, nobody would ever get sick.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, my Dr. is a smart woman!

Smart woman, indeed

[Guest BERNESES]

rachel- I hope this is the answer for you- lord knows you've been trying to figure it out for long enough! i am amazed by your strength and resourcefulness.

[dlp252]

potatoes cuz they suppossedely spray those crops, no corn, no tomatoes, no brocolli

Well, there's a huge chunk of my diet, lol. I don't eat a lot of potatoes or corn, but I do eat a lot of things that have them "in" it and I eat a ton of brocolli and some tomatoes, lol.

[Green12]

I've had a lot of the same symptoms that you've listed, plus hashimoto's thyroid disease(pretty much the opposite of graves), and haven't been able to figure out why I'm not getting better. I've had to quit work and school too because I'm so sick.

You've given me hope with your posts though. I'm always trying to figure out what I'm missing, because I react to all of the substitute foods too, plus pretty much anything packaged, & all supplements and I don't even consider eating at restaurants anymore.

You mentioned face swelling, I think? That's one of the problems that I've had that seems to be a definite allergy symptom, only I can't figure out what it's from (doesn't happen when I eat gluten, even though my gluten antibodies are really high). Have you figured out if the swelling and fluid retention are from msg or corn?

Hi Calicat,

I have the severe face swelling too with my allergic reactions. Every healthcare professional I ever went to never knew what it was from, like it is some big mystery. So basically since they don't know what it is or how to go about treatring it I have found they ignore it. My face will swell so much that I don't recognize myself in the mirror, and the more I eat the foods that I react to the more the swelling goes up. I also have massive body swelling all over every inch of me, along with the face, hands, and feet, to where it's like I have gained enormous amounts of weight in a very very very short amount time. Also, my inside organs feel swollen when this is happening, and they hurt, and I can't breathe and I am swollen and irritated the entire length of the digestive tract all the way from the esophagus and tongue and lips with sores in the mouth to the very other end. And a lot of times my skin will burn and my feet will burn, and I get so dehydrated. It is so frustrating when it seems like nobody else knows what it is and there doesn't seem to be anything you can do about it except wait it out.

I also have followed Rachel's trials and have gotten a lot of good information. Eliminating corn did seem to work initially for me but basically I was just eating fresh organic meats, fresh fruits, and fresh vegetable, nothing packaged and nothing processed. Then as soon as I would eat something from a package or processed I would get my symptoms back. So I was probably clearing out MSG unknowingly (and probably alot of other harmful ingredients)

[danikali]

I find this very interesting.....

I had peanut butter the other day....for the first time in a while, and I got some stomach discomfort. Nowhere near what I would get before, but enough to know that the peanut butter wasn't good for me. This also happened when I ate some cashew butter, and also a little bit if I tried ANY supplement. So I looked up the 'caveman diet' and the only thing on there that is under the 'bad' list is the rice, which I'll have lots of rice cakes in a day and it doesn't seem to bother me at all. Everything else is a no go for me. The corn problem makes sense, but I have a feeling that I just CANNOT tolerate any kind of additives, peanuts or cashews, period. Anyway, I noticed Rachel that you said something about broccoli not being good. May I ask why not? I've been buying fresh broccoli that is labled organic, and it doesn't seem to bother me. Of course I wash it like CRAZY, literally little piece by little piece, I either hold it (without hurting myself) under scorching water, or I put the little piece in the strainer and I keep each there for a while, turning it over and over. I'm so paranoid of any kind of anything that the manufactorers might have sprayed on it.........

So anyway, that's my question for the day: is broccoli bad for some reason?

[Mango04]

I find this very interesting.....

I had peanut butter the other day....for the first time in a while, and I got some stomach discomfort. Nowhere near what I would get before, but enough to know that the peanut butter wasn't good for me. This also happened when I ate some cashew butter, and also a little bit if I tried ANY supplement. So I looked up the 'caveman diet' and the only thing on there that is under the 'bad' list is the rice, which I'll have lots of rice cakes in a day and it doesn't seem to bother me at all. Everything else is a no go for me. The corn problem makes sense, but I have a feeling that I just CANNOT tolerate any kind of additives, peanuts or cashews, period. Anyway, I noticed Rachel that you said something about broccoli not being good. May I ask why not? I've been buying fresh broccoli that is labled organic, and it doesn't seem to bother me. Of course I wash it like CRAZY, literally little piece by little piece, I either hold it (without hurting myself) under scorching water, or I put the little piece in the strainer and I keep each there for a while, turning it over and over. I'm so paranoid of any kind of anything that the manufactorers might have sprayed on it.........

