Cross Contamination - The Bane Of My Life!

[Greebo115]

So, I'm nearly 8 months gluten-free.....and I am STILL finding new ways to gluten myself, grrrrrr!

 

My question is: if I have been (unknowingly), soaking and cooking CC'd dried beans (I know this for sure, now...after many mysterious glutenings and finding they are packed on the same lines as gluten products inc. wheat flour!) in my slow cooker, which has a metal, non-stick pot......is the pot now glutening me? (I bought this after going gluten free, so thought it was gluten-free).

 

I'm sitting here with champion brain-fog and a painful, growing, noisy stomach after eating left-over "super-safe" beef stew (only fresh carrots, celery, shin beef, herbs from my garden, homemade chicken stock from carcass) for breakfast, that was cooked in my slow cooker - I felt clear before eating it........moan moan, I'm sick of this!

[cahill]

The chicken stock ( home made or not ) would get me . For some reason I can tolerate turkey but not chicken .

 

 

Give your slow cooker  a good cleaning and it should be fine

[1desperateladysaved]

Sigh,  Do you think it is possible you are having random withdrawal symptoms?  In the beginning of my diet experience, I couldn't always figure it out.  Also, after l year sometimes I really can't be sure what I am reacting to.

 

Are  there any scratches in the metal of the crock pot?

 

One other consideration,  Could you have intolerances to another food in the stew?

 

D

[Greebo115]

The chicken stock ( home made or not ) would get me . For some reason I can tolerate turkey but not chicken .

 

 

Give your slow cooker  a good cleaning and it should be fine

Hmmm, I've always thought chicken was one of my safe foods.....

And, yes, I already gave the pot a thorough clean - as far as one can with non-stick...

[cahill]

Hmmm, I've always thought chicken was one of my safe foods.....

And, yes, I already gave the pot a thorough clean - as far as one can with non-stick...

It took my elimination diet for me to realize that chicken was an issue . I , like you, thought it was a safe food.

My suggestion would be to eliminate chicken ( including the  broth) from your diet for a week or two and then try it again. If not a problem it will reassure you it is a  totally safe  food .

[Greebo115]

Sigh,  Do you think it is possible you are having random withdrawal symptoms?  In the beginning of my diet experience, I couldn't always figure it out.  Also, after l year sometimes I really can't be sure what I am reacting to.

 

Are  there any scratches in the metal of the crock pot?

 

One other consideration,  Could you have intolerances to another food in the stew?

 

D

Not sure about the random withdrawal....thought I'd left that far behind.....

Yes, there are plenty of scratches on the crock pot.......

I don't think it can be more intolerances......I already have plenty! I'd purposely made the stew out of safe ingredients because of a recent glutening...(the cc'd beans), so it might be flare of symptoms from that.....but I really don't want to continue to add to the problems with contaminated cookware....OTOH it would be an expensive hassle to replace the crock pot every time I suspect cc......

[1desperateladysaved]

Being a farmer, I know that chickens are more inclined to eat grain and turkeys like to eat bugs and grass and very little grain.  Our poultry eat wheat! .  Ours are also on pasture of grass and clover which they like.   I stay away from their feed.  I rinse them well in cold water before eating

 

I tried not eating chicken for a while and have been fine when I began eating it again.    I make chicken broth with the leftovers and do not have a problem.  Chicken is a good food; keep it in your diet if you can.  Avoid it if you must.

 

D

[cahill]

.  Chicken is a good food; keep it in your diet if you can.  Avoid it if you must.

 

D

I agree ,,, No food should be eliminated from ones diet unless it is detrimental to ones health and well being .

I for one worked long and hard to determine  what was safe for me to eat and what was not. it is a tedious process but for some of us it  is required to regain our health .

[dilettantesteph]

Cross contamination is a big issue for me too.  I don't think that a tiny bit of cc from pot that cooked something with a tiny bit of cc would be an issue, but I could be wrong.  It was not my experience that scratched non stick cookware was a source of cc.  I also have had problems with chicken.  It is inconsistent with me.  Sometimes I could eat it without problems, and sometimes I could not. 

 

I am sensitive to extremely low levels of gluten and avenin.

 

I found a farmer who does a batch of corn, soy. oat and gluten free chicken each year for another customer.  I think I'll try some of that.  She also butchers them herself and explained the process to me and it sounded more humane with less cc possibilities than what happens in the big facilities. 

 

I also recommend elimination/challenge dieting.  I also don't think that you should eliminate it unless you find out that it is a problem.  

[Mr. GF in Indiana]

Sympathies for your suffering...somehow, it seems like we largely suffer alone, doesn't it? 

 

I bought wheat-gluten test kits at $15 each, and after screwing up using the first one, read the directions more carefully.

