Is Gluten Dangerous To All People?

[Dev]

If it was dangerous to one person wouldn't it be dangerous to all people? Like, take arsenic or mercury or botulism for example: these are toxic to all people. Why do some people have problems with gluten and others do not? Is there an explanation for this? Also, do the symptoms of celiac disease have to be gastrointestinal - related? Is gluten toxic?

[Kassie]

Well do u mean like dangerous to all people with celiac or just everyone with or without celiac. yes it is dangerous for everyone who has celiac because it damages us but that is because we have an intolerance. everyone else it is not dangerous for. just put it this way compare it to a peanut allergy- those who have it, it is really dangerouse and could cause an anniplatic reaction and they could die so its dangerous for them, but me i can eat peanuts and i don't have any reactions and they are actually good for me and supply protein and stuff. i don't know if this makes any sense but yah i am sure some one else will explain it better

~Kassie~

[tarnalberry]

It is only a problem for someone with celiac, because a person with celiac has a genetic mutation that causes the body to attack itself in the presence of gluten. Not everyone has the genetics for this.

[Carriefaith]

Gluten is dangerous to people with celiac disease. When someone with celiac disease ingests it, the body produced antibodies which attack the small intestinal villi. When the villi are damaged, nutrients are not properly absorbed and nutritional deficiencies may occur.

[Dev]

Well, I don't think I have it then. Both my parents can eat bread and pretzels and stuff like that just fine so I am guessing that I don't have that. A long time ago I was basically starving myself (I had an eating disorder back then) and would only eat fruits and vegetables. I did this for about a month. Now I am on a pretty balanced diet with all food groups but back when I first started eating pretzels and stuff I started getting a stomach ache but that doesn't happen anymore. Organic whole wheat yeast-free bread doesn't seem to bother me at all, though. The reason I brought up arsenic is because it was in the water I was drinking for a while as well. So, pretty much, I'm surprised I didn't die then... was eating just fruits and vegetables and drinking arsenic water. I am feeling better every day, and I doubt I am actually allergic to any food item. I'll have days where I don't feel good at all and other days where I feel really good, like 80% of my old self basically. Is it possible I am just recovering from starvation/arsenic poisoning and not a food allergy?

For people without celiac disease how is gluten treated by the body? Is it like cellulose where it is indigestable and disposed of as waste or does it actually get digested? It 100% definitely isn't dangerous to eat wheat for people that aren't allergic/intolerant to it, right? FYI as I write this I have no digestive problems (as far as I can feel anyways), no depression, or any other ailments, so I'm hoping this is the case.

[lonewolf]

I guess I disagree that gluten is only bad for people with Celiac. I, supposedly, can't be Celiac because I don't have the Celiac genes. My kids have all been tested, came back negative, but two of them have had dramatic results with the diet. One of them has been gene tested and doesn't have the genes either.

The authors of "Dangerous Grains" are of the opinion that gluten really isn't good for most people. Even here people talk about how gluten can be hard to digest for everyone. Maybe that should be telling us something!

If anyone feels better off gluten, then they should probably stay off of it, whether they're diagnosed with Celiac or not.

If gluten doesn't bother you, then there's probably no reason to avoid it. But don't think that because your parents don't have Celiac or Gluten Intolerance that you can't have it. (It's genetic, but not everyone with the genes develops Celiac or an intolerance.)

[Dev]

I guess I disagree that gluten is only bad for people with Celiac. I, supposedly, can't be Celiac because I don't have the Celiac genes. My kids have all been tested, came back negative, but two of them have had dramatic results with the diet. One of them has been gene tested and doesn't have the genes either.

The authors of "Dangerous Grains" are of the opinion that gluten really isn't good for most people. Even here people talk about how gluten can be hard to digest for everyone. Maybe that should be telling us something!

If anyone feels better off gluten, then they should probably stay off of it, whether they're diagnosed with Celiac or not.

If gluten doesn't bother you, then there's probably no reason to avoid it. But don't think that because your parents don't have Celiac or Gluten Intolerance that you can't have it. (It's genetic, but not everyone with the genes develops Celiac or an intolerance.)