So anyway, that's my question for the day: is broccoli bad for some reason?

I think she's saying broccoli contains naturally occuring glutamates? I don't think it has anything to do with anything that's added or sprayed on. Sorry to butt in, but I've been following this thread b/c I find it really interesting!

[danikali]

I think she's saying broccoli contains naturally occuring glutamates? I don't think it has anything to do with anything that's added or sprayed on. Sorry to butt in, but I've been following this thread b/c I find it really interesting!

what is a glutamate and how could it be bad? (I know, this really is a good thread....probably benefits most people on this site!)

[Mango04]

what is a glutamate and how could it be bad? (I know, this really is a good thread....probably benefits most people on this site!)

Well here's one definition:

The glutamate in monosodium glutamate is not identical to the glutamate found in plants and animals. The glutamate in monosodium glutamate contains L-glutamic acid, D-glutamic acid, pyroglutamic acid and other contaminants. But there is no D-glutamic acid, pyroglutamic acid, or other contaminants in the protein found in plants and animals. The glutamate in plants and animals is L-glutamic acid, only. (See Open Original Shared Link

Simply stated, truly natural glutamate is L-glutamic acid, only. Processed, fermented, or manufactured glutamate contains L-glutamic acid plus other chemicals.

Open Original Shared Link

[Calicat]

Rachel and Julie,

I can't tell you how comforting it is to know that someone else on this planet has had these strange symptoms! I've had such a hard time trying to figure out the cause, and whenever I go to an md they dismiss the face swelling and fluid retention as unimportant.

I'm pretty small boned, but sometimes I swell up so much that I can literally put on 10 pounds or more overnight. Of course, that's when people who don't know me think I look 'healthy' because my weight is higher. It is so frustrating/painful/depressing.

This msg thing is sounding really promising, and so is the caveman diet. Practically the only time I'm okay is when I eat extremely limited--specific fruits, vegetables and tea and sometimes a little fish. i'm not even sure about yogurt anymore although i seem to be fine with brie cheese if i only have it once in a while(who knows why?!) and i'd love to find out that some dairy is okay!!

Thanks for sharing your stories and your new discoveries. It's helping a lot. And i'll definitely be following this thread closely! I hope that you both start to feel really well soon! It's way past time, right?!

[Rachel--24]

rachel- I hope this is the answer for you- lord knows you've been trying to figure it out for long enough! i am amazed by your strength and resourcefulness.

Thanks Berneses...you're always very supportive...it does help.

Jersey,

Definately keep posting on how the caveman thing is going for you. Everytime I start to feel better I start adding new stuff and its the same old story. Now that I know about MSG I dont think I'll be adding anything processed for a long time. I really dont think I'm reacting to any actual foods but more likely whats *in* the foods. Even when I was at my worst and took the IgG food intolerance test (over like 100 foods tested) I was negative for everything except a very low reaction to banana and some spices. My doctor was actually shocked at the results....she was wondering if they'd given her the wrong persons results. I was reacting to *everything* back then. I've read more than once that most people who are reacting to foods are actually reacting to the additives and not the foods themselves. I had looked into it a little but never noticed a common ingredient on the stuff I reacted bad to....well thats probably cuz MSG was disguised under different names in every one of them. I think I'm gonna do ok on the diet....the hard part will be staying on it when I feel good. I always seem to forget how bad it can get and how fast it can happen. It takes me a week or 2 to start recovering and thats only if I stop doing whatever it was I did to start the reaction in the first place.

[Green12]

Welcome Calicat, and Mango you are not butting in, we are all in this together and we have to figure out what we all can do to get well!!

I just only today started looking on the net for info about MSG and here is the MSG trial test diet that might be helpful to anyone who is interested:

Eat the following foods for at least 1 week and judge for yourself if excitotoxin (MSG, Aspartame, L-cysteine) enhanced foods are causing your health problems. Stop taking vitamins, supplements, protein drinks, protein bars, soy products, or protein products of any kind. If possible, stop taking over-the-counter medications and prescribed medications unless they are absolutely necessary during this period. Many fillers, binders, coatings, and gelcaps contain sources of glutamate. Avoid all candies, chips, crackers, ice cream, and processed snacks. Drink only water, organic whole milk (unless dairy intolerent), and Rice Dream rice beverage (plain original variety in blue box). Avoid coffee and tea for now.

