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Jewel Pancake

Coronavirus more susceptible to celiacs?

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2 minutes ago, Jim Rockford said:

Ask your doctor instead of a bunch of strangers with various degrees of knowledge and panic.

There have always been lots of knee jerk reactions on this board and varying degrees of panic (see eating out threads). 
 

Back to anonymity, and reading not posting. 

Of course. Though as I have stated before: I was, until very recently, a medicinal/basic sciences researcher at the local Medical school. My relevant degrees are in physical and biochemistry. While immune response is not my direct area of specialty, neuropsych and liposome formation are. So I focus on transport and metabolomics.

Cytokine interaction is important, but neural cytokines behave slightly differently from the rest of the body due to a number of small factors (none of which are relevant)

When you read statements by well trusted experts, notice their language specifically talks about the virus, not the disease. This is deliberate and is inline with the statement I made previously and that is acquiring the virus, the celiac status is not an issue. Where they go not comment however is what happens once the Covid virus enters the cell via the ACE2 receptor and solicits a response. At that point the language changes as we have gone from talking about the virus to the disease. The difference is the same difference as HIV and AIDS HIV is the retrovirus, AIDS is the resulting Syndrome (syndromes if you recall are clusters of symptoms, differing from diseases in that a disease is the phenotype aka physical cause) 

we know that celiac disease is the expression of IL15 due to

 

forget it, I am about to launch into a diatribe about alpha, beta, gamma and omega gliadin proteins and it is well beyond the scope of this forum and 90% of you don’t care and the other 10% either already know or can research it themselves 

 

yeah in a bad mood as today I got this: 

6290072A-36C4-4026-AF8C-3A21BAFC3EEC.jpeg

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On 3/12/2020 at 11:41 PM, Jewel Pancake said:

I read that if you have an autoimmune disorder you’re more likely to get this. I was around a lot of people been in and out the er for the past few months my immune system is weak. Because of a vitamin deficiency. I’m really nervous about this not sure if it’s true or not, has anyone else heard this?

Absolutely. As a celiac one must take a multivitamin daily for life to be safer. Celiac for 3 years and ive found that GNC puts out high quality multi that has everything you need.

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1 hour ago, Oceans said:

ive found that GNC puts out high quality multi that has everything you need.

No, no you have not. GNC is infamous for creating bedpan bullets, using the cheapest, and typically least bio available forms of vitamins and minerals in the wrong ratios. Example: magnesium

magnesium oxide has a bioavailability of about 4% 

magnesium citrate is about 62%
 

you literally have to take 14x as much magnesium oxide to get the same amount of magnesium.

magnesium taurate, ororate, Threonate, and carbonate are all even higher bioavailability. And the magnesium to calcium ratio in a supplement should be 2 calcium to 1 magnesium 

you should never take an iron containing anything within 1/2 hour of any other mineral or vitamin other than C

basically GNC may make you feel better, but it is likely placebo or a lightened wallet.

this does not mean you cannot find good supplements at gnc, they are just not manufactured by gnc.

you are better off using someone like vitacost (an online division of Kroger) where you have better selection and pricing 

 

edited to fix autocorrect issues

Edited by RKBrumbelow
Edited to correct autocorrect issues

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On 3/12/2020 at 9:47 PM, cyclinglady said:

Maybe.  Untreated celiacs can be more susceptible to any illness and that probably includes COVID-19.  

Your best bet is remain strictly gluten free.  If you are a newbie, concentrate on non-processed foods if possible.  Look for certified gluten-free products until you master the diet (and it has a steep learning curve).  Do not eat out unless it is a dedicated 100% gluten-free restaurant.  This can be relaxed once you are well and again, have mastered the diet.  Try to get some Vitamin D in your foods (e.g. fatty fish) and some sun when it is warm enough to expose your body a bit (hard to do in winter, I know).  

Follow the CDC recommendations (like washing your hands and social distancing).  😊

All of this is great information, however on the Certified gluten-free- take caution. Even foods labeled “certified” does not mean it is free from all gluten molecules. I am a celiac who can not have even certified brands, as they can still, by law CAN contain 0-20 ppm, and this causes severe reactions for some. I was just glutened from a certified brand.  

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10 hours ago, Ljeannette said:

All of this is great information, however on the Certified gluten-free- take caution. Even foods labeled “certified” does not mean it is free from all gluten molecules. I am a celiac who can not have even certified brands, as they can still, by law CAN contain 0-20 ppm, and this causes severe reactions for some. I was just glutened from a certified brand.  