 

I found no cross contamination of gluten in any product that "shared facilities" with a wheat product line.  So before you

give up on an important food, it may be worth a few bucks to test it, and that means you may have other sensitivities or food issues

you can discover or improve on. 

 

I tested three different rice brands from Thailand; no gluten found (wheat gluten, I mean).   Even so, I have now gotten

so doggone nervous I spend the extra few bucks a month and bought certified "gluten free" rice at my local gluten free

store.   Whole foods has been stocking more gluten free products, but my son, looking at their pricing, calls them "Whole Paycheck".

 

Now, finding where corn and corn starch is hidden...that has been a whole other difficulty, and I haven't found a test kit

for sorghum that is reasonably priced, and it's in many wheat-gluten free foods now.    

 

 

[HumanDecency]

How far in did you leave the withdrawal symptoms behind?

 

 

Not sure about the random withdrawal....thought I'd left that far behind.....

Yes, there are plenty of scratches on the crock pot.......

I don't think it can be more intolerances......I already have plenty! I'd purposely made the stew out of safe ingredients because of a recent glutening...(the cc'd beans), so it might be flare of symptoms from that.....but I really don't want to continue to add to the problems with contaminated cookware....OTOH it would be an expensive hassle to replace the crock pot every time I suspect cc......

[notme]

if you're worried about the crock pot, they sell liners for them - that's what i use in mine - i wasn't sure about the crock, it is ceramic and we used it to cook gluten-y things before i was dx'd.  

 

i glutened myself alot in the first year, i am sure!  also, things in particular brands/certain foods were still hard to digest because my intestines were damaged (still are, i'm sure, but they feel better and better the longer i stay gluten-free)  so i kept a food journal.  even if there was not gluten in things i was eating, for some reason or another i had trouble digesting them.  also discovered a secondary sensitivity to soy <man, that stuff is EVERYWHERE - if i eat too much of it i have a 'fake' gluten reaction.  headache, neck ache, fatigue, etc not to mention 'D' - but it doesn't last as long as long as when i get glutened.  food journal is your friend when you're trying to figure out what's been getting you.  and write down everything that crosses your lips

[Pegleg84]

If you were glutened recently (and over a period of time, since you say it took a while to figure out what was up with the beans) then it could be that you're still recovering from that. I find I have trouble with perfectly safe foods for a week or so after getting glutened. Digestive enzymes might help you out.

If it keeps up though, try not using your crock pot for a while. If that makes a difference, get a new crock pot, or a liner for it or something. If it doesn't, try an elimination diet to see if something else is bothering you.

 

(soy is the bane of my existence. even tiny amounts of that can get me. no fun)

 

good luck!

[cahill]

If you were glutened recently (and over a period of time, since you say it took a while to figure out what was up with the beans) then it could be that you're still recovering from that. I find I have trouble with perfectly safe foods for a week or so after getting glutened. Digestive enzymes might help you out.

If it keeps up though, try not using your crock pot for a while. If that makes a difference, get a new crock pot, or a liner for it or something. If it doesn't, try an elimination diet to see if something else is bothering you.

 

(soy is the bane of my existence. even tiny amounts of that can get me. no fun)

 

good luck!

Soy is evil ,Just plain EVIL I say

[notme]

Soy is evil ,Just plain EVIL I say

sneaky, too.  i make all my own salad dressings because it's so hard to find prepackaged without the dreaded soy!  for hershey chocolate bars and mayo, i suck it up and suffer lolz - but not that often!!

[Greebo115]

Thanks everyone, I've been reading your replies throughout the day. but couldn't muster the brain power to communicate, lol.

Feeling clear at the moment, so here goes:

dilettantesteph - I agree that an elimination diet is a good way to weed out problems....I've already done that to find the intolerances listed in my signature....and I always revert back to my basic safe-foods after a glutening. Usually that's homemade from fresh ingredients chicken and veg soup, or beef and veg stew, both slow cooked to aid digestion.

 

Mr gluten-free in Indiana - I've never seen any testing kits here in the UK.....however, I have no doubt that the dried products that I was buying from this company were cc'd. I thought I was being clever getting my dried goods in large packs, cheaply from an Asian supermarket. The companies are called "Supreme" for the beans, and "Rajah" for the spices.