I remember I tried a gluten-free diet once and I got a bad headache until I ate bread - is this a sign that I am NOT celiac? I am pretty much a paranoid hypochondriac, so I always get worried about these types of things even though there is pretty much virtually nothing wrong with me.

[Michi8]

I remember I tried a gluten-free diet once and I got a bad headache until I ate bread - is this a sign that I am NOT celiac? I am pretty much a paranoid hypochondriac, so I always get worried about these types of things even though there is pretty much virtually nothing wrong with me.

The headache could have been a symptom of withdrawl. It can take a while for your body to get used to being gluten free, even if you are celiac or gluten intolerant.

Michelle

[tarnalberry]

Just because your parents don't have it (or don't have obvious symtpoms) does NOT mean you don't have it. It much be triggered, as well as having the genes - and they haven't identified all the genes that cause celiac just yet.

[2Boys4Me]

Well, I don't think I have it then. Both my parents can eat bread and pretzels and stuff like that just fine so I am guessing that I don't have that.

My 7 year old is the only one in our family with Celiac. Neither I, my husband, nor older son have celiac, yet my younger son had both positve bloodwork and positive biopsy.

Perhaps you should have further testing or see how you feel when you eliminate gluten from your diet.

[Dev]

Well, I did an experiment. I went without gluten/wheat for about like 6 hours (I ate rice, corn, fruit, and other things) and then I ate like 4 slices of bread (I buy the highest quality bread available though) and it actually gave me energy and it didn't hurt my stomach or cause problems or anything.

I guess that is a sign I am not gluten intolerant. Granted, I do buy yeast-free bread; sometimes I do stomach aches from eating YEAST pretzels, etc. so could it be possible I am allergic to yeast? IDK I will keep you all posted. I guess intolerances are whenever you get stomach aches or w/e from foods right? Or is it more complex than that?

[tarnalberry]

You can have issues with yeast, but being gluten-free for 6 hours, and then eating gluten, will tell you absolutely nothing. You may need to be gluten-free for 6 WEEKS and then challenge with gluten before you could tell.

[Dev]

You can have issues with yeast, but being gluten-free for 6 hours, and then eating gluten, will tell you absolutely nothing. You may need to be gluten-free for 6 WEEKS and then challenge with gluten before you could tell.

But if I was why would it give me energy though? Did wheat give you all energy when you ate it or did it make you sick the instant after you ate it? That's what I don't understand. Can you give me the symptoms you have when you eat something with gluten? What are the food items (specific brands if you can) that gave you problems? Are you on a low-card diet? Do you eat rice, corn, and all that?

So far, from what I've gathered, a. gluten is only dangerous to people with the genes that cannot tolerate it, b. gluten is hard to digest especially for celiacs, and c. celiacs can eat rice, potatoes, oats, corn, and stuff like that, and d. yeast can cause allergies

[Carriefaith]

But if I was why would it give me energy though? Did wheat give you all energy when you ate it or did it make you sick the instant after you ate it? That's what I don't understand. Can you give me the symptoms you have when you eat something with gluten? What are the food items (specific brands if you can) that gave you problems? Are you on a low-card diet? Do you eat rice, corn, and all that?

Some people with celiac disease do not have any symptoms at all, but they still have intestinal damage. The best thing to do if you want to know if you have celiac disease is to have a blood test and/or an intestinal biopsy. You can also get gene testing done.

[tarnalberry]

But if I was why would it give me energy though? Did wheat give you all energy when you ate it or did it make you sick the instant after you ate it? That's what I don't understand. Can you give me the symptoms you have when you eat something with gluten? What are the food items (specific brands if you can) that gave you problems? Are you on a low-card diet? Do you eat rice, corn, and all that?

Because you absorbed at least a good portion of the sugar that the carbs were converted to - which translates directly to energy, particularly if you hadn't eaten enough earlier in the day.

People with celiac react differently to gluten. These days, I have a delayed reaction, and don't know until at least four hours later, as my intestines start hurting. Some people know right away. Some people don't know for a day or two. Some people get no obvious symptoms, but do have intestinal damage. And many of the symptoms are not intestinal - some people just get very tired and achey.

What gave me problems? Things with wheat and oats; I never ate barley or rye much, so I couldn't point to those myself. Bread, bagels, pasta, oatmeal, etc. But I ate it so often - at least once a day - that I always felt a bit sick, and got used to not feeling well, and thought that it was normal. It wasn't until I went gluten free that I realize that what I was feeling that I thought was normal was *not* normal.