It is hard to really know if you have had a gluten exposure as symptoms can be attributed to several illnesses.  For example, you could have food poisoning or intestinal flu.  Some celiacs are super sensitive though.    Just look through the DH (Dermatitis Herpetiformis) section of the forum.  Their gluten exposures are very visible.  Most avoid processed foods to prevent a DH outbreak.  

Here is my story for what it is worth.  My husband had been gluten-free 12 years before my diagnosis, so I really knew the diet well.  Within months, my anemia had resolved.  A good sign that I was healing.  But I was getting gluten exposures (or so I thought).  Turns out that I have an intolerance to Xanthan Gum which is found in so many gluten-free processed foods like bread.  My husband, who had healed, could consume Xanthan Gum but not me.  I still have issues with it to this day.  So, consider other food intolerances.

I have had gluten exposures (hidden).  Instead of just anemia, I developed some pretty severe GI upset.  It took me weeks to recover.  Usually, I could not identify the culprit though I had my suspicions.  My GI was nice enough to order a celiac panel, which usually did confirm a gluten exposure.  

Two years ago, I developed a tooth infection, the flu, a cold and had a hidden gluten exposure.  My celiac panel was off the charts.  Months later I was still pretty miserable.  I had developed chronic autoimmune hives.  My GI suggested a repeat endoscopy, but I opted for the Fasano diet (super strict gluten-free diet).  My hives eventually went away but I had GERD like symptoms that would not resolve.  A year after that gluten exposure and tooth infection, I had an endoscopy.  Biopsies revealed a healed small intestine.  But I had a gastric polyp and gastric biopsies found that I had autoimmune gastritis.  It is common with Hashimoto’s (as are hives).  

I learned that not all things are due to celiac disease.  

I do consider myself to be very sensitive.  Those gluten exposures usually cause me to pass out and literally last for weeks and weeks.  I am super careful (never eat out unless it is a dedicated gluten-free restaurant) because that last bout of hives was awful.  Gluten exposures trigger my other autoimmune disorders and allergies.   Everything goes haywire.

I am certainly not discounting your reaction.  We are each unique.  But most certified gluten-free products do not contain any gluten.  No test can measure below 5 ppm, if I recall.  But manufacturing mistakes can occur,  though they rarely do.  (Like Van’s wheat waffles were packaged in gluten-free boxes by mistake a few years ago — google it.)

I hope this helps.  I hope you recover fast!  

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To All,

Here is an article I read today that I thought other Celaic members will/might appreciate...in light of the COVID 19 discussion...

I came across some research that might add to the conversation...(None of it is medical advice) but it makes sense....considering the facts concerning independent risks for Pneumonia in the general population aka Community Acquired Pneumonia (CAP)...

See this detailed article about how Corona virus effects the Lung...

https://www.twincities.com/2020/03/31/what-does-the-coronavirus-do-to-the-body/

The reason I mentioned the CAP (Community Acquired Pneumonia) article is because Low Serum levels are an independent risk regardless of the disease you might have...

Like my Type II diabetes...is not an independent risk unto my Albumin levels get low our my Blood Glucose averages over 250....not all diabetics are at increased risk etc...

Here is why it is important...

1/5 of Celiacs will have low Albumin levels...at diagnosis....

https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(19)30121-1/fulltext

It is this subset of Celiac's who have higher independent risk...

Low Thiamine and Low Magnesium are indicative of Low Albumin levels and will lead to acute respiratory failure(s) in those who develop Refeeding Syndrome...it usually shows up about 4 days in...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19062257

Most nurses don't recognize it...before it is too late...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31847205

here is a study on it for medical professionals...on How to recognize and respond to refeeding syndrome...

https://journals.lww.com/nursingcriticalcare/Pages/articleviewer.aspx?year=2009&issue=05000&article=00005&type=Fulltext

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise...

2 Timothy 2: 7 “Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things” this included.

Posterboy,

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mleh, I think it's already been here - about a month ago, one of my grandkids had a dry cough for like, 2 weeks, no fever.  I gave him cough syrup with cough suppressant and it went away on it's own.  this was before anybody was nervous about covid-19.   didn't think much about it.  a week later, the other 11 year old had a sore throat and a fever.  one of the other kids in his class had tested positive for strep, so I took him to the doc and had him strep tested (negative), doc said he had 'viral pharyngitis' - gave him ibuprofen and hot, soft foods till his fever went (4 days), he went back to school (til it was cancelled. lolz)  I cared closely for both of them and didn't even get a sniffle.  as usual, since I have been gluten free (treated and healed celiac, all my vitamin levels are good except d, which I supplement in the winter months, it's fine in the summer, sunshine, go figure) the germs don't get me.  I do not sterilize my house, but it's clean.  when we went to the doctor, they asked us if we'd been in contact with anybody who'd been to china...….. they have since discovered that it could be community spread.  kid was not tested for the flu of any type, just strep.