Whilst I was washing the beans, several times I thought "wow, these beans are so dusty and dirty", and I have kept a food diary for the last 5 years (yeah I did it pre-gluten-free, to help me lose weight, I used to be 278 pounds, now 138!) - I thought I had a legume intolerance, but I actually was only reacting to beans from this company.....and I also know they pack flours in the same line/facilities - there is even a warning on the packet. The warning wasn't always there (I checked), and when I noticed it I thought "ah well, it only means there's a chance of cc....I'd have to be unlucky to get caught"....but I have now reacted to their cashews (twice), but not to cashews from Sainsburiys, (I love Sainsbury's labelling policies, they say they will always label their own brand products if there is any cc that is not evident from the ingredients list!!!),also kidney beans, chickpeas, red lentils, tapioca pearls, rice flour, corn meal and various spices including turmeric....also, I purposely looked for a curry powder that was gluten-free, theirs said it had besan (chickpea) flour, so I thought it was safe - wrong! After reacting several times, I saw, hidden in the bottom corner of the bag, after the several different translations of the ingredients list was: contains wheat - What? But it wasn't listed in the ingredients!

 

Humandecency - it's hard to say when the withdrawals stopped, because they were mixed up with accidental glutenings - no matter how clean you think you're eating at first, there is bound to be a multitude of places gluten is still hiding! lol. I felt amazing for the first 2 weeks, then it got messy.

 

Notme! - Do you mean a lining to go inside the current "bowl" in the crock pot, or do you mean a new "bowl", I.e. on mine it is a metal non-stick one, I bought it specally coz you can start it off on the stove, then put in back into the slowcooker.....I used to have a ceramic one....which I wouldn't have worried about cc with, sheesh. And yeah, I always keep a food diary.....and I'm with you on the "fake" glutenings....but they wear off quickly.....my glutenings last for 3 weeks! (Bloat, digestive discomfort, SEVERE brain fog (I can't even speak, let alone think), joint pain, "C", insomnia, fever, blood sugar swings etc.

 

Pegleg - I think you are right.....I started to wonder a few hours ago it this was  just a continuation of the glutenings I've had.....now that I can actually type this text, I'm pretty sure you are right (although I'm making good use of spell check, and it's taking ages, lol)...I'm still going to be cautious of that crockpot (it's less than 4 mths old!).....I'm going to avoid using it for, well, quite a while, lol.

 

Also, I'd just like to say, although I don't post much...I wouldn't be where I am today if I hadn't found this forum - you are all wonderful! I was so sick 4 years ago that I had to leave my job as a teacher in college. Then I worked self-employed doing something else from home...but a lot of days I couldn't work at all.....nowadays I'm well much more often than I am ill!!!

Thank you. x

[notme]

greebo - here in the us, reynolds makes plastic liners to go inside the crock - like a heat resistant baggie, made from the same stuff that oven bags are made of i think.  

 

peg has a good point - my glutenings last for 14 DAYS not 12, not 13.....   during that time, all bets are off and even the 'safest' things make my symptoms flare.  yay...    if yours last for 3 eeks, chances are it's just residual reactions.  

 

haha 3 eeks - i think i'll leave that - seems appropriate

[Adalaide]

The liners are awesome, I love them for when I just don't feel up to being able to clean up after myself. I never saw a metal crock pot insert, but I can see how it would be convenient. I just do my meat on the stove if I want to sear it before I throw it in the pot, it only takes a few minutes and it isn't a big deal to wash a pan.

 

Open Original Shared Link

[Greebo115]

 

greebo - here in the us, reynolds makes plastic liners to go inside the crock - like a heat resistant baggie, made from the same stuff that oven bags are made of i think.  

 

peg has a good point - my glutenings last for 14 DAYS not 12, not 13.....   during that time, all bets are off and even the 'safest' things make my symptoms flare.  yay...    if yours last for 3 eeks, chances are it's just residual reactions.  

 

haha 3 eeks - i think i'll leave that - seems appropriate

 

ha ha ha, yes....3 eeks!

 

I'm like I was hit by a truck for the first 3 days, then each day I get to feel a shade better, after a week I'm back to about half my mental powers, but it's 3 weeks until I'm 100%. I notice the mental part the most because it really affects my job - my whole job is thinking/writing and problem solving. If I attempt to work in the first week, I just have to spend the next 2 weeks trying to put right the rubbish I produced!

 

I definitely want some of those liners! I hope I can find them here, it might me that my local supermarket has them, I didn't know they existed!!! Thanks for the link Adalaide

[bartfull]

A metal non-stick pot - that means it's some sort of Teflon, right? And you said it's scratched. That IS your source of CC. Gluten hides in those scratches and can't be cleaned out. Any scratched Teflon pans that have ever had gluten in them will CC you. Try cooking the chicken or whatever in a different pan and I bet you won't get sick. Either get some of those liners or get a new crockpot.

[dilettantesteph]

Sympathies for your suffering...somehow, it seems like we largely suffer alone, doesn't it? 

 

I bought wheat-gluten test kits at $15 each, and after screwing up using the first one, read the directions more carefully.