Eat the following when hungry and/or at meal times.

1. Cooked brown rice.

Place 5 cups of short grain brown rice in large pot with 10 cups water, 1 teaspoon salt, and 1 teaspoon cane sugar. Bring to a boil and reduce heat to lowest setting, cover, and let cook 40 minutes. If you must use white rice, rinse very well to remove starch or glucose coating (glutamate sources) and cook as described for only 20 minutes. Store covered in refrigerator and eat with milk (cinnamon and cane sugar on top is good as breakfast or snack. Or eat warm with butter, pepper, and salt (kosher or canning salt only) with meals, or mixed with sauteed vegetables.

2. Eggs - no egg substitutes.

These can be cooked any way using butter (cream and salt only). For less cholesterol, use the whites, making an omelet. Olive oil or coconut oil may also be used in any sauteeing.

3. Vegetables - Avoid potatoes, carrots, and beets for now.

Some are sprayed with Auxigro, a metabolic primer consisting of 30% glutamate. But do eat fresh greens - spinach, romaine (not iceberg), cabbage, broccoli, collards, and any organic fresh or frozen vegetables (if nothing has been added to frozen products.)

If not organic, wash vegetables in bowl of luke warm sudsy (Dawn) water and rinse well to remove waxes and sprays.

Other good produce are squash of any kind, cauliflower, sweet potaoes, avacodos, and celery. Tomatoes and mushrooms are quite high in natural glutamate, so eat sparingly for now. Vetetables can be eaten raw, steamed, baked, and sauteed.

4. Fruits - Eat only fresh fruits.

Peel apples and pears. Avoid fresh grapes and berries right now. Some are treated with Auxigro or sulfites, preservatives that many MSG sensitive people react to (covered in book).

5. Meat - Fresh turkey or chicken.

Use nothing frozen or treated with broth (MSG) solutions. Ask butcher if poultry is additive and preservative free. I do okay with Foster Farms boneless chicken breasts, wings, and legs. If in doubt, avoid meats during ths time. Do not eat canned or processed meats, sausages or cold cuts of any kind. The word here is fresh everything for now.

6. Cheese - Mild Colby/Jack and Mozzarella only.

7. Bread - Avoid for now.

8. Toothpaste - Use baking soda.

This is not typical of our diet. We have many choices that you can learn about, but during this time, the newcomers lack information about the hundreds of sources of hidden MSG. This diet is safe and easy to follow.

[Rachel--24]

what is a glutamate and how could it be bad? (I know, this really is a good thread....probably benefits most people on this site!)

Dani,

Mango gave a good description. Basically I'm trying to eliminate MSG since I seem to be hypersensitive to it. Glutamate occurs naturally in some foods but its not the really harmful stuff. When they take glutamate from a natural source and process it its no longer the same....it becomes more like a powerful drug. I read a good comparison on another site. It said its kinda like if you drank tea from coca leaves all day long it wont affect you in a negative way but when they take the coca leaves and process them into cocaine....its no longer the same thing. They *tell* us MSG is safe cuz it came from a natural source and they label it under many things including "natural flavors". Truely theres nothing *natural* about it.

Ooops I got sidetracked on my rant again....anyways the people who become hyper sensitive to MSG will also sometimes react to the small amounts of "free" glutamate in natural foods. Its the free stuff that causes problems and after glutamate is processed in any way....it becomes MSG....the "bad" stuff.

For someone having problems like I've had or a very "reactive" system should avoid the natural glutamates in early stages so the body can detox because its basically already overloaded with MSG. I figure if I wanna see if theres really anything to this MSG then I better avoid all the bad stuff for now and broccolli has higher levels of glutamate.....also tomatoes. You cant develop a sensitivity to MSG from eating these natural foods though....it comes from the pure MSG in the processed foods.

Originally MSG was made from seaweed...nowadays its either from beets or corn. Corn is high in glutamate as well....soooo in the beginning of this thread I thought I was corn intolerant but it could actually be the MSG. Thats what I'm trying to find out.