What's The Deal With Soy?

[ATX]

I have noticed from reading a few posts that many of the members of this forum are soy-free and I would like to know what might be a problem with soy products. I eat tofu almost every day--a cheap and I thought healthy way to increase protein, notably tryptophan, in a diet.

I have heard of the theory that soy may interfere with thyroid activity, but are there other reasons? If one is allergic to soy, what is the culprit in the soy bean that causes the problems? Also, what tend to be the symptoms of soy intolerance/allergy/....?

Have a great weekend.

[Tim-n-VA]

Soy alone is not a problem due to celiac.

Some confusion comes from the fact that many brands of soy sauce have wheat.

Many diseases/conditions occur in clusters so it is not unusual for someone who has a problem with gluten to have problems with other items which could include soy.

There was at least one member in the past who insisted her medical provider told her that no celiacs should have soy but no independent verification was provided.

[ATX]

Hi Tim,

Well I'm assuming some people in the forum have gone off soy for reasons other than that soy products might be contaminated with wheat or gluten. Those reasons are what I am interested in knowing more about, if anyone cares to divulge.

[happygirl]

There are some people (Celiacs, and non-Celiac gluten sensitive people) who have multiple food intolerances on this board.

Soy is one of the top 8 allergens.

[RiceGuy]

Some people feel soy is bad, and others feel it is good. I have no doubt that the debate will rage on for a long time to come. Soy is a legume, which is one reason some need to avoid it. Perhaps the best advice I have on this is that if soy (or anything else for that mater) bothers you, then don't eat it. If you aren't sure, keep a food journal, and try with and without soy for a few weeks each and see if there are any noticeable differences in how you feel.

[GFinDC]

Sorry, I know this isn't a direct answer to your question about reactions, but I thought it might be interesting anyway. I avoid soy because of the thyroid effects. I don't think there is any doubt about the negative effect of soy on the thyroid. But there are other negative aspects too. For instance, did you know it is not good for rats? Here is an article describing some possible problems with soy, at least for rats. Don't feed it to your rats! Poor things!

Open Original Shared Link

"As early as 1917 researchers noted that soybeans had to be heat-treated in order for soy-fed rats to grow--presumably because soy contains a substance that inhibits digestion."

This one talks about soy impairing intestinal cell growth in infants. Basically raisies the concern that infant formulas with soy might need to be reconsidered. So I guess maybe we shouldn't feed it to babies either.

Open Original Shared Link

"Sharon Donovan show that the soy isoflavone genistein, in amounts present in commercial soy infant formulas, may inhibit intestinal cell growth in babies."

[ATX]

Thanks GFinDC for those links. The first article especially spells out a lot of the areas I had questions about. I suppose I will give miso or tempeh a go and see if I notice any substantial difference in energy or digestion. Alas, I have no rats to test on

I was fed with an infant formula and I would be interested to know what was in that stuff. I have had bad allergies all my life, not just to foods.

[white ridges]

  ATX said:

I have noticed from reading a few posts that many of the members of this forum are soy-free and I would like to know what might be a problem with soy products. I eat tofu almost every day--a cheap and I thought healthy way to increase protein, notably tryptophan, in a diet.

I have heard of the theory that soy may interfere with thyroid activity, but are there other reasons? If one is allergic to soy, what is the culprit in the soy bean that causes the problems? Also, what tend to be the symptoms of soy intolerance/allergy/....?

Have a great weekend.

[white ridges]

Before I was officially diagnosed as gluten intolerant, I suspected that soy was an issue as well. I knew that wheat was a problem for me and was avoiding that ,so when a little cup of miso soup caused me to bloat, I figured that soy should be off my list too. As it turns out, I later tested reactive to gluten, casein, soy, eggs and dairy. I also have figured out from trial and error that peanuts and the nightshade family do not work well for me either. I love fruit, but my body can't tolerate too much of that either--too much sugar, I guess.

This is what I have read about soy: many people believe that those people who CAN eat soy should only consume FERMENTED soy products and not just anything soy.

[raen]

i am becoming very concerned about soy as well - as a baby i hurled up every formula containing milk/casein, and accepted soy. i like the taste of soy, and only drink silk which is a seemingly reliable brand, as well, i love plain tofu be it raw, in miso, or mixed with a vegetable stir fry. but if so many people with gluten & casein allergies alike cant have soy.. is that a sign of problems? where else are we supposed to get calcium? are there any Benefits of soy or is it all bad?

[RiceGuy]

  raen said:

i am becoming very concerned about soy as well - as a baby i hurled up every formula containing milk/casein, and accepted soy. i like the taste of soy, and only drink silk which is a seemingly reliable brand, as well, i love plain tofu be it raw, in miso, or mixed with a vegetable stir fry. but if so many people with gluten & casein allergies alike cant have soy.. is that a sign of problems? where else are we supposed to get calcium? are there any Benefits of soy or is it all bad?