 

I found no cross contamination of gluten in any product that "shared facilities" with a wheat product line.  So before you

give up on an important food, it may be worth a few bucks to test it, and that means you may have other sensitivities or food issues

you can discover or improve on. 

 

I tested three different rice brands from Thailand; no gluten found (wheat gluten, I mean).   Even so, I have now gotten

so doggone nervous I spend the extra few bucks a month and bought certified "gluten free" rice at my local gluten free

store.   Whole foods has been stocking more gluten free products, but my son, looking at their pricing, calls them "Whole Paycheck".

 

Now, finding where corn and corn starch is hidden...that has been a whole other difficulty, and I haven't found a test kit

for sorghum that is reasonably priced, and it's in many wheat-gluten free foods now.    

 

You need to consider the detection limit of the test.  Some are sensitive to lower levels than detectable by home tests.

 

Open Original Shared Link

[Greebo115]

A metal non-stick pot - that means it's some sort of Teflon, right? And you said it's scratched. That IS your source of CC. Gluten hides in those scratches and can't be cleaned out. Any scratched Teflon pans that have ever had gluten in them will CC you. Try cooking the chicken or whatever in a different pan and I bet you won't get sick. Either get some of those liners or get a new crockpot.

hI bartful,

Do you think so even though the pot is quite new, and I got it after going gluten-free? (Did you miss this in the OP, or in your experience do you think that cooking CC'd food is now enough to make it gluteny forever?) - sorry, I just want to be clear and interested in your opinion.

 

In any case, I still don't trust it............ I looked for the liners (can only get them expensively online), so I have bought the regular kind of roasting bags (for the oven) and am going to use those in my crock pot, hopefully that will work just  the same...

I'm thinking that if I just put all my ingredients in the bag, seal the bag and place in the crockpot it'll work.......hope so anyway.

Thanks for the ideas, and I'm feeling, a shade better today.

[bartfull]

I would think if the CC in the beans was enough to make you sick, the CC left in the scratches would be enough to make you sick. I admit I AM super careful to the point of justifiable paranoia,  , but I wouldn't take a chance on it.

[Greebo115]

I would think if the CC in the beans was enough to make you sick, the CC left in the scratches would be enough to make you sick. I admit I AM super careful to the point of justifiable paranoia,  , but I wouldn't take a chance on it.

 

Nope, not paranoia, just a healthy desire not to get sick AGAIN......and we all know what that's like!!! I kept trying to quantify the risk..

Anyway, good, so wasn't losing it yesterday.......just a bit peeved that I've glutened my crockpot and didn't want to believe it yesterday, lol.

 

Off to go look up the price of a new insert, thanks.

[1desperateladysaved]

Super-Sensitive viewpoint:  Hopefully, you don't have to go to this extreme!

How far in did you leave the withdrawal symptoms behind?

OH, I hope you were not 30 years from undeniable symptoms as I was with a similar amount of damage.  I always hoped I had some kind of meter to gage just what my reactions are.  You see I have had many reactions and could not tell when gluten withdrawal ended and accidental contaminations or other intolerances became issues.  My fogginess and fatigue has been gone since I eliminated foods I had antibodies too.  It would be hard for me to distinguish one reaction from another.  I think the trick is to keep on analyzing and figure out what works for you as you go. 

 

You can get ideas here on the forum, but we all are different, and if you eliminate every food that someone doesn't tolerate, I am afraid you would starve. In fact I feel quite sure of it. I am 1 1/2 years gluten free and about 1 year grain free. I went on a rotational diet 6 months back.  At that point my mind cleared and fatigue lessoned, but fogginess eventually returned.  I cut out buckwheat, (which is good for most) , and I have been well since buckwheat withdrawal ended.  That withdrawal lasted several weeks.  Maybe 6.  At which point I eliminated all foods that I had  had antibodies for, and my mind cleared and my energy increased.   If I had a gage, it could tell me whether my improvements were due to eliminating those foods, or buckwheat withdrawal ended.

 

I just realized my above explanation is only diet related, but  a gage would also measure other things I did things to overcome the overwhelming fatigue I experienced.

.  I have taken an aggressive supplement program for 6 years.

.  I have cut out all sweets at that same time.

.  I eat vegetables!

.  I grow vegetables!

.  I take digestive enzymes (This occurred about the same time as I eliminated foods I had antibodies to.)

.  I have avoided artificial flavors and colors for decades.

.  I get sunlight.

.  I balance my proteins, carbs and fats

 

That is why I am not sure how long it took me for gluten withdrawal.  I only know that I am very glad that I have come this way and am experiencing clear mind and stronger body about 1 1/2 years in the gluten process.  I am glad also that I ate a hamburger for the first time in months last Friday with no regrets!  I didn't hardly notice that it was wrapped in lettuce and doused with mango sauce. 

 

D