ok, science people, is it possible that the virus has come and gone?   the deaths attributed to the seasonal flu could have been covid-19?

disclaimer:  I am not a science person :D 

la la la la laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa…………..   ;) 

day 20 in the houuuussssse 🤪

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I appreciate the use of good sources enormously, do you have a science background involving reading such papers?

For anyone who doesn’t here is an excellent resource on how to read scientific papers:

 https://peterattiamd.com/category/understanding-science/

not all papers are equally valid and we use particular language and words in different ways. It’s like reading your state and local laws. It might be nice if they were in plain English but our usage of terms must be much more precise than standard English allows

also, you have to check for redactions, corrections and peer responses.

i have not read your post, I just noticed the use of sources From ncbi which is where I am published and one of the 3 places I go for research 

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39 minutes ago, Scott Adams said:

I am not a doctor, but I would say it is possible because some kids get very mild symptoms. What would surprise me is that you would not get it, as this coronavirus is very contagious. 

honestly, scott, I haven't picked up anything except one sinus infection in the past 10 years.  everybody got the 'bad flu' last year, even the (big, tough guy) husband was in bed suffering for days, I fully expected to be sick next.  then, nothing.  not complaining!!  I spent years sick with everything when my immune system wasn't working due to untreated/undiagnosed celiac.

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On 4/1/2020 at 11:17 AM, User73474 said:

Kids show some specific symptoms others don’t, but they shed like crazy because of child like behavior. The R0 for kids is over 5 last I read (last night) meaning on average a single child will pass it on to 5 other people 

I am a huge hand-washing advocate?  when they come home from school/anywhere, they know the first thing i'm gonna tell them is:

WASH YOUR HANDS

that being said, lolz, yeah, they're germ factories.  when the coughing 11 (ash Wednesday) wanted to sit next to his favorite church lady, she wanted nothing to do with him, I didn't blame her, and they touch *everything* 

I am curious what the data will show once they can test more people and see who's recovered without knowing they've had it, being as some have zero symptoms.

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On 4/1/2020 at 11:14 AM, User73474 said:

I appreciate the use of good sources enormously, do you have a science background involving reading such papers?

For anyone who doesn’t here is an excellent resource on how to read scientific papers:

 https://peterattiamd.com/category/understanding-science/

not all papers are equally valid and we use particular language and words in different ways. It’s like reading your state and local laws. It might be nice if they were in plain English but our usage of terms must be much more precise than standard English allows

also, you have to check for redactions, corrections and peer responses.

i have not read your post, I just noticed the use of sources From ncbi which is where I am published and one of the 3 places I go for research 

User73474,

I just read a lot on nutrition....because I had a lot of nutrition related problems when I was diagnosed....

I like to quote where the information was first published so others can read it for themselves...

Here is the article on Community Acquired Pneumonia (CAP) quoted in another thread...

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S016344531200388X

I should also mention that Vitamin D levels are important too and can exhibit an antiviral effect on respiratory infections...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20067648

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3308600/

Vitamin D levels have been known/shown to help regulate our immune systems....

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20427238

Most people respiratory infection rates increase when the OHD get's below 20 as a general rule.

The last time I had Pneumonia from riding the bus....It was probably that low or below that number....

Certainly anecdotal but I don't think accidental...and I had low Albumin levels too!

A tough one two punch....if you have an auto-immune disease already....but I survived!

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise.

Posterboy,

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User73474,

As for your Science point...you just have to read the discussion section...if you want the knitty gritty details...

then compare and analysis...go through an iteration of that data...and add too it or change your opinions, ideas and models if necessary...

Abstracts over generalize...read the full paper when (if) you have time....

see this "Vitamin D and the Viral State" article/research...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3308600/

this study said people had a 50+ percentage higher infection rate of those with Vitamin D levels below 10 OHD…and those even as high as 16 OHD can increase your chance of respiratory tract infections...

And the very next statement (IMO) contradict that finding of the data...

Saying quoting...

“Again, this suggests that if a patient is not vitamin D deficient, there is limited anti-viral benefit gained from supplementation.”

Which just amazes me….a 50+ percent increase risk of respiratory infection …but they say there is “Limited” benefit….