I'm not low carb at all. The only foods that I avoid are wheat, barley, rye, and oats (and dairy, but that's a separate intolerance). If I want carbs, I'll eat potatoes, sweet potatoes, rice, sometimes corn, millet, quinoa, amaranth, apples, bananas, orange juice, buckwheat, lentils, beans, etc.

[Kibbie]

If it was dangerous to one person wouldn't it be dangerous to all people? Like, take arsenic or mercury or botulism for example: these are toxic to all people. Why do some people have problems with gluten and others do not? Is there an explanation for this? Also, do the symptoms of celiac disease have to be gastrointestinal - related? Is gluten toxic?

Okay so I'm not a teen but I am a teacher so sometimes I check out these boards to see whats going on! My daughter (21 months old) has celiac anyhow... here is the scoop on Gluten and what it does

What gluten does to everyone with or with out Celiac:

It causes our bodies to produce an excess amount of zonulin. (A protein found in our small intestine that basically works as a doorman allowing the nutrients of our food to pass into the bloodstream) You heard me right.. EVERY person on earth produces too much zonulin when they eat gluten! Having too much zonulin opens so many ..doors.. that toxins (gluten fragments and other things) get into our blood stream that normally wouldn't have been allowed in.

Now its not necessarily a bad thing for more toxins to be in the blood stream, when someone says they need to detox their bodies they want all the extra toxins in their bloodstream so that they can get it out of their body. The Buddhists actually use gluten for this purpose and are completely healthy.

What happens differently to a person with Celiac:

Their body reacts differently to the gluten fragments in their blood stream. Their body sees these gluten fragments as invaders and it launches and attack against them.. the problem is the body also attacks itself (the autoimmune part of this Celiac) and produces antibodies that react against normal, healthy tissue too and not just the gluten.

The body attacks the villi (the little finger things on our intestines that help absorb nutrients) on the lining of the small intestine causing them to flatten. When they are flattened they are no longer able to absorb nutrients from food.

So the only difference between a Celiac and non Celiac when it comes to gluten is that if you don't have Celiac your body doesn't attack itself! If you do for some reason your body decides to attack itself. Crazy hu?

The good news is that there are lots of things called "autoimmune disorders" in the world and they can be very bad. Celiac Disease is one of the few that we actually know the cause which means its one that we as parents and people with Celiac Disease can control instead of it controlling us!

[MGoers37]

Just because your parents don't have it (or don't have obvious symtpoms) does NOT mean you don't have it. It much be triggered, as well as having the genes - and they haven't identified all the genes that cause celiac just yet.

This is very true, i was diagnosed with the Dermatitis herpetimorfis(i spell it differently every time) and no-one in my immediate family has it, or any wheat allergies. The only person in my family with wheat allergies is my aunt, of which is a Major Hypochondriac, so it's probably "self diagnosed".

on another note, where do you get tested for the actual genes? I was just tested for the antibodies, which they found so i assume i have the genes as well. I've heard that there's a lot of research being done in the field of gene therapy, so if that becomes a reliable medicine we could all be cured .

[darlindeb25]

I tend to agree with Liz (lonewolf). I too have to wonder if gluten is good for anyone. I remember my mom often saying, "Milk is for baby calves and corn is for fattening hogs!" I can no longer have corn and as I research, I am finding corn is a problem for many as is dairy. There may be some truth in what my mom says.

Cavemen didn't have gluten to deal with and we have never heard of celiac cavemen! Of course, do not say anything to that caveman on tv, he seems a bit testy these days!

In my research, I have read they are finding celiac disease on the increase in the underprivileged country's where we are sending foods to, and what do we send, wheat flour, breads, etc. I often tell people that grains are for feeding animals. Even then, there is a vet on another forum who has found celiac disease in dogs. So, is gluten a problem for everyone? I have to wonder.

[happygirl]

Sorry to get slightly off topic here:

Kibbie:

I appreciated your explanation but wanted to clarify one point.