Lots of veggies have calcium. Since the digestion of animal proteins depletes calcium up to three times faster than vegetable proteins, it makes sense to me to get calcium from veggies. You can search Open Original Shared Link to get a comprehensive list.

[GFinDC]

Hi ATX,

Just FYI,

There is another thread on this topic

Forum

Celiac Disease - Related Disorders & Research

Topic

Soy Intolerance, how do you react?

Open Original Shared Link

They haven't made the rat connection yet. But lots of people have posted about their reactions to soy there.

[ATX]

Thankfully it looks like I am not allergic to soy, going by the symptoms people have mentioned in that thread GFinDC posted. I found another, if controversial, thread on the soy issue:

Open Original Shared Link

Still I am concerned about the possible mineral deficiencies and hormone disruption that soy may trigger, especially since I have been eating a few tablespoons of tofu a day. I doubt it causes any digestion problems--if we trust the rat study--as tofu is treated with high heat during processing. Is there any test to measure proper hormone balance??

I'll second RiceGuy on the importance of green vegetables for calcium. Since I avoid dairy whenever possible, I mostly get mine from spinach and broccoli. Raen, you can also find good nutritional information on many foods, including soy ones, here:

Open Original Shared Link

The page on soybeans lists several health-promoting factors in soy. I am starting to feel a little dizzy!

So the question then becomes, for those who like soy and are not allergic to it, how much is too much?

For White Ridges: the miso you ate may have contained gluten via barley and even wheat. Btw, what kind of test did you take to see if were reactive to certain foods?

[missy'smom]

  white ridges said:

Before I was officially diagnosed as gluten intolerant, I suspected that soy was an issue as well. I knew that wheat was a problem for me and was avoiding that ,so when a little cup of miso soup caused me to bloat, I figured that soy should be off my list too. As it turns out, I later tested reactive to gluten, casein, soy, eggs and dairy. I also have figured out from trial and error that peanuts and the nightshade family do not work well for me either. I love fruit, but my body can't tolerate too much of that either--too much sugar, I guess.

This is what I have read about soy: many people believe that those people who CAN eat soy should only consume FERMENTED soy products and not just anything soy.

Bloat from miso can, as another poster pointed out, be from gluten. The bacteria that is used in the fermentation of miso is often grown on barley or wheat, It is not, technically an ingredient so is not required to be labeled. You can contact the manufacturer and ask if the koji(starter culture) is grown on a gluten containing grain. Separately, there is a mugi miso(barley miso) where the grain is incorporated into the miso itself but it is an ingredient then and will be on the label. This is not a common kind of miso though. There are some misos that are started on rice.

[GFinDC]

This page talks about carbohydrates in soy that can't be digested by the human gut. So they cause GI sypmtoms when the bacteria get happy with all that carbohydrate to eat. Seems this perosn wrote a book on it. I haven't read the book.

Open Original Shared Link

Quote below from

"THE WHOLE SOY STORY" by Kaayla T. Daniel, PhD

"THE TWO STOOGES: RAF AND STACH

The chief culprit, as with all beans, is the oligosaccharides in the carbohydrate portion. The word oligosaccharides comes from oligo (few) and saccharides (sugars). The best known oligosaccharides in beans are raffinose and stachyose. They require the enzyme alpha-galactosidase to be digested properly. Unfortunately, humans and other mammals do not come so equipped."

[hawaiimama]

oh reading this is giving me a stomach ache. I seem to be able to eat fermented soy in small quantities but anything with any substatial amount I feel horrid. I've know about this for years. I have no overt celiac symptoms but I suspect I feel how a lot of you feel when you eat wheat when I eat soy.

I made some brownies for the first time the other day with soy flour. I thought, I've been wheat free for close to two months, so maybe I'd be albe to eat soy again. NOPE. Off to read the other thread...

[ATX]

That makes sense GFinDC. Beans in general, I suppose, are the #1 gas-producing foods. Perhaps if soy causes excessive gas and bloating, dysbiosis rather than an allergy may be the issue. Those interested might want to do a "dysbiosis" search in the forum--I remember seeing at least one thread on that topic.

My heart goes out to all the multiple food intolerance sufferers. Do look into the leaky gut/dysbiosis threads for some clues, about how to respond and get back your health. (Not that I am a doctor, just a reader amazed by how much some people on this board know about these kinds of illnesses).

[glutenfreenewbie]

Hi,

I've never been able to tolerate fake dairy that's soy based. I get a pretty quick and nasty digestive reaction to it, especially soy 'butter' or soy 'cream'. white ridges is right - fermented is the key. My Naturopath warned me only to consume fermented organic soy products such as tofu, miso, tempeh, etc. and that the other processed stuff - the milk, the fake meat and so on is terrible for you.

Weston Price/Dr. Mercola is a good source of information on it. Soy has anti-nutrients, isoflavones that can interfere with hormones and thyroid that only get eliminated when fermented properly.

-I.