Depends on if you are the patient or the doctor/physician determines your perspective…

Just my two cents worth....

I hope this is helpful but it is not medical advise.

Posterboy,

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On 3/12/2020 at 11:41 PM, Jewel Pancake said:

I read that if you have an autoimmune disorder you’re more likely to get this. I was around a lot of people been in and out the er for the past few months my immune system is weak. Because of a vitamin deficiency. I’m really nervous about this not sure if it’s true or not, has anyone else heard this?

Had a call with my gastro. because the office closed. I have other things going on too and she assured me I was not at a higher risk. I've been gluten-free for a few months. From what I can tell if you're on a strict gluten-free diet then you're okay. 

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On 4/1/2020 at 2:52 PM, notme! said:

honestly, scott, I haven't picked up anything except one sinus infection in the past 10 years.  everybody got the 'bad flu' last year, even the (big, tough guy) husband was in bed suffering for days, I fully expected to be sick next.  then, nothing.  not complaining!!  I spent years sick with everything when my immune system wasn't working due to untreated/undiagnosed celiac.

I agree, notme.  The only illness I have had in recent years was norovirus and I got it from close contact with my mother-in-law before she was symptomatic. Honestly, the virus was nothing compared to the week I hit the wall with undiagnosed Celiac.  Nothing will ever be that bad.

I am being careful now because I just don't want to be sick.  I have never had pneumonia in my life so do not think I am at increased risk for it, regardless of being Celiac.  I was seriously exposed to the regular flu last year by my co-workers, who all got the flu.  I never got it.  I do not get flu shots, they do, and they were not happy that I escaped the virus without a flu shot and they all got it and were vaccinated.  They missed on the flu virus last year so they got the strain that was not covered by the shot.

Just wash your hands well and eat healthy.  That goes a long way to boosting your immune system.

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amen to that, gemini - I was looking up good sources for naturally occurring zinc (from foods) and discovered that I am already eating most of the suggested things that are high in zinc.  they say zinc will help ward it off if you are exposed?  mleh, can't hurt, lolz

I haven't gotten any flu shots.  ever.  I don't feel one way or another about them, just never got one?

I do not want to get sick because, so far, they will give you a zpack, the gut biome destroyer.  it took me a really long time to get my guts repopulated - because I have had pneumonia many times, and that was the magic bullet to get rid of the lung infection, along with all your happy gut bugs :( so, upon my life saving diagnosis, my guts were depleted of good bacteria.  100,000 doses of probiotics, lactofermented kraut, yogurt, etc, I feel like my guts are pretty well populated.  I don't even take digestive enzymes anymore.

I also feel younger than I did 10 years ago - and i'm ordering some wonder woman magic bracelets from amazon dot com, just to hedge ma bets ;) maybe wear my lucky socks :D 

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Hi all,

Recently, I started to feel a little sick after spending some time in a grocery store and a health food

store. I woke up next morning with both a big headache (which I never get) and a dry cough.

Both of these are symptoms of Covid. However, my landlord just painted the entryway and of course, there were paint fumes. I opened the windows and he taped the door shut properly and those symptoms went away, but different symptoms appeared. Rather than debate any longer I isolated myself just to be sure and called my medical clinic (here in Canada) and we did a phone evaluation. I too had assumed I was at risk, because I have Celiac and assumed all along that it was an immuno compromised disorder and I was at risk. Well the doctor told me I wasn't, just as the doc in the video. So it's best to just call a doctor if you're not feeling well. The only thing that could happen is you might become susceptible if you eat a big dose of wheat AND get infected. Again, call the doctor. In the meantime. Yes, vitamins could help. Even after I eliminated Gluten, my stomach and immune system weren't strong. But as soon as I added 3000IU of vitamin D daily and a good multivitamin I rarely get colds & flu anymore. So this could be a good idea. I also take a low dose iron pill (because I'm thin and I noticed I feel the cold weather less with it) and now  500IU of vitamin C at the same time (since they help each other get absorbed in your body). Best on an empty stomach. I also added probiotics several years ago, which greatly helped my recovery. I use only New Roots, Natural Factors, Vega and Garden of Life (Dr. Formulated probiotics w/50 Billion enzymes, multiple strains) since I read these companies use quality ingredients, but I could be wrong. These vitamins may not be necessary on a continual basis, but if you live in a Northern country with less sunshine and and cold weather they might help boost your immune system. In the meantime, if you're really worried, don't meet with friends take the bus/subway etc. and stay home and talk online. Good luck and best of health all.

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