"It causes our bodies to produce an excess amount of zonulin. (A protein found in our small intestine that basically works as a doorman allowing the nutrients of our food to pass into the bloodstream) You heard me right.. EVERY person on earth produces too much zonulin when they eat gluten! Having too much zonulin opens so many ..doors.. that toxins (gluten fragments and other things) get into our blood stream that normally wouldn't have been allowed in. "

However, non-Celiacs do not produce the level of zonulin that Celiacs do. So even if we all produce some zonulin, the non-Celiacs of the world do not produce it in the high, excess levels that Celiacs do. I attended a presentation by Dr. Blake Paterson, president of Alba Therapeutics (the ones who are working with Dr. Fasano on the AT-1001 drug that deals with zonulin and Celiac). He showed us slides of the overexpression of zonulin in Celiacs vs. non Celiacs, and the difference was dramatic. Fruther, they are finding that the overexpression of zonulin occurs in Type 1 Diabetes patients, as well.

Their drug (still in clinical trials, but showing promising reports) stops the overproduction of zonulin (thereby, stopping the gates from opening repeatedly).

Your daughter is very lucky to have a mother like you who is so knowledgable about Celiac :) (I'm also lucky to have a mom who "gets" Celiac and reads the research, etc.....and let me tell you, it means the world to me and makes such a big difference)

Laura

[jerseyangel]

Sorry to get slightly off topic here:

Kibbie:

I appreciated your explanation but wanted to clarify one point.

"It causes our bodies to produce an excess amount of zonulin. (A protein found in our small intestine that basically works as a doorman allowing the nutrients of our food to pass into the bloodstream) You heard me right.. EVERY person on earth produces too much zonulin when they eat gluten! Having too much zonulin opens so many ..doors.. that toxins (gluten fragments and other things) get into our blood stream that normally wouldn't have been allowed in. "

However, non-Celiacs do not produce the level of zonulin that Celiacs do. So even if we all produce some zonulin, the non-Celiacs of the world do not produce it in the high, excess levels that Celiacs do. I attended a presentation by Dr. Blake Paterson, president of Alba Therapeutics (the ones who are working with Dr. Fasano on the AT-1001 drug that deals with zonulin and Celiac). He showed us slides of the overexpression of zonulin in Celiacs vs. non Celiacs, and the difference was dramatic. Fruther, they are finding that the overexpression of zonulin occurs in Type 1 Diabetes patients, as well.

Their drug (still in clinical trials, but showing promising reports) stops the overproduction of zonulin (thereby, stopping the gates from opening repeatedly).

Your daughter is very lucky to have a mother like you who is so knowledgable about Celiac :) (I'm also lucky to have a mom who "gets" Celiac and reads the research, etc.....and let me tell you, it means the world to me and makes such a big difference)

Laura

Laura,

Thank you--that was very interesting. I've never heard it explained that way--and being able to actually see slides of the zonulin in Celiac vs. non Celiac must have been fascinating.

[Liz92]

I'm putting in my 2 cents, hope it snot too late. This is important. If you are Celiac, sometimes when you go back to eating gluten you only get noticeable symptoms for a while, but it still is bad for you. Another thing, neither of your parents need to be celiac for you to be celiac. You don't even need the Celiac gene in your family to be celiac.

The gene for

* thyroid disease

* systemic lupus erythematosus

* type 1 diabetes

* liver disease

* collagen vascular disease

* rheumatoid arthritis

* Sj

[Liz92]

I found this on a celiac website and I thought it was interesting. Gluten, when completely unprocessed, hyberbread(excuse the spellin) or genetically odified is lots less toxic... neat.

[hathor]

on another note, where do you get tested for the actual genes?

Enterolab does this. You swab the inside of your cheeks and ship the swabs back to the company.

At least according to some of the sites I've been researching, there is also a thing called "non-celiac gluten sensitivity" which is far more common. How common? I've seen estimates from 10 to 30% of the population, but no one explains how they come up with their figures. At least in the web sites I saw before I got tired of playing around with Google ...

Really any questions like those in the original post can be answered by looking at the resources here or by googling and reading what you find. For instance, here is one site I found when I first started researching: Open Original Shared Link

An article with interesting hypotheses about the development and geographic distribution of celiac disease: https://www.celiac.com/st_prod.html?p_prodi...-30107084422.1a